In Reply to: A straw amplifier? posted by John Atkinson on May 13, 2005 at 04:54:24:
Right you are, JA. The LM301 was the cheap version of the LM101 that was the first op amp design independently produced by National Semiconductor, by Bob Widler.
Bob Widler told me, himself, that the IC's of that time were not designed with audio in mind. He told me to build my own op amps, more than 30 years ago.
Of course, some more modern IC's are much better for audio than the early designs. Still, I find that a good discrete design will beat any IC, for high end audio applications, up to this point.
The LM301 was only the beginning of the Quad 405's 'compromises'.
Actually, the 'current dumping' concept is interesting and can make a 'silk purse' from a 'sow's ear' from a measurement perspective at least. Had this concept been used with a higher grade circuit, perhaps it would have been a 'classic'.
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Follow Ups Full ThreadTopic - HE2005: The Great Debate - John Atkinson 20:35:12 05/08/05 (131)
- Well done, sir - E-Stat 14:17:27 05/11/05 (42)
- Re: Well done, sir - toxicport.e 14:53:58 05/11/05 (41)
- Like Hell we don't test like that! - rcrump 16:18:26 05/12/05 (0)
- Re: Well done, sir - Pat D 11:01:11 05/12/05 (39)
- You can check with him... - mkuller 10:43:32 05/14/05 (17)
- Re: You can check with him... - Pat D 09:49:09 05/15/05 (16)
- Far cry or nearly the same? - mkuller 11:31:41 05/15/05 (15)
- Re: Far cry or nearly the same? - bjh 16:30:59 05/15/05 (14)
- Funny--I seem to have gotten him to admit my point. - Pat D 19:33:44 05/15/05 (13)
- What point? - mkuller 09:56:00 05/16/05 (11)
- Re: What point? - Pat D 13:44:09 05/16/05 (9)
- For all practical purposes... - mkuller 14:10:28 05/16/05 (8)
- Inventing your own logic? - Pat D 14:19:15 05/16/05 (7)
- Re: Inventing your own logic? - bjh 14:46:12 05/16/05 (6)
- Re: Inventing your own logic? - Pat D 14:59:18 05/16/05 (5)
- What are you saying Pat? - bjh 15:19:42 05/16/05 (4)
- Oh come now! - Pat D 18:13:56 05/16/05 (3)
- False Prophet - bjh 23:03:08 05/16/05 (2)
- I never pretended to be a prophet! - Pat D 07:59:58 05/17/05 (1)
- Re: I never pretended to be a prophet! - bjh 09:09:26 05/17/05 (0)
- Re: What point? - kerr 13:41:58 05/16/05 (0)
- Re: Funny--I seem to have gotten him to admit my point. - bjh 20:48:27 05/15/05 (0)
- I'll be happy to quote him directly - E-Stat 19:51:00 05/12/05 (12)
- You need to review your logical quantifiers. - Pat D 20:41:26 05/12/05 (11)
- Then what? - E-Stat 04:43:16 05/13/05 (10)
- Re: Then what? - Pat D 09:32:09 05/13/05 (9)
- You're a trip, Pat :) - E-Stat 09:54:24 05/13/05 (0)
- Re: Then what? - bjh 09:41:19 05/13/05 (7)
- Re: Then what? - Pat D 15:02:40 05/13/05 (6)
- Re: Then what? - bjh 16:25:39 05/13/05 (5)
- More bad logic. - Pat D 21:08:14 05/13/05 (4)
- You continue to miss my point - E-Stat 04:43:42 05/14/05 (3)
- How many times are you planning to repeat your entirely obvious point ? - bjh 05:42:36 05/14/05 (1)
- You're right - E-Stat 06:38:28 05/14/05 (0)
- You have a point? - Pat D 05:34:10 05/14/05 (0)
- Re: Well done, sir - toxicport.e 16:25:22 05/12/05 (7)
- A straw amplifier? - John Atkinson 04:54:24 05/13/05 (5)
- Re: A straw amplifier? - john curl 10:01:20 05/13/05 (2)
