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Thanks John, you're right about

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Tanker

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In Reply to: Re: Calling Jon Risch regarding Balanced Power conditioner posted by Jon Risch on July 16, 2006 at 17:21:06:

the unloaded measurement mentioned. It does drop a few volts after being loaded.
I have another question. Is it a good idea to connect the balance power transformer after another isolation power transformer? Or it should connect before the isolation tranny? The reason I am asking is that I have an extra two isolation tranny which are sitting on my shelf at the moment.
My system consist of 4 balanced tranny. One for digital gear. One for preamp and two for my mono block power amp.
Again thanks.

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Re: Thanks John, you're right about - Jon Risch 21:13:06 07/17/06 (2)
pmkap has it right, except for one small detail:
The isolation transformer feeding the balanced transformer MUST have a greater current capacity, or it will limit the capabilities of the balanced transformer.
Even if the transformer rating are equal, then there will be some limting going on.
This has to do witrh the peak current situation, and transformer headroom, etc.
In other words, id es no good, and may actually sound worse, if a wimpy isolation transformer is placed in front of an adequate balanced transformer.
In any case, stay away from ferro-resonant types, seldom do they do more good than harm.

Jon Risch
- John, I read your previous post from the link - Tanker 16:09:00 07/18/06 (1)
  pkmap provided and not clear one one thing. If there's no step down transformer, do I still need to have the cap betweens the isolation front end secondart and the input primary of the balance when I cascaded them?
  I believed you said that the caps between the two tranny only required when you have a step down tranny, is this still correct? or it still gets the benefit to have the cap between the cascade tranny? Also is the cap the larger the better? Thanks
  - Re: John, I read your previous post from the link - Jon Risch 22:16:37 07/18/06 (0)
    The Super Quick & Dirty Digital Isolation Transformers use the fact that we are stepping the voltage way down (almost 5 to 1), and then back up again, to place a very large capacitor across the step-down and the step-up middle section. This means that a UL rated cap is not as necessary, and a larger value cap can be used than could be placed directly across the line, since there would be no leakage current at the component AC output.
    Placing a large cap across the line where the AC power goes into the audio component, can cause a large leakage current to exist, which may or may not become an issue, either for AC ground loops, or for safety reasons.
    pkmap was talking about doing something similar if you had an isolation transformer BEFORE the balanced power transformer (one with sufficiently higher rated powr capacity than the balanced transformer to avoid loss of overall power capacity and dynamics), by placing a moderately large (but AC rated/UL listed cap shunted across the transformers, across the 1st transformer (nominally the larger rated iso) secondary, and the second balanced power transformer primary.
    Even though the voltage is at the full AC power line level, you would still get benefit of the elimination of the leakage currents, AND the balanced power as well.
    In either case, the larger than 'normal' cap would help filter down to a lower frequencyu, and quite possibly filter more hash from the line (going in OR out).
    The Super Quick & Dirty Digital Isolation Transformer circuit was designed to help keep the digital components line radiated EMI/RFI from geting to the rest of the system just as much as it was designed to keep EMI/RFI on the AC powerline out of the digital component.
    
    Jon Risch
Cascading Isolation/Balancing transformers - pmkap 06:03:43 07/17/06 (1)
I'm not Jon, but the conditioners I use, based on Jon's SQ&D Iso trans, essentially takes an isolation transformer and feeds its output to a balancing transformer. If you reversed the order, you would be giving up a specific benenfit of balanced (technical) power, which is the cancellation of reactive leakage currents. The power coming out of an isolation transformer (without grounded center tap) is not balanced, even if it is fed by balanced power. Additional benefits can be had by putting an appropriate X2 (or in larger values, appropriate motor run caps which are for AC accross the line use and have an internal safety mechanism) rated cap 'accross the line' between the transformers. The optimal value of that capacitior (and any bypass caps) depends on the specific transformers used, and would require experimentation. What this capacitor does it 'convert' differential (transverse) mode noise to common mode noise which is effeciently attenuated by the flanking transformers, as discussed in Jon's thread.
- JR's SQ&D Iso conditioner (Open in New Window)
- Thanks for the post, pmkap - Tanker 16:03:32 07/18/06 (0)
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