 
|
Audio Asylum Thread Printer Get a view of an entire thread on one page |
For Sale Ads |
|
|
Audio Asylum Thread Printer Get a view of an entire thread on one page |
For Sale Ads |
59.101.17.244
In Reply to: RE: Questions posted by cics on June 17, 2008 at 23:34:54
thanks cics
went ahead and built the memory player, a big leap of faith to a guy who is a 'speaker' man rather than a source man!! I should have waited before asking my last question, as I suspected it became obvious once the build was underway.
I used the company's computer guy, and aren't I glad I did, had a few problems along the way. I'm a dummy with computers, so will not be able to answer any questions...will have to confer with him if some questions do come up. Basically, there was no way we could get the laptop HD working with it, and strangely enough any other HD we used that happened to be 250 gig also wouldn't work (we tried normal sized hd's he had laying about). So what we have in there atm is a normal hd (it says seagate barracuda 7200.11 if that is important) and is 320 gig. That seems to work.
Hope that is OK to leave in? If not then we have to overcome whatever the problem was that we encountered.
We did all the optimizations in the various documents (after running around various stores and buying yet another laptop hd that wouldn't work with it...grrrr.... so was getting very late in the day) including all the registry stuff.
Then I thought about the very little experience I've had with EAC, and recalled that to load all the data of the cd it needs to be loaded off the net. So tried to undo whichever the changes we had made that disabled the internet connection...and need less to say we must have missed something, so rather than muck about too much we re-installed XP and did it all again.
So what we have done is all the BIOS stuff, and from memory all the XP optimizations EXCEPT for the anything to do with regedit. He being a computer guy and not into stereo at all seems to be very wary about doing anything in regedit, and me being a computer idiot do not know enough to insist. I do have his agreement that if needs be I come back in a few weeks to do further changes to make the computer more closely match the documents.
But my main question, apart from 'is it worth doing the extra steps I mentioned' is about the use of EAC.
When you use EAC with this player, and the internet is disconnected (or even is it, I was sooo confused by what was happening I could be way off base, but I do recall stuff like disabling all virus protection which to me suggests we are not on the net)does that mean we are to enter all the data of the cd by hand??? if so arrggh. No doubt I've missed something in the documentation, even though I've read it half a dozen times (admittedly it gets a tad clearer each time, but I'm still a ways off completely understanding it all)
Also, am I to understand that with cplay we no longer use foobar? I've never even used foobar, so it's all new to me, and by the end of the night going backwards and forwards between three or four printed documents (AOBCT, Cplay and Cmp memory player and cMP installation guide) I must say I didn't quite know what was what, or even what day it was!! heh heh
I promise I'll only ask questions in the future after giving it a proper go, but these basic questions have got me stumped right now.
I'll start using EAC as I already have done ( by using the net for now) and then evaluate what to do next depending on whatever answers I get.
So do we use the net for ripping the data into EAC, and do I insist that he also do the regedits? (he thought that was why we couldnot access the net)
Gee, it looks mush bigger and sexier in the flesh than the photo!!
Follow Ups:
Just a little side note. If your computer guy has issues with making changes in the registry maybe you should find someone who is comfortable with it.
Remember that if you use disk cloning software like Acronis or Ghost to make images at different points in the process, that you can restore your PC if you make a mistake or decide to make a change at a step farther back.
I strongly recommend that you make a backup like this and then go through all the steps to set it up yourself. If you follow the instructions it's pretty safe, and if you screw up you always have that backup to go to. Nothing you do to Windows that is suggested will damage the PC hardware. The only thing you have to be extremely careful is doing any BIOS updates, make sure you won't loose power or stop the machine in the process otherwise you will destroy the BIOS.
The side effect of all this is, that you will learn a lot, and also won't be dependent on someone else if something goes wrong.
I've been working with DOS and Windows since the early 80's and I have learned quite a few things going through the install of cMP and cPlay.
Frodan
hi frodan
I only just saw your post, alerted by email that you'd made it (thanks!)...is there a link to understand how this forum works??? It is very confusing (I'm used to chronological order, this seems to split into many multiple off shoots) and when you click on the 'last post' on the main page you got to that...that's how I missed this one.
