...weak kneed wussy? - Hepcat

Follow Ups Full Thread

Topic - Mcintosh lawyer harassing me - What should I do? - Ethannnn 07:12:05 02/23/04 (253)

To those who disagree with me - Ethannnn 06:22:07 02/25/04 (4)

It's not that I agree or disagree, I hjust don't understand... - slope 08:41:19 02/25/04 (3)

Re: It's not that I agree or disagree, I hjust don't understand... - Ethannnn 08:55:35 02/25/04 (2)

Re: It's not that I agree or disagree, I hjust don't understand... - Don T 09:19:55 02/25/04 (0)

Re: It's not that I agree or disagree, I hjust don't understand... - slope 09:10:46 02/25/04 (0)

Kudos to Don T. - lochrider 05:45:23 02/25/04 (2)

Re: Kudos to Don T. - Ethannnn 06:05:32 02/25/04 (1)

Apology - Ethannnn 06:14:37 02/25/04 (1)

Just re-post the add worded as follows: - max-greece 05:00:42 02/25/04 (0)

FWIW from the McIntosh site... - slope 03:58:11 02/25/04 (0)

Re: Mcintosh lawyer harassing me - What should I do? - Loki 02:43:07 02/25/04 (0)

You should be asking what you should have done. - Mark-W 22:38:34 02/24/04 (5)

I agree with you 100%. - KeneallyFan 08:18:27 02/25/04 (0)

Re: You should be asking what you should have done. - slope 03:24:03 02/25/04 (3)

I see your point, but... - Mark-W 09:01:16 02/25/04 (2)

Re: I see your point, but... - slope 09:41:22 02/25/04 (1)

Re: I see your point, but... - Mark-W 11:26:52 02/25/04 (0)

This thread should make it real hard to sell those amps. - tom1356 20:50:04 02/24/04 (0)

every time i was ripped off on e-bay, they never went and got the other guy for me. - zuki 12:58:33 02/24/04 (0)

Re: Mcintosh lawyer harassing me - What should I do? - Don T 09:28:49 02/24/04 (22)

"Obviously they felt your ad did not make it clear..." - Tom 13:45:34 02/24/04 (2)

Re: "Obviously they felt your ad did not make it clear..." - Don T 21:05:36 02/24/04 (1)

"Why the hell else would they ask him to modify his ad..." - Tom 06:52:53 02/25/04 (0)

Re: Mcintosh lawyer harassing me - What should I do? - Dr. Draz 09:42:22 02/24/04 (18)

Re: Mcintosh lawyer harassing me - What should I do? - Ethannnn 10:59:01 02/24/04 (5)

You are also... - Don T 13:36:48 02/24/04 (4)

Re: You are also... - Ethannnn 14:33:59 02/24/04 (3)

Re: You are also... - Don T 15:03:29 02/24/04 (2)

Re: You are also... - Ethannnn 15:07:45 02/24/04 (1)

Come to think of it.... - Don T 21:38:12 02/24/04 (1)

Re: Mcintosh lawyer harassing me - What should I do? - Don T 09:57:08 02/24/04 (11)

ever heard of caveat emptor - theaudiohobby 11:26:20 02/24/04 (0)

You want to protect the stupid from making bad audio choices? - tom1356 11:04:48 02/24/04 (0)

what Mac should do IMO.... - NonA 08:51:23 02/24/04 (0)

Re: Mcintosh lawyer harassing me - What should I do? - Bruce from DC 08:07:40 02/24/04 (0)

As a business litigator with IP experience ... - lochrider 07:47:02 02/24/04 (2)

I recommend a call to the marketing manager at MacIntosh... - Jim Stoneburner 17:54:46 02/24/04 (0)

Thank you! - Terry 13:37:11 02/24/04 (0)

I can't help but ask 1) When you purchased the amps, you - audiogatorjim 07:43:26 02/24/04 (5)

Re: I can't help but ask 1) When you purchased the amps, you - Dr. Draz 07:52:00 02/24/04 (4)

how about; "by ommission materially misrepresenting any salient aspects of the sale"? nt - Duilawyer 18:56:04 02/24/04 (1)

They don't have any right to force him to put anything in an - audiogatorjim 09:03:44 02/24/04 (2)

Re: They don't have any right to force him to put anything in an - theaudiohobby 11:30:22 02/24/04 (1)

