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In Reply to: RE: Israel and Iran agree to ceasefire to bring end to '12 DAY WAR,' posted by emailtim on June 23, 2025 at 16:10:18
Israel's military boldness has put to shame some of America's military calculations regarding the ME. The U.S. wouldn't strike Syria's chemical program in 2012, thereby enforcing Obama's "red line," because we were terrified of the Russian-made Syrian S-300s. But Israel ran roughshod over Syrian airspace while making a mockery of that integrated air "defense." We were told that Iranian air defense was so secure that nobody could strike there without casualties. But Israel enjoys air dominance over Iran right now, using re-fuelers in daylight hours. We can thank Israel for exposing the fact that Iran is nowhere near as capable as it was made out to be.
Follow Ups:
"Tiny Israel" is by far & away the biggest national recipient of US military and economic aid in history. Has American got value for money? OK, maybe better value that Afghanistan or South Vietnam.You'd think tiny nations ought to have tiny needs ... oh crap : I just noticed the source is USAID, those filthy commies .
NOT the 51st state, eh!?!
Edits: 06/24/25 06/24/25 06/24/25 06/24/25 06/24/25
Ukraine topped Israel's welfare in just 4 years compared to 78 years.
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Because Ukraine wasn't in the top ten as of 2023 would be my guess.
Edits: 06/24/25 06/24/25
Aid to Ukraine would not place it high on the list today. Meanwhile, military aid to Israel has substantially increase since then.Cumulative aid to Ukraine today would be NOWHERE in the range of Israel today.
NOT the 51st state, eh!?!
Edits: 06/25/25
But it would have in 2023 which the chart extends to.
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Last I checked, Israel extends "complete equality of social and political rights to all its inhabitants irrespective of religion, race, or sex." That's worth supporting. Compare that liberal, democratic policy with most of Israel's Arab neighbors. Even women in more politically modern-oriented ME countries, such as Iraq and Jordan, do not enjoy equal rights with men.
It's telling (and a bit amusing) that Israel's military dominance of countries much larger than itself should infuriate a rabid anti-Semite such as yourself. In that respect, you share the same racist mentality and frustration as all those gap-toothed Cletus MAGA types.
Israel certainly does not extend "complete equality of social and political rights" to the 5+ million Palestinians in territories it occupies illegally. For clarity, those occupied territories are (i)Judea & SamariaWest Bank, and (ii) Gaza.
Accusing everyone who criticizes Israel or its government of being "antisemitic" has been the standard meme for decades. It's a deflection and a slur, and it isn't generally true.
NOT the 51st state, eh!?!
Spot on
Especially if there is no intention to ever pay it back :).
I'd go further and send female commandos to liberate Arab world from such injustice.Mind you , I wouldn't send them against Russians but against Arab army ? Easy.
First assault contingent should be black Mamas of NYC
Edits: 06/24/25
And not shoot from Iraq air space.
If they were paper tiger there wouldn't be a cease fire. The families of scientists murdered in targeted night attacks surely were a paper targets. Wives , daughters and sons along with all the sleeping neighbors, and that's on us. Actually on You.
Edits: 06/24/25
...you're drunk again and doing a passable imitation of Baghdad Bob.
I still didn't see flying Israeli jets. Just a drone filmed material of targets being hit god knows where from.
Part of the problem with losing wars is that we constantly lie to ourselves . I wouldn't want to be in a place of B2 pilots forced into 'Heroes" role after that BS staged attack. No wonder there is so many suicides in US army. I'd drink myself to death but US pilots fighting in Gaza seem to absolutely love mass killing civilians there. For honor and freedom of course
Why limit Iranian enrichment peacefully when you can bomb them instead?
Is it any wonder that most of the world considers the US and Israel rogue states?
... you would continue to trust Iran to stick to their promises about limiting enrichment and use of Uranium ?
We can only make it hard(er) for them to go forward with Jihad.
And have to finance audio purchases from a secret funds..
Our own nuclear inspecting bodies constantly lie to us. There are only two trustworthy bodies. One belongs to Bibi the other is the First Secretary. No one else poses the knowledge
"This aggression will not stand, man." - Jeffrey Lebowski "The Dude"
"Is it any wonder that most of the world considers the US and Israel rogue states?"
Gee, Chris, last I checked the U.S. was viewed as a global superpower with a significant role in international affairs. No other country can match our economic/military dynamism. That does not fit the definition of a rogue state. Would you mind sharing your sources for your latest moronic accusation? Fever swamps of idiocy such as the Grayzone and Caitlin Johnstone do not qualify.