I'm sure I can convince him to do it, in fact we did do it the first time through, and that was when I 'realized' we needed to access the internet to easily get the track data. So we went back and undid what we thought needed to be undone to accomplish that, but the net didn't work so we just re-installed XP and started again. We did the BIOS changes, and the user sign on stuff (welcome page??) but left the registry changes and the other one (can't recall what it's called, but the one where you set all the things to 'manual') until I got on here and had my questions answered about the net bit.
that answer was of course to use a second computer and transfer the files, so I can now go back to him and do the last of the optimizations (as well as the new mobo and cpu...grrr!!). I will alert him to those programs (thanks) and get them for myself too, may help me at a later stage. Perhaps one day I could do it all myself, ...yep gotta catch me one of those flying pigs one day!! heh heh
Digitising a CD collection is time-consuming and can, for high-end audio at least, be complex. I would urge that you:
1. do it on a separate computer to your audio PC and copy the files over (perhaps on a USB drive) when they are ready. You will invest a lot of time in this process. Believe me, once is enough. Obviously, always keep a backup;
2. decide before processing in bulk what data format you want (wav or flac, one-file-per-CD, one-file-per-track, with or without cuesheets (needed for cPlay) etc, etc. Do a few CDs and trial them until you are sure you have what you want. Trawl the net and this site for help;
3. decide what info you want in filenames and tags. It is not (again, trust me) good for morale to have to edit hundreds or thousands of files because you made an over-hasty choice;
4. Freedb and the like are really essential but the information is not always accurate or well presented. If that matters to you, be prepared to spend time editing. Free or shareware utililties such as “Bulk File Renamer” and “Tag and Rename” can be useful;
5. On your audio PC, keep the OS separate from your music data on a small, separate partition (about 10GB?). Make an ‘image’ of that partition using a utility such as Snapshot (my choice), Ghost or whatever. If (when) you make an error that kills the OS, you can then fix it in minutes. (That’s a good tip for any Windoze install, BTW. Can’t speak for Linux or OSX);
6. It is not necessary to do all (or even any) of cics’ recommended config changes all at once. Do some, try them for a day or two, update your image file and do more at your leisure. The effort is well worth it.
Hope that helps.
''hope that helps''.....you betcha!Is it humanly possible to go bald in the space of one evening??
I did suggest the procedure of burning the cd on a seperate computer and transferring it to my computer guy, he just laughed at me so I thought it must have been a stupid idea! But of course that would get around having the cMP connected to the net, but I'm currently having a hell of a time even making it thru the eac wizard, when eac tries to detect the drive features all hell breaks loose, end up with a 'monged' screen with what looks like alien script on it.
2 @ 3 I understand, and am looking into it now, for the sage reasons you have pointed out. 4, cool got it thanks, not super important for me.
5, well that's just a bit over my head ATM, but will refer my computer guy to it later. thanks.
6 figured as much, good to know I can slowly but surely do those steps at a later date.
Also at a later date I will start to prune the many unused superfluous cables still inside the box, OK to just snip them off?
back to trying to configure eac, I presume that eac properly setup will be required on the 'target' computer even if the actual burning takes place on another? Hmm, maybe not.
EDIT reading and following tutorials re configuring eac, and one mentioned that sometimes eac can't read the cd (the step I'm stuck on) and so I need an ASPI layer. Does that make sense??
EDIT and EDIT again!found a better tutorial which did things a tad differently, so seemed to get over my earlier troubles.
And I took a risk and quickly hooked up the net to the cMP for the time it needs to download the data, and ripped the first cd. And am now listening to it heh heh and hooray. Just from analog out for now, but still it's up and running so thanks for all the help to date, and for the machine.
The computer crashed half way thru the rip, but luckily I only had to restart the rip from where it got up to, phwew. Will hopefully work out whats happening at some time in the future.
I just rebuilt my cMP over the weekend using latest hardware specifications . Highly recommended!
Ryelands' advice is good. Definitely go with CD ripping on another computer and just copy CDs (.cue & .wav / .flac) to your cMP (you get 4GB USB sticks these days). You benefit as your cMP has no networking functionality (giving better sound quality) and you don't have to mess with EAC. This is what I do with my reference setup.
It's a first not being able to use 250GB+ drives! I have a HTPC using cMP setup which has 1TB (2x512GB Seagate SATA HDDs). This is very unusual - you may a have a mobo fault.
Your other questions:
- It's safe to do the registry changes - minlogon stuff (posted under additional fine tuning) is high risk
- Yes with cPlay you don't need foobar
- Hoping to get a single guide covering all the new material + cPlay: cMP 2
cheers cics
OK, let me see if I have got the scenario straight (murphys law and all that)....I just finished building the cMP two days ago, after buying all the parts for a complete new build...and now find out that there is a hardware upgrade that if I hadn't been so keen and impatient to build it in the first place I would have been able to incorporate into the build??? Yep, sounds like my kind luck!!
