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In Reply to: RE: Aren't audio enthusiasts inevitably classical music aficionados? posted by tinear on November 17, 2011 at 09:16:46
More posers at the symphony concert hall than any other musical venue. The average Joe at any rock concert knows the material at his show better than most classical concert goers do at their show.
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but here in Chicago, at the venues I visit, audience is very familiar with the artists, composers and pieces, not to mention that they can recognize great from good performance, etc.
As much as rock concert audience, they have to know about 10 to 20 simple songs from the certain group.
Now, compare that with scope of work of any well known classical composer, than add different performers of the same and on top different transcriptions.
So, are there pieces that I and classical audience in general are not familiar? Absolutely. Does not make it less enjoyable.
I live in L.A.
"As much as rock concert audience, they have to know about 10 to 20 simple songs from the certain group."
Actually there are any number of bands out there that have twenty or more albums.
"Now, compare that with scope of work of any well known classical composer, than add different performers of the same and on top different transcriptions."
Why would I make that comparison. Maybe in Chicago they keep the program and the performers a secret. here in L.A. they let you know well in advance what is playing and who is playing it.
"So, are there pieces that I and classical audience in general are not familiar? Absolutely. Does not make it less enjoyable."
And yet on any given day we have people snoozing in the audience....
Or can not count. It would be useless arguing further, but I will just note on thing regarding
"And yet on any given day we have people snoozing in the audience..."
On many rock concerts many would, but can't because of the noise.
You lost the argument and now you are whining about it.
...to contrast knowing all three chords and both verses of the average pop/rock/blues song to ... what? ... a Beethoven symphony/string quartet/piano sonata? "Knowing the material" here requires worlds more effort/experience/time/interest.
You don't need a masters in musicology to be familiar with the program. Heck they actually tell you what they are going to play and who is going to play it in advance.
Fact is most rock fans actually devote more time to the artists they love and know the material better. You will see more posers at a classical concert than just about any rock concert.
d
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=poser
Your source definitely is at your level: "1.one who pretends to be someone whose not.
2. who tries to fit in but with exaggeration."
Wow.
There is a vast difference between "poser" and "poseur." You would be the latter, though you seem to lack self-awareness.
"There is a vast difference between "poser" and "poseur."
But I wrote poser didn't I? Not my fault you didn't understand it.
"You would be the latter, though you seem to lack self-awareness."
I lack selfawareness because you didn't know what the word meant? There is that irony again....
...I'd say the average age of the attendees was 70.
I read an article a while back that claimed that, while the concert audience is graying and shrinking, the overall classical audience has grown. Younger people are just more likely to listen to recordings and radio.
...the overall classical music audience has grown.
There are fewer music programs in schools and fewer classical radio stations.
Symphony orchestras, like in Philadelphia, are going bankrupt.
Where do they get exposed?
...and fewer classical radio stations.
Broadcast, perhaps. A Squeezebox Touch provides free access to over 25 not counting pay-for-service you may also be able to access.
Where do they get exposed?
How about the movies? I'll you'll find quite a few soundtracks are classical in nature. I suspect a lot of kids will be watching the new Twilight film out today. The composer of that series, Alexander Desplat, also composed music from the last three Harry Potter films. I remember enjoying Star Trek, Star Wars, ET, Close Encounters , etc. when I was a teenager. What really got me started was Emerson, Lake & Palmer's arrangements of classical pieces.
rw
programs in schools that are volunteer-driven. The lack of formal education has been dwindling NOT because of interest, but rather because of conservative politics that has squeezed school budgets.
As far as age: yes, the age is older at classical concerts than at hip-hop, but I'd not say any older than at the "dinosaur" rockers' concerts. I frequently attend the Eugene Symphony and there's a mix of ages.
...when my daughters, now in their 20s, were younger.
My youngest took piano for a number of years and then moved to guitar.
None of what she learned was classical.
Music in school?
Her middle school has a famous jazz band and teacher.
She took woodshop because she showed a talent in building her own furniture for her American Girl dolls.