- Memories (sniff) - E-Stat 12:20:45 05/13/05 (1)
- Re: Memories (sniff) - John Atkinson 16:21:14 05/13/05 (0)
- Straw amps? - jbmcb 06:47:02 05/13/05 (1)
- Re: Straw amps? - bjh 07:48:53 05/13/05 (0)
- Re: Well done, sir - john curl 16:54:37 05/12/05 (0)
- Hey John . . . - Pjay 11:03:43 05/09/05 (0)
- Seriously though ... - kerameikos 10:38:23 05/09/05 (0)
- Re: HE2005: The Great Debate - Pat D 10:29:10 05/09/05 (68)
- We already knew what you think... - mkuller 11:05:43 05/09/05 (67)
- Yes indeed, - bjh 07:50:27 05/10/05 (3)
- LOL - Pat D 18:34:34 05/10/05 (2)
- Re: We already knew what you think... - theaudiohobby 01:29:40 05/10/05 (23)
- Unfortunately, he doesn't seem to be kidding! - Pat D 07:30:48 05/10/05 (22)
- Re: Unfortunately, he doesn't seem to be kidding! - john curl 21:14:11 05/11/05 (21)
- Re: Unfortunately, he doesn't seem to be kidding! - theaudiohobby 00:25:01 05/12/05 (20)
- Proof and perception - Jim Austin 17:38:28 05/12/05 (6)
- Re: Proof and perception - theaudiohobby 01:54:56 05/13/05 (1)
- Re: Proof and perception - Jim Austin 04:39:47 05/13/05 (0)
- Re: Proof and perception - bjh 19:41:56 05/12/05 (2)
- Re: Proof and perception - john curl 20:33:45 05/12/05 (1)
- Re: Proof and perception - bjh 04:50:03 05/13/05 (0)
- Re: Proof and perception - john curl 19:10:26 05/12/05 (0)
- Re: Unfortunately, he doesn't seem to be kidding! - bjh 05:59:40 05/12/05 (12)
- Re: Unfortunately, he doesn't seem to be kidding! - theaudiohobby 01:51:12 05/13/05 (3)
- Who's kidding whom? - mkuller 14:39:01 05/13/05 (0)
- Re: Unfortunately, he doesn't seem to be kidding! - bjh 04:48:26 05/13/05 (1)
- Re: Unfortunately, he doesn't seem to be kidding! - theaudiohobby 19:26:32 05/13/05 (0)
- Re: Unfortunately, he doesn't seem to be kidding! - Pat D 20:37:04 05/12/05 (7)
- Re: Unfortunately, he doesn't seem to be kidding! - bjh 05:00:13 05/13/05 (6)
- Re: Unfortunately, he doesn't seem to be kidding! - Pat D 20:24:19 05/13/05 (5)
- Re: Unfortunately, he doesn't seem to be kidding! - kerr 20:41:56 05/14/05 (4)
- Re: Unfortunately, he doesn't seem to be kidding! - Pat D 18:18:38 05/16/05 (3)
- Re: Unfortunately, he doesn't seem to be kidding! - kerr 05:47:25 05/17/05 (2)
- Re: Unfortunately, he doesn't seem to be kidding! - Pat D 08:29:39 05/17/05 (1)
- Re: Unfortunately, he doesn't seem to be kidding! - kerr 09:00:03 05/17/05 (0)
- Sorry, you miss the point. - Pat D 18:17:09 05/09/05 (38)
- Re: "Such things are basically audio jewellery with no proven audible benefits beyond much less expensive products." - Bruce from DC 06:37:11 05/11/05 (6)
- Re: "Such things are basically audio jewellery with no proven audible benefits beyond much less expensive products." - Pat D 20:00:33 05/11/05 (3)
- Re: "Such things are basically audio jewellery with no proven audible benefits beyond much less expensive products." - regmac 08:29:25 05/12/05 (0)
- Sorry you chose not to answer my question (nt) - Bruce from DC 06:14:00 05/12/05 (1)
- Sorry you can't read. - Pat D 06:51:23 05/12/05 (0)
- Re: "Such things are basically audio jewellery with no proven audible benefits beyond much less expensive products." - bjh 08:29:49 05/11/05 (1)
- But it's so HARD to do a speaker DBT.... - mkuller 13:29:34 05/11/05 (1)