And to boot, you linked to yet another thread I have to read and try and understand...arrggghhhh!! I was blissfully unaware that one existed.
Maybe a mobo fault eh?, it is brand new out of the box, praps if I cross my fingers it will be faulty and can replace it..with the new one in the upgrade heh heh.
Will do the registry changes soonish, and then give the minilogin a go after that. Do we just clip off all the loose wires? or do they need to be cleaned up some other way.
Will get the memory stick and transfer from another computer, tho I have successfully copied a few cds to date, I find the cmp crashes regulary when I'm burning cds, I hope it's only during that process. I'll leave it on all day today (doing nothing) and see if it also crashes then. (dunno if crash is the right word, everything freezes up with what looks like attempted script, but comes out looking what a sci fi movie may have as an alien script. I have to turn it off and restart to get it going again)
OK, now to the important bit, feedback on how it sounds.
As I mentioned previously, I am a 'the important stuff in stereo happens at the speaker end' kind of guy. (you all will laugh at me here, and fair enough I spose) but I only ever used the cheapest dvd player ($119 IIRC!!) from woolworths in my system, initially just to get me going, but always kept it due to there being no great improvements from auditioning cdp's up to around $3000 in my system. I have also once checked out getting into vinyl and so had a cheapish vinyl rig in to audition, around $5 000 all up. Again no real improvement, just 'different' if you get my drift. The improvements (read difference) was not great enough to justify the asking price for entry, so simply stuck with my Digitrex 2000 ha ha.I mean I'm happy to pay for a quality upgrade, but for a couple thousand bucks it has to be OBVIOUS man, and a definite improvement, not just 'different'.
That was why it was risky and a gamble for me to give this a go, no way to audition first.
Well blow me down and colour me pink, I am very glad indeed that I took the gamble. Admittedly I have only heard a few tracks this morning, but already it's completely obvious about quite a few things. It is much easier to listen to for a start, less fatiguing and more relaxed. the imaging is a lot more precise, and the thing that I love about my systems presentation (ambience and 'surround sound') has improved dramatically from an already exceedingly high base! Excellent stuff.
But the thing that has completely blown me away? There is one particular track I have been playing a lot of this last week (above the clouds by Mike Oldfield) and towards the end of the track comes in this lowish guitar riff superimposed on the bass guitar, the track dies away to just the drums, then everything comes back for the climax. Strangely enough, the day I was building the cMP I went over to a guys house and listened to his system, he was running the top of the line Moon cdp into a pass labs pre and amp combo into a pair of duntechs, and the same description of the track applied.
I listened to it this morning off the cMP.....and the lowish guitar riff does NOT disappear when the drums come in, it is still there gently on top of the drums and as clear as a bell!!! I was shaking my head in astonishment.
And the funny thing? Yep, I'm still using the temporary analog out from the soundcard!
thanks cics, you have yet another fan!
New hardware specifications allows for SRC@145db SNR to be used. There's also lower power consumption. What you have is already exceptionally good. This upgrade delivers better performance - near perfect harmonics. The level of performance is a whole new experience for me - I've never heard such purity in any system (CD, SACD or turntable) at any price point.
Regarding loose wires: do NOT clip! Rather look to unplug at the connectors - computers are modular in design and rarely has components hardwired.
thanks cics
have bitten the bullet and ordered the upgrade stuff grrr, one day too early I was.
A few questions still if I may. Have had a few days with it, and the penny has yet to drop.
Somehow my cplay is stuck on 'repeating', and have yet to find what button i have pushed that I should not have.
Also the remote control using the mouse does not work, how do I turn it on?
Out of curiosity, if it's a good idea to burn your discs on a seperate computer and transfer them across, then theoretically we don't need the cd drive in the unit at all? If so, why is it there?
That kinda gets me to my biggest headache at the moment. I'm currently running at about 50% that cplay finds an error in the cuesheet generated by eac, and won't run. I've managed in a few of them to get in and successfully edit the cue sheet in notepad, but boy it's frustrating stuff and I'm not always successful.
The problems with the cue sheet may be the cause of the next, in most cases the blue line indicating which track is playing in cplay is on the wrong track..not a major problem as all the tracks still play but irritating. That may go away when I sort the cue file dilemna.
