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So I went to the Dallas show on Friday. What I heard that really impressed me the most was that much of the digital playback there was exceptional. And I don't mean on 90 K DCS stacks. At 44.1 KHz to boot. Although I did see 24 bit 44.1 in two rooms. That is new to me. Anyhow, the digital naysayers can now get their noses out of the air, and give the perfect sound forever line a rest. I say pick your poison and just enjoy the music
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I pulled my TT out of my system about 15 years ago.
Early CDPs and DACs weren't as good as they are today or even a decade ago; today they are as close to perfect as not to matter .
Dmitri Shostakovich
Direct to disc vinyl pressings are as close to the live unamplified event as one can currently get!
But the music generally sucks. Great as test tones, but who really wants to listen to it. Yeah, I have had some Sheffield Labs over the years.
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Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"
I am so glad that you mentioned those!! I have both "The King James Version" and "Comin' From A Good Place". Got 'em way back when I was in hifi sales, and haven't listened to either of them for probably ten years. Gotta play both of them soon! Harry James was one of the best.
Minimal miking (and very good mics), decent venues (although I think a little too small). Really good electronics chain and overall balance. However, I must say that they're a little too "in your face", as if you're hearing the band from right in front of them, rather than from an audience or ballroom position, but that's an artistic/producer decision. Having played a lot of big band gigs, I don't mind, but it might not be for everyone. On the other hand, the purpose of the recordings was to highlight the quality of D2D and their recording techniques, and they succeeded quite nicely.
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We are inclusive and diverse, but dissent will not be tolerated.
Wyley Chapel, or however it's spelled, is small and the single AKG stereo mike is up close and spaced accordingly.
for me when I put the record on, it's a REFERENCE for a sound staging event and everything else. Love it!
A while back, you mentioned an upcoming Dallas show. I looked up Lonestar Audio Fest, and saw that it's not for another couple of months or so. What show did you go to, and was it worth it, and is it ongoing - as in 'next year'? Thanks.
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We are inclusive and diverse, but dissent will not be tolerated.
It is by the same people that put on the Cap Audio Fest and the show in Denver. It was very good. Much better than the dinky yearly show we've had down here, with garage made speakers and electronics. Next year they promise more rooms snd activities. I hope it takes off as I see this industry as gasping of breath.
Thanks for the info. "Gary" gave me a link. I'll endeavor to remember for next year.
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We are inclusive and diverse, but dissent will not be tolerated.
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Thanks for the linky!
"Now I know".
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We are inclusive and diverse, but dissent will not be tolerated.
It was this last weekend
since about 1985 or so, it will be digitally sourced.
Fortunately, no longer fenced in to late 70s storage media capacity.
There's been plenty of new music recorded analog since 1985. Not a big deal but facts is facts
I don't know about "1985" specifically, but of the pro studios I've been in over the past 15 years or so, there's a lot of vintage multi-track Ampex ATR's, MCI, Otari and Studers sitting largely unused, and a lot of Apples and DAWs and plug-ins being used.
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We are inclusive and diverse, but dissent will not be tolerated.
tons of reissues from places like Analog Productions , The In Groove , etc.
Even new Reference Recordings content is now all digital.
But I'm talking about actual recordings 1985-2024
I can name a few from 2023-2024
Plenty of commerical recordings were recorded analog. Again not that it matters but...well.... facts do matter
you have yet to cite any.
No surprise.
will you shut the **** up?
Make it worth my effort and I'll give you a list of some, SOME of the ones I actually own.
You see this is a reflection once again of your character. You are flat out lying here. I "cannot" cite any is a blatant lie. What is wrong with you that you feel the need to do this?
Why does finding out you got the facts wrong turn you into an instant sociopath?
If you really believe I CANNOT cite any such recordings make a bet and stand up behind your words.
I look forward to your next childish lie claiming four posts and you still cannot cite any.
The top end is better on vinyl than redbook cd's (44.1/16). I read that vinyl has more resolution above 5KHz and I believe it.
If a record is made from a hi-res digital recording from start to finish (96KHz or better sampling), the vinyl will still have better top end than the redbook CD.
SACD's and DVD-A's beat the pants off vinyl. I have no experience with hi-res downloads, but at 96KHz sampling or more, my money is on digital. DVD's at 48KHz sampling sound better than redbook but...
Tom
Dark energy? Ridiculous!
We live in an electric universe.
LPs are digital recordings.
But I do agree. FINALLY we are at the point with mass market digital units where some of do not cause my ears to bleed!
It took long enough though...
I think I'll wait a for it to get nice and hot before stirring this pot. Let's make it an epic thread....
There is sooooo much material to rehash!
Which format is the most accurate? :-)
I'm sure glad I enjoy listening to music on my stereo system and not LPs, CDs, or hi-res.
Digital is more accurate.
So do you have musicians come to your home, sit on your stereo and play music? Is that how you "enjoy listening to music on my stereo system and not LPs, CDs, or hi-res."?
You missed my jest in context of the latest threads on accuracy. I don't listen to discs of vinyl or plastic or chips on a motherboard, I listen to the music that's being played. In other words, I don't judge whether the music is enjoyable or not based on the medium.
I did miss that. And agree 100%
I'm an LP guy but only because of sunk costs. At one point about 25 years ago, I was flat ass broke and had to sell all of my CDs in order to put food on the table. When I was in a position to start buying music again, I got a good turntable for free and was able to buy an armload of used LPs for the price of one new CD.
By the time I was in a position to put together a new system, I had about 2000 LPs and maybe 2 dozen CDs. What's a guy supposed to do at that point?
Oh, one other problem I have with digital is the players. I never seem to be able to get more than a few years out of one before it starts malfunctioning.