- Sorry I made your knee jerk... - mkuller 16:14:13 05/10/05 (19)
- Why don't you tell us what you really mean? - Pat D 20:34:41 05/10/05 (18)
- Ok, let me draw you a picture... - mkuller 11:23:34 05/11/05 (17)
- Here's some expert opinion . . . - Pat D 20:37:19 05/11/05 (16)
- In my exchanges with jj... - mkuller 11:01:47 05/14/05 (7)
- Re: In my exchanges with jj... - Pat D 08:47:15 05/16/05 (6)
- DBTs with music... - mkuller 10:51:19 05/16/05 (5)
- Re: DBTs with music... - kerr 13:43:57 05/16/05 (4)
- Re: DBTs with music... - Pat D 14:33:35 05/16/05 (3)
- Re: DBTs with music... - kerr 15:11:41 05/16/05 (2)
- Re: DBTs with music... - Pat D 18:11:51 05/16/05 (1)
- Re: DBTs with music... - kerr 05:34:35 05/17/05 (0)
- Well, his opinion is as good as anyone's... - kerr 05:42:48 05/13/05 (7)
- Now, there's a nub of the question, honestly stated. - Pat D 09:21:43 05/13/05 (6)
- Here's a reliable method for choosing the best sounding stuff... - mkuller 11:09:45 05/13/05 (4)
- Not even professional reviewers can listen to everything. - Pat D 15:08:28 05/13/05 (1)
- You missed the point...again... - mkuller 11:48:37 05/15/05 (0)
- It also includes regular refreshes - E-Stat 14:47:21 05/13/05 (0)
- Yes. I should have been more clear. - kerr 12:31:51 05/13/05 (0)
- I appreciate your POV... - kerr 10:24:20 05/13/05 (0)
- Re: Sorry, you miss the point. - kerr 05:55:05 05/10/05 (5)
- STOP MAKING SENSE! It's a waste of flame space. nt - clarkjohnsen 07:18:29 05/10/05 (4)
- But I have no objection to people forming preferences. (nt) - Pat D 07:26:26 05/10/05 (3)
- Preferences - kerr 10:10:27 05/10/05 (0)
- Thas' mighty white a'ya... nt - clarkjohnsen 07:47:51 05/10/05 (1)
- Same to you, Clark. (nt) - Pat D 20:44:20 05/10/05 (0)
- Expensive - that depends....... - JohnL 20:34:33 05/09/05 (4)
- It's expensive - Pat D 07:23:03 05/10/05 (3)
- Fair dinkum------ - JohnL 17:15:38 05/10/05 (2)
- You need some logic: whole, part, none, some, every. - Pat D 18:29:07 05/10/05 (1)
- Agreed - kerr 05:52:20 05/11/05 (0)
- Re: HE2005: The Great Debate - kerameikos 09:03:10 05/09/05 (6)
- Re: HE2005: The Great Debate - John Atkinson 11:09:43 05/09/05 (5)
- Re: HE2005: The Great Debate - tavegia@bellsouth.net 14:32:03 05/10/05 (0)
- Huh! here's another ex-stutterer. Interesting story... - clarkjohnsen 07:24:24 05/10/05 (2)
- Re: Huh! here's another ex-stutterer. Interesting story... - John Atkinson 19:20:33 05/10/05 (1)
- Easy, boy! Not saying *I* recommend it -- - clarkjohnsen 08:25:50 05/11/05 (0)
- I thought it was just a regional accent! (nt) - kerameikos 11:36:15 05/09/05 (0)
- Re: HE2005: The Debate - Kloss 07:59:52 05/09/05 (0)
- I missed a scream? DARN! nt - Pjay 04:43:51 05/09/05 (0)
- Re: HE2005: The Great Debate - toxicport.e 02:39:35 05/09/05 (7)
- Try this - kerr 08:56:22 05/09/05 (6)
- Re: Try this - toxicport.e 18:02:10 05/09/05 (0)
- Re: Try this - jamesgarvin 11:49:33 05/09/05 (4)
- Re: Try this - kerr 13:03:12 05/09/05 (3)
- Re: Try this - jamesgarvin 13:28:46 05/09/05 (2)
- Re: Try this - kerr 13:46:05 05/09/05 (1)
- Re: Try this - toxicport.e 17:58:53 05/09/05 (0)
Follow Ups
- Re: A straw amplifier? - john curl 10:01:20 05/13/05 (2)
- Memories (sniff) - E-Stat 12:20:45 05/13/05 (1)
- Re: Memories (sniff) - John Atkinson 16:21:14 05/13/05 (0)