Clearly, Mc was in the wrong in this instance. But, do they - audiogatorjim 14:16:44 02/24/04 (0)

I can't help but wonder... - Duke 23:03:59 02/23/04 (4)

Re: I can't help but wonder... - Chuck Y 08:05:10 02/24/04 (1)

Re: I can't help but wonder... - Duke 17:45:00 02/24/04 (0)

Great advice, Duke, from a legal and moral view.. - Duilawyer 06:47:53 02/24/04 (1)

Thanks, Duilawyer. And what you said here... - Duke 21:03:35 02/24/04 (0)

Their rwebsite asks for comments; how about we let em know? - Duilawyer 22:15:30 02/23/04 (0)

If you provide poor service, they'll tell ten people - driver 21:16:47 02/23/04 (8)

Re: If you provide poor service, they'll tell ten people - Ivan303 06:08:38 02/24/04 (5)

I doubt that...If word got out that Mc had made an attempt to influence AA's content.. - Methos 10:48:57 02/24/04 (4)

If Rod gets a call... - Ivan303 12:29:46 02/24/04 (3)

...and 204 (ok, maybe not quite that many) posters will ask why...and draw their own conclusions if no explanation... - Methos 12:40:14 02/24/04 (2)

In a week the thread is on page 2... - Ivan303 14:27:41 02/24/04 (1)

No doubt, once it's in the archives few will miss it...but by then almost all the damage to Mc has already occurred. nt - Methos 15:08:07 02/24/04 (0)

Thiel: Where the customer is always right. - Duilawyer 22:09:03 02/23/04 (0)

Oh no! They're MONSTER MASKS!!!!! - Jack Seaton 21:45:20 02/23/04 (0)

McIntosh Website quotes.... - toledo 21:04:17 02/23/04 (1)

McIntosh = Bose! ...buncha ASSWIPES!! (nt) - Otis W 20:54:22 02/23/04 (0)

Re: Mcintosh lawyer harassing me - What should I do? - DaveV 20:32:59 02/23/04 (0)

Thanks for sharing... - geof 20:31:25 02/23/04 (0)

Hmmm, I wonder if ethannnn's original post will rank as receiving the highest number of responses. nt - DannyB 19:47:24 02/23/04 (3)

I Recollect That I Had One That Went To 229 Responses [nt] - Dr. Draz 06:09:17 02/24/04 (1)

Jealous, Draz? (nt) - Gregg 06:21:07 02/24/04 (1)

I doubt it - driver 21:57:40 02/23/04 (0)

What I think is critical is that we get an accurate and final disposition on this matter because.... - DannyB 19:26:17 02/23/04 (0)

As a lawyer, and someone who went through this, the key is - Duilawyer 18:30:39 02/23/04 (9)

Nice job Dui! - Gregg 06:25:38 02/24/04 (3)

Didn't get banned from outside. - Duilawyer 06:52:09 02/24/04 (2)

Thanks again for your insight - Gregg 07:22:05 02/24/04 (1)

De nada' nt - Duilawyer 13:06:41 02/24/04 (0)

Don't forget Digital and DVDAudiobahn! - Chris Garrett 19:34:28 02/23/04 (4)

How about a private reply to my private posts? - Duilawyer 19:39:40 02/23/04 (3)

Fire away.... - Chris Garrett 20:59:56 02/23/04 (2)

I haven't sent anything! I thought the comment button was going to you. nt - Duilawyer 06:54:54 02/24/04 (1)

It does.... - Chris Garrett 11:41:08 02/24/04 (0)

What's interesting to me is - Doublej 18:16:23 02/23/04 (0)

Has anyone emailed McIntosh to verify any of this? - bwhite 17:57:33 02/23/04 (0)

Imagine charging your new customers so much that you can afford to pay a lawyer to harrass your old customers. - tom1356 17:46:07 02/23/04 (1)

Imagine buying amps like this and then selling them 2 wks later at a loss. - Gentry 17:51:40 02/23/04 (0)

Public Relations Nightmare - Gregg 17:13:28 02/23/04 (2)

Amen. And the longer this thread goes, the more foolish Mc - Duilawyer 07:02:30 02/24/04 (0)

Re: Public Relations Nightmare - Ivan303 17:51:15 02/23/04 (0)