You can take a turntable out of an attic where it's been sitting for decades, clean it up, put a new cartridge on it and it'll work perfectly and reliably for as long as you want to use it, but I've had CD players go belly up in as short as six months.
The blissful counterstroke-a considerable new message.
Edits: 03/18/24
I've pretty much stopped buying LPs or CDs unless it's something I can't get as a download or it's an album I really want on physical media. As it is I've been culling to make room for the occasional purchase. I decided to stop building the collections as it would just take up more space and mean even more crap for my spouse or family to deal with when I die. Plus, before I get rid of a LP I record it so it's available on the NAS drive.
I've had good luck with my 16 year old player/transport. Seems to be hanging in there just fine but I have been thinking about which transport I'd buy to replace it.
And I've cut waaay back on LP purchases, but I still have about 3600 that'll have to be dealt with.
The blissful counterstroke-a considerable new message.
That was my experience, first with Schiit DACs, then with Topping. I swapped DACs but improvements I thought I heard were extremely slight if not entirely imaginary. Further, I see no reason to spend more than $1000 on a DAC.
Last LP I bought was circa 1995. Given the assorted trade-offs LP vs. CD, I've since bought only CDs, SACDs, or digital downloads.
Dmitri Shostakovich
I think it's been evident for quite some time. Never had much problem with digital proponents but vinyl always sounded better on my stereo until it didn't. I figured it was a combination of me buying the right player and with digital recording advancements and just more experience creating CDs.I'm at the point of thinking vinyl is just a lucrative side hype for many labels and not a whole lot of effort is being put into it beyond marketing. I'm kind of tired of hearing folks with 40/50 year old receiver based systems creaming on each other over their love of vinyl. But like Perfect Sound forever the vinyl revival is a great way to sell the same music over again and again. Don't get me wrong some vinyl reissues are very good (but plenty stink) - it's mainly new release music where I see vinyl quality dropping off. Just to be clear digital downloaded concert recordings are some of my favorite recordings and original release analog era vinyl LPs (and some quality reissues of them) are most of the best sounding records in my collection. My favorite version of DSOTM is a CD.
Edits: 03/17/24 03/17/24 03/17/24 03/17/24
But I believe there's a point of convergence between the best digital and the best analog. I've heard some digital at audio shows that I could easily live with. Even my current DAC is more than up to the challenge of equalling most vinyl. And when you consider that I don't have to clean vinyl and care for it all the time, it's a bonus.
however, vinyl is still more convincing. don't get me wrong, when I bought a Sony NS500V SACD player ($169 new/sealed delivered when it was discontinued and a store sold me an open box for $200 that had the wrong remote. quickly returned for refund), not only did SACDs sound great, but all of my CDs sounded better by far due to filtration an upsampled frequency.
then, a copy of the MOFI Blues in Orbit by Duke Ellington was being circulated among some of us inmates by mail. being out of print, the then-current price was $100. i acquired a Classic Records Reissue of it for $30 so I A/B-ed them and as good as the SACD was (truly excellent), the LP beat it out by a small margin.
i agree that digital done right is as engaging as can be but "something" about LPs is more captivating.
...regards...tr
Most of my listening is classical. IMHO, vinyl is not a good medium for classical. Background noise is too high, dynamic range is too limited, distortion levels are too high. No amount of "yes, but" will change the science behind the measured deltas with the two mediums. Early digital had lots of issues, especially with treble. Digital has made significant advancements over the years. By comparison, vinyl hasn't. For me, the switch to digital years ago was an easy one. No regrets.
As one who owned high end vinyl rigs for years, I get why some people prefer vinyl. It's a similar vibe to tube gear. Some music genres sound great with vinyl. Old time blues, rock, pop have a certain pleasant nostalgia with vinyl. IMHO, classical music is NOT one of the genres that works well with vinyl.
The most important aspect of this madding hobby is to just enjoy music, regardless of source, electronics, or transducers used.
" Don't look back. Something may be gaining on you"
Satchel Paige
I think that one of the "push-backs" of all-digital is the clarity which is presented. As a musician having performed in hundreds of concerts and thousands of classes and rehearsals, I am sometimes irritated by the clarity of the trombones behind me. I don't hear that clarity on most vinyl reproduction. Does that make "vinyl" "better"?
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We are inclusive and diverse, but dissent will not be tolerated.
You sir, may be onto something. Clarity to me is paramount, as I'm hyper sensitive to any distortion. With rock, one expects some distortion. Do not expect any for classical, or big band for that matter.
" Don't look back. Something may be gaining on you"
Satchel Paige
Nope, The tube amps all distort. Distortion is part of the genre. Musicians use distortion to their advantage. Many live rock concerts have some level of distortion at the event.
" Don't look back. Something may be gaining on you"
Satchel Paige
...distorted guitar from a guitar AMP is not the end result of recording distortion, and that's the original tone from the guitar into and through the distorting amp. Creating said distortion is an ART especially with good fingers and using the resulting tone in its totality.
People say things like you just did too frequently and I'm going to take your feet into the fire for that careless remark. A good home audio system should not 'DISTORT" or impart additional distortion, period.
People throw around words like distortion far to carelessly, so wise up. You started this and I objected - the ruling is final.
You read far too much into the remark. There are a lot of live recordings of rock where there is distortion. Not always easy to discern the source of distortion (recording or playback).The point was that with some rock recordings, one may expect a certain low level of distortion characteristics, especially if it is a live recording. It's a consequence of the genre, not the playback system.
Of course a good audio system should not distort. Most people would understand the remark in its intended consequence.
" Don't look back. Something may be gaining on you"
Satchel Paige
Edits: 03/18/24
Amen!
"Once this was all Black Plasma and Imagination" -Michael McClure
A woman came up to him while he was playing and said "That guitar sounds wonderful".
Chet stopped playing and says "How does it sound now"?
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