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I have noticed that when I compair a record club disc to the retail version that in most cases there is difference in the playback. The one favored seems to slightly lean toward the retail versions. At times the difference is not at all subtile. If I sand the outside edge and "green" it or blacken it with a permenant marker the playback becomes much closer. This seems to point to physical rather than digital quality issues. Any ideas? If this has been beainstormed previously please point me in that direction.
Follow Ups:
Reported differences seem to be consistant with differences reported between various pressing plants.It has often been mentioned that identicle digital masters can be sent to several plants, with the final product(s) variying greatly compared to the original and to each other.
Best,
Ross
My understanding is the record clubs are that because they prss the CDs for retail. They in turn package some of the product for distribution through their clubs.Things may have been different when LPs and Tapes were the media of the day, but what company is going to take the time to make multiple dies for pressing CDs. One for retail and another for clubs?
All I can suggest is consider the source of the original article. Who benefits form slamming clubs? Who is the beneficiary of retail sales? Who advertises where?
I agree there can be a difference from the CDs that first come off the dies compared to those struck 100,000 pressings later, but how different? .....Well....?
havent had problems with sound on rec club discs. good to see that someone else hears the diff with greening CDs tho. its just too much of a pain to do them all.
i didnt even screw around and get the cheeeeeep prices by quitting and joining repeatedly. now i prefer to get my CDs at towerrecords.com due to their 4.95 shipping (unlimited quantity) and 'used' cd pricing (cust rtns,etc) always in perfect shape.
.........regards......tr
Thanks for the responses on this issue. About a third of the discs that I own are from BMG. Several times I have compaired club vs retail if a friend happens to have cd's with them and sometimes it's quite obvious with dynamics and soundstage being compressed on one or the other. This has on occasion caused me to go for the retail version because as best as I can guess it's about 60% of the time that the retail disc will sound better if there is giong to be a difference. I have some Musical Herritage Society cd's from back in the digital stone age that still sound awsome. Go figure. The retail versions on the Polydor label always sounded better and sanding or greening the edge had little if any improvement. The outside edge on those discs are or at least then were convex. The BMG discs all have the same flat edge with a mold line around the edge that at times is rough and will snag a felt tip of a marker or Stoplight pen. I may try to sand the edge of one of these and re green or blacken it and see (hear) what happens. It would help to have an unadultrated disc to compair it to. All I know is something is going on and to me it seems to be a quality (or lack of) issue.
Both BMG and Columbia House clearly represent on their sites that the quality of club cds is the same as retail. If it's true that it is not, then I think there is a basis for a class action law suit.Audiophiles unite, you have nothing to lose except compressed dynamics!
I think all clubs guarantee their stuff and may be able to prove that digitaly that their cd's are the same as retail but it is obvious that the physical discs are not the same. A class action law suit could make some law firm quite wealthy if it could be pulled off. LOL
The glass mastering is not done as careful.It is audible, and I can prove it!Glad you observed this, and it is not always true...but from my vantage point, your comment contains substance. I don't think a novice would hear the difference though..(walkman type system)
I've wondered about the retail/music club question myself.I remember the Stereophile article, and I especially remember a comment that certain classical artists were upset with the sonics on their CDs (retail releases not just music club) - the artists & producers claimed the sound of the CDs was audibly different from the masters and that moreover, the sonics of identical releases varied from different CD plants. Haven't seen much on the topic lately.
A professor friend in Terre Haute IN - home of Sony/Columbia CD plant and Columbia Record Club - told me that one of his students who worked part time at the plant said the retail discs and music club discs were the same, only the packaging was different. While this might be true of Sony/Columbia releases, what about other non-house labels?
I haven't done any A/B testing myself, but I'm going to some day. I have a fairly revealing system.
Our former local Linn dealer, an avid classical music lover and concert goer, and possessor of a very discerning pair of ears, was a member of BMG club and loved it. He advised me not to spend much time worrying over this issue. So I don't. But enquiring minds want to know...
Stereophile talked about this in a full article some years ago - maybe 10yrs ago? Sorry I can't be of more help, someone else here probably can point you to the article.
But I cannot find it in my back issues. If I recall correctly, the article said that the record clubs, notably BMG and Columbia, used every cost saving trick they could to get the cost of the CD down. The article also claimed that, in many cases, the difference in sound quality of the retail CD and the music club CD was often very substantial. But, I agree, on a Discman you would probably not hear a difference.
> > The article also claimed that, in many cases, the difference in sound quality of the retail CD and the music club CD was often very substantial. < <IIRC, an individual was cited in the article as the one making the claim. After the piece was published, a friend and I compared about a dozen record club pressings to their store-bought equivalents; we couldn't hear any difference between them.
Best Wishes,
Felix
I actually think that the Stereophile article in question dates from the 1996-1997 timeframe. I could be mistaken, however, but I seem to remember discussion of the (at the time) new large batch processing methods that the record clubs were using to produce compact discs.If I recall correctly, most record companies were said to leverage (among other technologies) an high-speed Exabyte computer tape-based mass production system to pump out CDs in large volume.
Again, I'm relying solely upon my (admittedly feeble) memory in this regard, so feel free to treat my comments as apocryphal.
Best,
Steve
was written. Ten years ago the cost of making a CD was high, now it's a relatively small portion of the product cost for the biggies. I wonder also if it makes a difference where the CD is made. As a member of the Canadian Columbia House club, most of the CD's I get are made in Canada. Are they better or worse than other club CD's made elsewhere? I'd really like to know, but don't currently have the means to judge for myself. I'll see what I can borrow.I don't understand why the CD versions should sound so different if they're made from the same digital masters, or exact copies of them. I guess it would have to do with the physical media then, cheaping out on its construction or finish?
As an aside, the Columbia/Legacy CD's from the Columbia club sound pretty good, and are worthwhile purchases.
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