Neither were ever exposed to classical music.
I found the article I mentioned. Some interesting a surprising statistics in it, though they refer to the 90's, including:
In 1997, 15.6 attended a classical music concert over the year, an average of 3 concerts per person.
41% listen to classical radio at least once a year
34% indicated they have listened to classical recordings at least once a year.
Between 1982 and 1997, the percentage of /Americans who reported listening to classical music on the radio increased from 18 percent to 41 percent of the adult population.
That last figure apparently reflects the contribution of non-profit radio stations, since more profitable pop and talk have for the most part driven classical music from the airwaves.
Where the article I think is weakest is in its treatment of the demographics of the total audience. He rightly points out that the younger people are, the less likely they are to go to concerts, beginning with the boomers. But he asserts that younger people are listening to more broadcasts and recordings. That's undoubtedly true, but in the absence of direct evidence, it's hard to know what the total size of the younger audience is.
I do think that there will always be people who listen to classical music, just as there will always be people who read Shakespeare, because it will be passed down within families, is still taught at the better schools, and is on the radio for those who are interested enough to discover it.
Actually, I download from Dimeadozen 3 or 4 domestic FM classical performances a week. Also several DB broadcasts from Europe.
As far as finances go, one of the things crooks like Sandy Weil of Citi do is donate millions to keep these orchestra afloat.
One the tennis partners I train with is 26. Plays violin in the local orchestra and listens mainly to classical...and get this...some rap.
You know this how?
experience. Extensive experience.
Well, I can't speak from experience of the people at the symphony since I never asked, but nobody I know who listens to classical music in person is like that at all, far from it.
hehehe yeah it would not surprise me to find you or anyone else around here whose friends are better informed than most of the crowd. I have this bad habbit of listening in on what others are saying and this good habbit of talking to total strangers about the concerts. but even a more general observation has shown the audiences respond to warhorse material and name performers regardless of how well any given piece is performed. Just recently I attended a few concerts where a friend of mine was the soloist and much to my surprise many of the folks around me had no idea who she was. never heard of her!
You go to just about any rock concert, especially the one's with dinosaurs and most of the people in the crowd can sing most of the songs word for word.
IME rock fans and jazz fans tends to know the material much better than the folks you find at classical concerts.
One thing is almost a given at any classical concert. There will be a few people in choice seats sleeping. That just kills me.
Another thing that is a given is a standing ovation for any name performer no matter how bad they were. I refuse. You have to earn it from me.
Generally speaking, while supportive, the rock fans tend to know when the artists sucked.
Guess that's what happens when they average concert-goer's age is 70. :-)
Seriously, I've always found audiences reacted appropriately to the performance. Most of my concert going was in New York, though, the audiences may have been more musically astute than elsewhere. The response never included booing or catcalls and included at a minimum polite applause, but standing ovations were reserved for especially good performances. The worst reaction I ever saw was applause so tepid that there was no call for an encore; the performer shrugged and gave one anyway (that was a highly regarded French baroque group -- the group was indeed extraordinary, but the soloist and group founder wasn't as good as his own group). The most extraordinary was at a Horowitz concert -- his pianissimos were so preternaturally soft and precise that the audience literally gasped. Worst reaction I ever heard about was Leonard Bernstein walking out on some modern piece, which, of course, mattered because he was Leonard Bernstein.
I don't doubt that most in the audience prefer potboilers, the most sophisticated music is always a minority taste. Also, in today's classical world, the music sits in the front row, with the performers, however skilled, behind. Conversely, we've come to expect a very high level of technical proficiency. Standards are so high that there really aren't any bad performers on the stage of a major concert hall, so there isn't any cause to boo the performers.
are society affairs, garnering big local press. The main focus of the coverage is what designer dress the females were wearing.
I'd think that post-Opening Night, the audience is more music oriented.
Opening night, definitely. And there are always people who get dragged to the symphony, although as far as I know they're a minority at most concerts. At least I've never known any -- the people I've invited to classical concerts who didn't like classical just said they didn't want to go.
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