Allowing Iran's batshit crazy theocrats, who are on record (numerous times) calling for the extermination of Israel and America, does not strike me as a prudent policy. But I'm confident that a Putin poodle such as yourself will disagree.
"Why limit Iranian enrichment peacefully when you can bomb them instead?"
You remain an amusing albeit ignorant little fellow. ~:)
Snippet:
"Since May 2019, however, Iran has continued to violate the terms of the JCPOA agreement. It has lifted the cap on its stockpile of uranium, which is now 30 times the level permitted; increased its enrichment activities to 60%, significantly beyond the 3.67% permitted under the JCPOA; expanded its enrichment capabilities and resumed activity at nuclear facilities that were previously prohibited under the terms of the deal. The International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) says it has been prevented from satisfactorily monitoring Iran's nuclear activities since February 2021....The UK, France and Germany and the US contend that there is no credible civilian justification for Iran's nuclear programme."
"last I checked the U.S. was viewed as a global superpower with a significant role in international affairs"
The US IS a global superpower - but a declining one and a dangerous one. A country which relies on sanctions, coups and military attacks to get what it wants. Lots of violence and very little cooperation. (BTW, how's Nuland's "Ukraine Project" working out for you? Geez, these days, we can't even keep all of our vassal states in Europe lined up.)
"No other country can match our economic/military dynamism."
Oops! It looks like maybe we gave too much away to Ukraine. Remember how we were promising Zelensky that we'd help him finish off Putin in no time at all, and, with our Wunderwaffen and "superior" training, drive the Russian scum from Crimea? And, a couple of months ago, didn't we just have a war with the Houthis in Yemen? And we couldn't even beat them? Kind of undermines your "dynamism" argument, doesn't it? As for our "economic dynamism", why don't you keep your head buried in the sand for a bit longer and see what the economic situation in the US is in a few months or another year.What's our national debt? 37 trillion? And we're having an ever increasing problem finding buyers for this debt. But no problem! Just keep whistling your happy tune!
"Would you mind sharing your sources for your latest moronic accusation? Fever swamps of idiocy such as the Grayzone and Caitlin Johnstone do not qualify."
Quite a few more sources than just Grayzone and Caitlin, including a couple of British ambassadors, now retired so they can speak freely. Also a couple of US Colonels, also now retired so they can speak freely. What are YOUR sources? The dumb-ass mainstream media, which you follow on your knees?
"Allowing Iran's batshit crazy theocrats, who are on record (numerous times) calling for the extermination of Israel and America, does not strike me as a prudent policy. But I'm confident that a Putin poodle such as yourself will disagree."
Ahem! I'll overlook the fact that your first sentence doesn't even make sense. Allowing them to what? But in any case, I see you have no actual argument - just name calling. What about all our own Senators and Congressional Reps, whose simple-minded answer to every problem is, as McCain used to say, "Bomb, bomb, bomb. . . "?
Finally, your quote from the UK Parliament House of Commons Library doesn't impress me at all, originating as it does from one of the most bloodthirsty regimes (the British Empire) in world history. Frankly, I don't find much from the British government very credible. Here's some homework for you: how many people in India were murdered as a result of British colonial rule? How many in China? Your smug self-satisfaction and identification with Western colonialism is rather unbecoming, I'd say. But whatever - suit yourself.
One of my sources:
View YouTube Video
"I'll overlook the fact that your first sentence doesn't even make sense."
Good catch. Serves me right for multi-tasking. Allowing Iran's batshit crazy theocrats, who are on record (numerous times) calling for the extermination of Israel and America, to acquire nuclear weapons, does not strike me as prudent policy.
But I'm afraid that's all you've accomplished here. Other than flooding the zone with non sequiturs. When I asked you for credible sources, all you could dredge up were two disgruntled former British ambassadors and a couple of cranky U.S. Colonels. Which is about what I would expect from an America-hating kook and Grayzone devotee who thinks more of Putin's murderous dictatorship than your own country and hangs onto every word an obscure hack (Caitlin Johnstone) writes. Speaking of which, On 2 January 2024, Caitlin posted this little gem on X:
"Don't worry, Israel will be at peace once it defeats Hamas.
Well, first it'll need to conquer Syria, eliminate Hezbollah and Ansarallah, achieve regime change in Iran..."
Working on it babycakes. What a difference 18 months makes. ~:)
In your insane worldview, the entire Western media and NATO are conspiring to wreck Russia and its allies. Only you, an obscure Aussie journalist, and Putin know the truth! The mullahs aren't the only ones who are batshit crazy.