When you are all done freaking, I'll take your Mac gear 10 cents on the buck. - Tromatic 17:08:45 02/23/04 (1)

:-) (nt) - racerguy 17:28:03 02/23/04 (0)

Glad I went with Bryston (nt) - Corndog71 17:02:40 02/23/04 (0)

That a--hole lawyer must have needed... - Tom 15:00:25 02/23/04 (15)

You are way off. Lawyers don't invent work. - Duilawyer 18:16:44 02/23/04 (14)

Disagree strongly based on personal experience... - Charles Hansen 20:28:33 02/23/04 (13)

Dui's right here - PabloP 22:23:26 02/23/04 (4)

Not so sure that I agree... - Charles Hansen 08:14:10 02/24/04 (2)

Your story does not contradict my point-read it carefully - Duilawyer 15:59:29 02/24/04 (0)

Well, in fairness - PabloP 09:27:43 02/24/04 (0)

McIntosh has very deep pockets as they are owned by D&M Holdings... - bhvf 04:37:50 02/24/04 (0)

I accept your offer to bet; 1 years subscription to AA? - Duilawyer 20:53:56 02/23/04 (5)

Interesting way to twist my words... - Charles Hansen 21:50:57 02/23/04 (4)

Re: twistin' the night away - Bruce from DC 14:47:26 02/24/04 (3)

Bad math... - Charles Hansen 18:58:00 02/24/04 (1)

Re: I was terrible at math . . . - Bruce from DC 06:03:29 02/25/04 (0)

Re: twistin' the night away - Rini 14:58:26 02/24/04 (0)

You actaully are agreeing; the attorney did not pick you out - Duilawyer 20:46:59 02/23/04 (1)

Here is another example of a law firm... - Charles Hansen 22:00:02 02/23/04 (0)

Re: Mcintosh lawyer harassing me - What should I do? - Hirsch 14:35:35 02/23/04 (2)

And state law may preempt McInt's slipperiness. - Duilawyer 18:51:30 02/23/04 (1)

Re: And state law may preempt McInt's slipperiness. - Hirsch 19:45:36 02/24/04 (0)

The following is the response by Mr. Cooper to inquiries by another Inmate and myself ... - Neil49 14:23:43 02/23/04 (31)

A few corrections - Ethannnn 18:07:43 02/23/04 (0)

"First we kill the lawyers" - old fatboy 15:56:12 02/23/04 (2)

You kill the lawyers to promote anarchy - dvb 17:40:43 02/23/04 (1)

Re: You kill the lawyers to promote anarchy - middleground 05:58:46 02/24/04 (0)

What's really funny - koop 15:37:05 02/23/04 (5)

Section 43 = 15 USC 1125 (" . . . false descriptions forbidden") - Mark B. James 15:55:04 02/23/04 (4)

I Utterly fail To See Where And How, In Any Way, Ethan's Attempted Sale Violates This!... - Dr. Draz 16:04:12 02/23/04 (3)

You owe me an apology. - Mark B. James 12:05:59 02/24/04 (1)

The ad does not make clear that the unit is used, and out of warranty. nt - Duilawyer 18:47:49 02/23/04 (1)

It Says "TWO WEEKS OLD"... - Dr. Draz 06:30:38 02/24/04 (0)

Lanham Trademark Act?? - bwhite 15:30:48 02/23/04 (1)

We're all going to jail : ) nt - Budrew 16:39:44 02/23/04 (0)

How many AA members would now recommend McIntosh to their friends? - Double Trouble 15:25:45 02/23/04 (1)

Re: The following is the response by Mr. Cooper to inquiries by another Inmate and myself ... - Ivan303 15:20:43 02/23/04 (2)

Memo to Coop: - Tom 15:42:19 02/23/04 (1)

Imagien how much $$ it would be worth for Mc to abandon that policy? - Duilawyer 19:31:48 02/23/04 (0)

What a load of legalistic crap! - Rick W 15:14:22 02/23/04 (0)

I could accept most of the response, but the explanation of non-transferral of warranty was downright silly... - Methos 15:05:56 02/23/04 (4)

And I have no idea what work would definitely sound - Duilawyer 19:34:01 02/23/04 (3)

That's what I thought you were saying, on HRH. nt :-) - Methos 19:57:43 02/23/04 (2)