I've been searching cue sheet errors on the net, no obvious reason that I can find.
All that means that it is particularly slow in getting any amount of music into the cmp!!
Somehow my cplay is stuck on 'repeating', and have yet to find what button i have pushed that I should not have.
Also the remote control using the mouse does not work, how do I turn it on?
Out of curiosity, if it's a good idea to burn your discs on a seperate computer and transfer them across, then theoretically we don't need the cd drive in the unit at all? If so, why is it there?
...cplay finds an error in the cuesheet generated by eac...
first off apologies to you cics for not working out the stuck 'on repeat' bit, it should have been obvious.
I found remote exe thanks, but I have to click on it each time after exiting cplay for it to work, is that normal? And once the remote has been started, I no longer have 'right click' available so to actually turn off cplay from the bottom toolbar (when you right click and choose 'close) so to 'turn off' cplay I actually have to turn off the computer....again obviously something very stupid I'm doing (I recall the option to go to XP in the cMP options, but I go and click cPLAY to get going, is that where the error is?)
Am continually pleased at new things heard and improvements across the board. A friend came over and heard it y/day, think he may be here soon asking questions heh heh, he doesn't want the fully stripped back version dedicated to two channel, wants the full HT application but still with quality sound, assume the HT bit in the manuals will suffice.
On that score, is it possible at all with this setup to pop in a cd/dvd and just press play? ie without the need to rip and store. Guess it would be a bit hard to fit a movie on the ram.
OK, whilst it's wonderful I'm hitting up against a few problems that need sorting, I can't find the exact answers in the manual (tho no doubt there), so on with some more dumbarse questions eh?
Whilst my main computer is being repaired, I've had the cMP on the desk and running long analog leads to the deqx for convenience sake and to be able to begin ripping (when the main computer is back I can apply the remaINDER of the optimizations in the manual and rip on that and transfer via USB stick) however when my friend was here we decided to movemit over into the rack and use digital out rather than analog out, just to see how it sounded. Anyway I cannot get digital out, I was using the digital lead that comes in the bundle with the din (?) plug on the end. The pulldown in cplay that refers to the available inputs only lists input 1&2 and 3&4, which from the juli@ book is analog IN and out??? go figure. So I'm not sure what I've done wrong to not be able to access digital out. I did plug the coax lead into one of the outputs 3&4 (the bottom two) which did give a signal of sorts, but very distorted and obviously not the right place to put it!
There is an awful lot of noise (computer) in the signal. Like when a laptop with ac power in is in the system. I have byet to remove extraneous wires in the box yet, but even so I would not have thought it was normal or acceptable. When I replace the mobo and cpu's etc according to your last release I can remove the wires. But does having the noise sound like a normal situation to you? The PS I have is the coolermaster RS 500 if that is needed data, plus of course the granite PS.
When we use the zalman case, IIRC the only thing we enabled was the touchscreen. That means the USB ports on the front of the case (which provide very easy access) are non-functional, which means when we load the music files ripped from another computer (recommended) we have to fiddle around the back of the unit, a bit of a problem in a lot of racks I'd guess. Is there a way to 'turn on' the front usb ports? If the software changes preclude that, then maybe there are usb links available that can piggy out of the back port and loop into the front panel ports? How do all you guys overcome this 'user' issue?
Is there an option available so when I load a file into cPLAY it won't start playing till I press the remote button? Yes I know it takes 15 sec to load, but it's good to get it ready and settl back into the seat and press play when I like...gotta be able to get the beer in my hand first!! ha ha.
Thanks for that and your patience in answering every silly question I come up with.
General query (ie computer idiot alert) with the new mobo annd h/ware upgrades, as I vaguely understand it it enables us to sample at much higher rates...which from the diagrams in the intro to the AOBC gives us a more analog waveform. But if the dacs we use can only accept 24/96 is there an advantage?? or am I not even at the right station let alone on the right track. I mean does it do all the processing at 192 and then converts back down to 96 which the deqx will accept. If it 'goes back down' to 96, was there an advantage in going up in the first place? Maybe there is a link to a thread that explains it, saves you having to do it and I can learn that way.
EDIT to my last post, luckily no-one has responded yet so I can get this in.If one of the reasons of the SQ of the cMP is that the replay comes from a very quiet and stripped down computer, would not that attribute apply equally to the burning process? Not that I would necessarily hear it, but theoretically at least the SQ burned with the cMP should be better than our everyday computer with all it's noise? Would not the transfer in the non-optimum environment put jitter into the saved file?