OTOH, let's take a look at how your mainstream sources fared:
- Ukraine has withstood and repelled the mighty Russian military through Western support, Russian blundering, and its own resourcefulness. -Council on Foreign Relations
- Ukraine can win this war against Russia. Ukrainian forces may be able to drive Russian troops back from Ukraine's cities toward the Russian borders. They may be able to establish ground and air defenses strong enough to preclude renewed Russian attacks for a long time. They may be able to show the Russian military, if not Russian President Vladimir Putin, that Russia's military conquest of Ukraine is off the table. There can be no better outcome of this war for the U.S., NATO and free peoples everywhere. -The Hill
- "So it [Russia] has already lost a lot of military capability," [Lloyd] Austin said. "And a lot of its troops, quite frankly. And we want to see them not have the capability to very quickly reproduce that capability." Biden administration officials are optimistic that that is an achievable goal, sources told CNN. Administration officials and congressional sources said they believe that the continued military support to Ukraine could result in significant blows to Russia that will impair their long-term military capabilities, strategically benefiting the US. -CNN
etc., etc., etc.
Ah! Wouldn't you love to return to those halcyon days, when the US (oops! I mean Ukraine!) had Russia on the ropes - at least according to our dumb-ass MSM. I'm sure you'd love to return to those days, Reg. Or perhaps, with your steady diet of MSM reporting, you think those days are still with us - LOL!
In any case, let's now check how Israel is doing against Caitlin's checklist:
Israel will be at peace once it defeats Hamas - Too bad! Not accomplished, despite Israel's continuing genocide in Gaza.
first it'll need to conquer Syria - Yes, you could say it has "conquered" part of the country.
eliminate Hezbollah and Ansarallah - So you mean to claim that Israel has eliminated Hezbollah and the Houthis? Unbelievable - you need to hold off on your victory laps. In fact, the Houthis just chased the US away from Yemen - and you could confirm that yourself, even in your crazy wrong mainstream propaganda sources!
achieve regime change in Iran - That's going to be hard to do with Israeli infrastructure destroyed to the extent it is. Ever wonder why Netanyahu doesn't want anybody to see it? So Trump thinks he bought Israel some time to recover. We'll see.
Eventually, you'll realize who is really batshit crazy - but, in the meantime, you can get a clue by just looking in the mirror.
And Bozo, and Rubicon make Putin look like a legitimate statesman.
"Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. "
― W.C. Fields
He has already completed 6 holes.
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Can everyone just wait till the weekend to start WWIII please?
One of the points raised by skeptics of U.S. involvement insofar as bombing Iran's nuclear facilities, was that Iran's allies (China, Russia and others) would step up and stand firm with Iran. But thus far the response from Iran's allies has been rather muted. ~:)
Admittedly, it's still early. Doesn't mean we won't see it in the coming days and weeks. But so far...crickets. Perhaps that's because this alliance of malfeasance is definitely an alliance of one-way relationships. When Assad was under serious threat Putin failed to back his old buddy. China will always be a transactional actor, primarly looking to establish their forward presence by engaging in predatory lending and military sales, but not much interested in backing up their proxies when they are in harms way. So, should the U.S. become more aggressive, we will probably hear the usual wailing and gnashing of teeth from Putin and company, but little more than that. It's paper tigers all the way down.
China is focused on business and has little interest in helping Iran save face. I do think that calculus may change if we openly seek regime change, not because China/Russia see the Ayatollah as a worthy ally with whom they need to stand. But because Russia does not want to deal with what gets *loosed* should the mullahs be overthrown in a popular uprising, which the Iranian people very much want. Despite the popular sentiment in Iran for regime change, it would not be a smooth transition. Putin knows that and fears the consequences of such change . People tend to forget that Iran is not just Persian. There are the Baloch separatist movements, Kurdish independence movements, the Marxist MEK crowd, and don't forget ISIS. Those homicidal psychopaths are still there. Yes, there will be chaos should the regime fall. And that's the last thing Putin wants near his own backyard, as his inept and beleaguered military still struggles in Ukraine.
So, if we do shift to a policy openly promoting regime change, I think we can look forward to some diplomatic and economic pushback from Xi and Putin, but nothing of a military nature. Even Putin isn't careless and stupid enough to fly jets against us. Nor will Putin put boots on the ground in Tehran. Perhaps North Korea, who sells soldiers for food will. Don't look for much military resistance from Xi or his bitch, Putin. They have far bigger problems to deal with.
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