You wuz,and iz, right.. nt - Duilawyer 20:54:50 02/23/04 (1)

Doesn't that lead to the conclusion that you believe that no SACDs should have been released? nt - Methos 08:24:32 02/24/04 (0)

You Have Some Chutspa !!!... - Dr. Draz 15:05:22 02/23/04 (4)

Chutzpa with a z; and I BOUGHT new McIntosh - Duilawyer 19:44:08 02/23/04 (1)

Re: Chutzpa with a z; and I BOUGHT new McIntosh - Ethannnn 07:11:16 02/24/04 (0)

I never thought I would say this but ditto Dr. Draz nt - Norm 17:06:17 02/23/04 (1)

Re: I never thought I would say this but ditto Dr. Draz nt - Dr. Draz 18:02:36 02/23/04 (0)

I guess that there's only one response to all that, Neil - - Todd A. 14:41:01 02/23/04 (1)

Ooooh, Yeah Baby, Yeah! Shagariffic! nt - subcoolman 16:23:55 02/23/04 (0)

But the biggest reason for not transferring warranty - Terry 14:35:04 02/23/04 (0)

Re: The following is the response by Mr. Cooper to inquiries by another Inmate and myself ... - uw312@aol.com 14:34:54 02/23/04 (0)

You send up warning flags to manufacturers by the amount of sales you have made. - Edp 12:53:47 02/23/04 (5)

youve gota love US sales law and protectionism - chris_w 14:30:59 02/23/04 (1)

Well...at least... - Tom 15:52:19 02/23/04 (0)

His A'gon feedback includes a number of BUYS, not just sales. nt - Rick W 13:45:02 02/23/04 (0)

Re: You send up warning flags to manufacturers by the amount of sales you have made. - Budrew 13:30:31 02/23/04 (1)

He could also be a millionaire... - RGA 14:17:32 02/23/04 (0)

tortious interference of contract - koop 12:52:44 02/23/04 (0)

Not that McIntosh's or Ebay's name was very good before, but this is bullying by both - Norm 12:44:23 02/23/04 (4)

McIntosh the bully; and eBay the coward. nt - Duilawyer 22:18:49 02/23/04 (0)

Re: Not that McIntosh's or Ebay's name was very good before, but this is bullying by both - Ivan303 15:28:38 02/23/04 (2)

No, Nader is not the solution. - Norm 17:02:07 02/23/04 (1)

Re: No, Nader is not the solution. - Ivan303 18:58:58 02/23/04 (0)

Only CRAP companies don't transfer warranties.... - RGA 11:27:46 02/23/04 (17)

RGA, this is tantamount... - Jimmy C. 17:35:29 02/23/04 (1)

Re: RGA, this is tantamount... - RGA 19:16:51 02/23/04 (0)

...weak kneed wussy? - Hepcat 11:37:37 02/23/04 (14)

"Satisfy The McIntosh Guy???!!!"... - Dr. Draz 11:50:05 02/23/04 (11)

So he can sell the thing & move on - J 16:08:43 02/23/04 (8)

Most of us fight for our rights - Rini 14:53:26 02/24/04 (5)

You pick & choose yr battles, I'll pick & choose mine, thank you very much - J 21:21:11 02/24/04 (0)

I don't really believe Mc gives a darn about the resale of - audiogatorjim 15:10:29 02/24/04 (3)

It's not so bad, IF .... - Rini 15:27:10 02/24/04 (2)

Are you mad at Mc or ebay? Or both? I think Mc's strongarm - audiogatorjim 18:51:08 02/24/04 (1)

The lack of uniformity is an issue - J 21:01:49 02/24/04 (1)

I agree with you and it appears as if we are in the minority - audiogatorjim 14:25:23 02/24/04 (0)

Re: So he can sell the thing & move on - Dr. Draz 17:06:36 02/23/04 (0)

This must be some prankster... - RGA 12:01:42 02/23/04 (1)

Maybe The McIntosh Lawyer Is The "McLawyer" Of The Bar ... - Dr. Draz 12:35:04 02/23/04 (0)

Why? - RGA 11:42:42 02/23/04 (1)

As my boss says, Gov.'t by the corp., of the corp. and for the corp. - DAT 13:03:48 02/23/04 (0)

Did you pay retail? - Jim Austin 11:20:58 02/23/04 (3)

