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Ground for groundless apartment.

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Posted on March 2, 2023 at 17:50:50
Iczerman
Audiophile

Posts: 147
Joined: July 23, 2000
I was installing my Pangea outlets ( the least expensive ones are great for a "starter" outlet) and discovered my apartment has no ground wire.
Can I derive a "ground" by installing a capacitor on the hot and neutral and tying them both to some of those ground tweaky thingys?

 

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RE: Ground for groundless apartment., posted on March 2, 2023 at 21:29:11
gusser
Audiophile

Posts: 3649
Location: So. California
Joined: September 6, 2006
You are on a path to serious trouble here.

An apartment is assumed to be rented. It's not your property to make infrastructure modifications.

It is a violation of the NEC to install grounded outlets where no grounding means exists. It is also not legal to attach electronic components to building wiring unless specifically approved for the purpose.

Just what is the problem you are trying to solve? There maybe another way.

 

RE: Ground for groundless apartment., posted on March 7, 2023 at 07:18:46
Tre'
Industry Professional

Posts: 17292
Location: So. Cal.
Joined: February 9, 2002
That must be an old building.

Are the outlet boxes metal? Is the wiring in metal conduit?

Tre'
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"

 

RE: Ground for groundless apartment., posted on March 7, 2023 at 09:59:12
gusser
Audiophile

Posts: 3649
Location: So. California
Joined: September 6, 2006
Keep in mind metal boxes does not guarantee a ground either. I grew up in a 200yr old farm house that was electrified in the 1940s, after knob and tube wiring was phased out but it used a two wire cloth Romex cable with no ground wire!

 

RE: Ground for groundless apartment., posted on March 9, 2023 at 06:27:08
Posts: 1253
Location: Maine
Joined: August 16, 2011
Hi, I don't know if this is safe but I used to run a wire to my old radiator that is tied into the plumbing.I remember attaching the wire to my amps chassis, side screw on a Dyna 70.....My apartment was groundless too, an extra room in an old house.....Mark Korda

 

RE: Ground for groundless apartment., posted on March 9, 2023 at 10:31:11
gusser
Audiophile

Posts: 3649
Location: So. California
Joined: September 6, 2006
A radiator is a pretty good bet for a ground. Steam and super heated hot water don't do well with plastic pipe.

The old cold water pipe is no longer a sure ground connection as plastic pipe may be used somewhere in the path.

 

RE: Ground for groundless apartment., posted on March 9, 2023 at 11:49:45
Tre'
Industry Professional

Posts: 17292
Location: So. Cal.
Joined: February 9, 2002
Yes I know.

My next question to Iczerman (assuming that he answered the first question in the affirmative) was going to be if he could see that each metal box was wired using metal conduit all the way back to the main breaker box and if he could see if the breaker box was earth grounded.

I was going to go one step at a time so that assumptions were not made.

Tre'
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"

 

RE: Ground for groundless apartment., posted on March 9, 2023 at 23:46:16
For the reason you mentioned about water piping being plastic is cause not to trust the heating system as a ground path. the only possible connection to ground would be through the water make up at the boiler, otherwise it's an isolated system.
8 years ago when I replaced my boiler and had gas run into the house I bonded the water, gas and heating systems to earth ground. The intent was to be proactive and take anything that might stray to ground. It wasn't to provide a ground path for electrical systems.

 

RE: Ground for groundless apartment., posted on March 25, 2023 at 11:40:56
sony6060
Audiophile

Posts: 1465
Location: USA
Joined: August 8, 2014
Building without a ground wire (1966 and earlier) also uses metal water pipes as PVC did not exist back then. The pipes usually make a good ground. Stay away from the capacitors to hot and neutral.

 

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