If that is true, and the only 'downside' of using the cMP to burn the disc is the 'need' to connect to make the song list data gathering easier.
Well ok, then we can burn the disc on the cMP and only transfer the cue file can't we?
thanks.
EDIT OF EDITleft it a few hours just on (is that ok?) and went to play something just now,,all crackly and distorted. I really feel that computers (even stripped down ones) and I just don't get along. Or is it a microsoft thing?
anyway, not sure it's worth the grief. which is a shame given what I've heard. unless all the changes need to be made, but I got the idea that they could be done in stages so that does'nt make too much sense.
should fell better in the morning for a renewed attack, but only a few days in and already a bloody computer is mucking up. you'd think they'd be sorted by now wouldn't you? (computers I mean)
...is it possible at all with this setup to pop in a cd/dvd and just press play? ie without the need to rip and store. Guess it would be a bit hard to fit a movie on the ram
The pulldown in cplay that refers to the available inputs only lists input 1&2 and 3&4, which from the juli@ book is analog IN and out???
But does having the noise sound like a normal situation to you?
That means the USB ports on the front of the case (which provide very easy access) are non-functional
Is there an option available so when I load a file into cPLAY it won't start playing till I press the remote button?
...with the new mobo annd h/ware upgrades, as I vaguely understand it it enables us to sample at much higher rates... But if the dacs we use can only accept 24/96 is there an advantage??
If one of the reasons of the SQ of the cMP is that the replay comes from a very quiet and stripped down computer, would not that attribute apply equally to the burning process?...Would not the transfer in the non-optimum environment put jitter into the saved file?
left it a few hours just on (is that ok?) and went to play something just now,,all crackly and distorted. I really feel that computers (even stripped down ones) and I just don't get along. Or is it a microsoft thing?
Well I'm sure you would like some good news eh? I finally got the digital out working (thank you, thank you, you're too kind). Simple really I spose, made sure the pull down in cPLAY showed outputs 3&4, and then made sure in control panel-audio sounds and devices that output 3&4 was showing in the juli@ soundcard thingymajig.
And yes, some nice improvements.
The noise has attenuated very much, except of course when the file loads. I originally had it sitting on top of the bass amp (quick and dirty setup), and even with no electrical connection between the deqx and the cMP there was a constant thud thud from the bass speakers, obvioulsy some Rf interference. For now I have thrown the cMP on the floor and that has fixed it temporarily. When I make a music rack I'll have to keep it seperate from all amps I guess.
Decided to bite the bullet and try doing the rest of the optimizations myself, if I muck it up the computer guy can fix it when we replace the h/w.
On that question, still a tad confused.
You answered
""""New hw allows for 145db SNR upsampling - default offers SRC @ 121db SNR which is excellent but @145db, this is state-of-the-art. Unfortunately, using it requires loads of processing power, hence new hw which provides ample CPU ability without any penalties by way of more power consumption and interference. In your case (and mine), you can now use SRC @ 145db SNR for 24/96 output. Trying same on lessor hw will result in distorted playback. This hw also caters for 24/192k. There's no down conversion.""""
So I take it that I was totally wrong (confused by recalling the graphs in the paper I guess) about why we upgrade the hw. We in fact do it to get a better sound to noise ratio, and not because we upsample to 192k?? In fact we don't use that setting at all, just stick with 96 which is what the deqx can see..is that correct?
I don't suppose there are too many dacs capable of 192 input. I'm probaly still pretty confused about that, is their a discussion here that explains it all?
Anyway, thought you'd like some good news from me rather than problems! Thanks.
Upsampling is a tradeoff between accuracy and processing power. Greater accuracy (as in 145db SNR) demands more processing power. By accuracy, I mean correctness of signal amplitude calculation. In the graphs, plotting 145 and 121 will show differences in signal amplitudes (which probably won't be visible graphically and instead, you'd have to look at individual sample values).
So for best 24/96 output, use 145db upsampler. Likewise, at 24/192 you can choose the accuracy you prefer. Using 145db demands better hw.
| FAQ |
Post a Message! |
Forgot Password? |
|
||||||||||||||
|
||||||||||||||
This post is made possible by the generous support of people like you and our sponsors:
Top of Page ]
[ Contact Us ]
[ Support/Wish List ]
[ Copyright © 2025, Audio Asylum, all rights reserved ]