What does it matter what he paid? - RGA 11:54:22 02/23/04 (2)

It matters because... - Jim Austin 13:51:51 02/23/04 (0)

I can't believe - RGA 12:03:08 02/23/04 (0)

I'm confused... - Fisherdude 11:13:03 02/23/04 (2)

Though how many of those were still in production - DAT 13:07:47 02/23/04 (0)

Very good point! - subcoolman 11:50:02 02/23/04 (0)

Re: Unless you claimed the warrantee is transferable, it's caveat emptor...(nt) - mkuller 10:54:54 02/23/04 (0)

In California, are warrantees transferable? - Headwound Harry 10:30:30 02/23/04 (0)

I'm 100% with Dr. Draz on this. - Rick W 10:25:22 02/23/04 (19)

Can't make a call without seeing the ad... - Ivan303 10:33:07 02/23/04 (18)

Here's The Ad On Audiogon... - Dr. Draz 10:39:19 02/23/04 (17)

Re: Here's The Ad On Audiogon... - driver8 12:26:16 02/23/04 (11)

Of course - RGA 12:36:52 02/23/04 (3)

Are you seriously questioning the life cycle of McIntosh - audiogatorjim 14:31:57 02/24/04 (2)

Re: Are you seriously questioning the life cycle of McIntosh - RGA 20:51:01 02/24/04 (1)

As a followup, I don't particularly like the McIntosh ss amps - audiogatorjim 05:50:59 02/25/04 (0)

What's today's exchange rate on the drachma?... - Neil49 12:33:10 02/23/04 (6)

My Attorney Will Be... - Dr. Draz 12:38:51 02/23/04 (5)

If you're in the US you might win... - RGA 14:14:08 02/23/04 (4)

Let me get this straight. You buy more insurance 'cuz ya believe every urban legend that comes down the pike? - axolotl 23:53:10 02/23/04 (3)

Re: Let me get this straight. You buy more insurance 'cuz ya believe every urban legend that comes down the pike? - RGA 21:08:03 02/24/04 (2)

No argument from me that healthcare in the US is expensive. - axolotl 14:26:15 02/25/04 (1)

Re: No argument from me that healthcare in the US is expensive. - RGA 18:22:15 02/26/04 (0)

Looks like they are trying to prevent a grey market - Mark B. James 11:12:25 02/23/04 (0)

Re: Here's The Ad On Audiogon... - Ethannnn 10:49:38 02/23/04 (1)

Mcintosh didn't object to that one...(nt) - Ivan303 10:41:25 02/23/04 (2)

They probably just haven't seen it yet (nt) - Sordidman 10:58:46 02/23/04 (0)

Re: Maybe They Did And Audiogon Had Some Balls... - Dr. Draz 10:56:19 02/23/04 (0)

Re: Mcintosh lawyer harassing me - What should I do? - Frank 10:25:19 02/23/04 (0)

A manufacturer has no business in the second hand market... - Budrew 10:24:25 02/23/04 (3)

Good points - Sordidman 11:27:27 02/23/04 (0)

Re: A manufacturer has no business in the second hand market... - Ivan303 10:44:53 02/23/04 (1)

Why not? - RGA 12:28:00 02/23/04 (0)

This seems so self-evident - BillH 09:42:45 02/23/04 (0)

It seems the poster also has an ad on Audiogon. - bwhite 09:22:35 02/23/04 (6)

Re: It seems the poster also has an ad on Audiogon. - Chuck Y 09:39:49 02/23/04 (5)

If your laws supercede freedom here then Anarchy would be a good thing!! NT - RGA 12:14:14 02/23/04 (0)

Considering laws are passed specifically to prevent the - Sordidman 10:17:56 02/23/04 (0)

I'm no lawyer but...!!! - bwhite 09:48:42 02/23/04 (2)

Why? - RGA 12:21:02 02/23/04 (0)

Re: I'm no lawyer but...!!! - Chuck Y 10:05:51 02/23/04 (0)

Re: Real question: why limit the warranty so much? - Matts 08:54:27 02/23/04 (1)

Yah Matts kick their ass!(nt) - fortysomething 10:29:33 02/23/04 (0)

Thank you, McIntosh lawyer... - Jay 08:41:35 02/23/04 (1)

Re: Thank you, McIntosh lawyer... - Ethannnn 08:54:38 02/23/04 (0)

Re: Mcintosh lawyer harassing me - What should I do? - Haoleb 07:51:33 02/23/04 (9)

There's A MUCH Bigger Principle Here At Stake... - Dr. Draz 07:55:02 02/23/04 (8)

Re: There's A MUCH Bigger Principle Here At Stake... - braillediver 08:00:31 02/23/04 (7)

The ONLY way this would be misrepresentation is if the seller - RGA 11:40:19 02/23/04 (0)

What I don't see is any evidence whatsoever......... - Chuck Y 08:18:42 02/23/04 (0)

Re: There's A MUCH Bigger Principle Here At Stake... - Dr. Draz 08:07:27 02/23/04 (4)

As an occassional buyer of used goods on the internet, I'm siding with McIntosh on this - Mark B. James 10:34:05 02/23/04 (3)

Hey Mark... - SteveB 11:11:28 02/23/04 (0)

Re: As an occassional buyer of used goods on the internet, I'm siding with McIntosh on this - Dr. Draz 10:48:49 02/23/04 (1)

You assume a lot. (nt) - Mark B. James 11:08:04 02/23/04 (1)

Re: Mcintosh lawyer harassing me - What should I do? - neolith 07:38:34 02/23/04 (1)

Re: Mcintosh lawyer harassing me - What should I do? - Ethannnn 08:45:36 02/23/04 (0)

Oddly? - braillediver 07:25:01 02/23/04 (1)

Re: Oddly? - Ethannnn 07:36:49 02/23/04 (1)

Re: Mcintosh lawyer harassing me - What should I do? - reb 07:19:08 02/23/04 (13)

Re: Mcintosh lawyer harassing me - What should I do? - Dr. Draz 07:44:45 02/23/04 (12)

Agree... - RGA 11:31:11 02/23/04 (0)

Sue Ebay for what? - J 09:08:35 02/23/04 (4)

Re: Sue Ebay for what? - Dr. Draz 09:26:01 02/23/04 (3)

Re: Sue Ebay for what? - J 14:12:12 02/23/04 (0)

But what you may not know about intellectual property laws........ - Chuck Y 09:47:33 02/23/04 (1)

Since you already stated you ain't a lawyer, what the hell are you talking about?! I echo Dr. Draz' comments below. nt - Rick W 13:37:12 02/23/04 (0)

Re: Mcintosh lawyer harassing me - What should I do? - reb 07:56:27 02/23/04 (5)

Yup... - Dr. Draz 08:04:04 02/23/04 (4)

Re: Yup... - reb 08:17:43 02/23/04 (3)

Animal farm - 996turbo 09:13:40 02/23/04 (2)

Re: Animal farm - Ethannnn 09:28:03 02/23/04 (1)

Re: Animal farm - wjgruenewald 13:55:00 02/23/04 (0)

Follow Ups

...weak kneed wussy? - Hepcat 11:37:37 02/23/04 (14)

"Satisfy The McIntosh Guy???!!!"... - Dr. Draz 11:50:05 02/23/04 (11)

So he can sell the thing & move on - J 16:08:43 02/23/04 (8)

Most of us fight for our rights - Rini 14:53:26 02/24/04 (5)

You pick & choose yr battles, I'll pick & choose mine, thank you very much - J 21:21:11 02/24/04 (0)

I don't really believe Mc gives a darn about the resale of - audiogatorjim 15:10:29 02/24/04 (3)

It's not so bad, IF .... - Rini 15:27:10 02/24/04 (2)

Are you mad at Mc or ebay? Or both? I think Mc's strongarm - audiogatorjim 18:51:08 02/24/04 (1)

The lack of uniformity is an issue - J 21:01:49 02/24/04 (1)

I agree with you and it appears as if we are in the minority - audiogatorjim 14:25:23 02/24/04 (0)

Re: So he can sell the thing & move on - Dr. Draz 17:06:36 02/23/04 (0)

This must be some prankster... - RGA 12:01:42 02/23/04 (1)

Maybe The McIntosh Lawyer Is The "McLawyer" Of The Bar ... - Dr. Draz 12:35:04 02/23/04 (0)

Why? - RGA 11:42:42 02/23/04 (1)

As my boss says, Gov.'t by the corp., of the corp. and for the corp. - DAT 13:03:48 02/23/04 (0)