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Original page Excerpt :" ...... Tech Note: If you've ever been in a traditional radio station with turntables - and I probably date myself here - you've seen a pair of heavy-duty, high-torque turntables in a gray steel console that weighs several hundred pounds. DJs can be clumsy in their hyperactive way, and the console has to be heavy enough to withstand a DJ colliding full-force against it without the phonograph jarring or skipping a groove. As a result, broadcast turntables, even as far back as the 1930s, were always mounted in consoles weighing hundreds of pounds. When audiophiles listen to turntables that were actually used for AM and FM radio broadcasts - Garrard 301 and 401, Thorens TD 124, various models of EMT, various Technics models - they were all intended for mounting in far heavier consoles than typical lightweight domestic TT bases.
The re-discovery of what appear to be massive TT bases is nothing more than using these turntables as they were originally meant to be used.
And - surprise, surprise - they sound really good, just as they did back in the days of quality FM broadcasting ..... "Lynn Olson, 2005
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groove
Follow Ups:
so unless i've read it wrong the high massof those consoles were primarily to keep drunk disk jockeys from skipping a record not for energy sink. If you want a home situation where you will not invite drunk disk jockeys then less mass can be gotten by with.So the 70 pound plinths are ... overkill ... trendy cynical marketing ...audiophile wahoo? Yes?
~Slainte, Pardner
The OMalley
I've seen this page before. However now the context seems to click for me.Idler drive combined with a high mass mount = as good as it can be.
'Best mount would be a solid block extending from the bedrock beneath ones home to support the turntable of your choice. Any turntable would benefit from such a siting. Next best would be what is described at the link.
'Not sure what to make of 'active air suspension supports' or if they can compete with the simple high mass approach.
-Steve
Steve,I used to sell high quality precision scales to labs and often times these labs are in multiple story buildings with lots of vibration going on.
Strapping a scale to a 350 lb marble base would really help lock in a great deal more accuracy.
Since a diamond tracing the groove wall is basically measuring the groove in a similar way that a scale would measure weight it seems intuitive that a high mass base with a non-suspended turntable would trace the groove more accurately.
Interestingly, in my experience the weight needs to be in the base and not in the plinth. I have found too much plinth mass to constrain the sound and deaden the PRAT.
Of course every vintage turntable requires its own receipe to sound best. Synergy comes from system matching and attention to detail.
I am a high mass base advocate. Others seem to prefer a solid but light mass wall mount. I think there are reasons to say both approaches are not only valid, but simply the best way to deal with the building you are dealing with.
You can take either approach and still end up with some awesome sound.
Here's public notice. Please do not post to my threads. Don't post references to me or my name or my projects or my posts.
You-- and all regulars here--- are well aware of why I would ask that.
I won't bore everyone by adding long lists of ridiculous claims you've made on this board, I've mentioned those enough.What I propose is that you stay away from posting to my threads and I'll stay well away from yours.
This will no doubt be seen as a benefit to you. No more questioning or fact-checking from me.What you'll also have to refrain from is all those little mentions you like to make --"jd won't like this one" ... "jd doesn't agree with me" ... "wonder if jd..." ..blah blah blah.
Cut the crap and back off. We're not old pals, nor will we ever be, nor are we sparring partners. We're not colleagues of any sort. Clear enough ?
Once again : DON'T WASTE ANY FURTHER TIME REPLYING TO MY POSTS.
J.D.
The owner's materials that I have for my Russco Mk V Broadcast Deluxe turntable recommend another Russco product which is indeed a waist-high steel cabinet/plinth intended to be filled with sand. According to the old-tyme engineer I spoke with when taking it off the radio station's hands, that's exactly how they used it, and that the sand-filled cabined weighed hundreds of pounds. Someday I'll construct such a cabinet and do some A-B listening, but for the time being a wall mount and (presumably) vibration-draining plinth sound great to me.
InDaGroove's awesome table (you can see it in the asylum gallery) is on a 300lb + base. He turned up the volume of the system to normal listening levels, dropped the needle on the LP (not spinning) and then tapped on the plinth, the base, and other parts of the table to show me what gets through the amplification chain.I could hear the tapping but it was down some 36-48db. Try that on your system at home! Mine is not nearly that quiet.
The PRAT on his table was very close to the PRAT on my Rek O Kut. I am ecstatic about the performance of my Rek O Kut and I did not expect a Teres turntable motor to generate the same level of performance.
However InDaGroove's turntable sounds extremely similar to my Rek O Kut and that ultra high mass turntable bass has a great deal going for it. It sounds like live music and that is a tribute to the high mass base approach to sound reproduction. It also had excellent top to bottom frequency response so it sounded extremely natural right along with sounding life like and real.
There are some other aspect to the base I have left out. InDaGroove can fill these in if he would like to do so.
I know that I could sit in his listening room, close my eyes and see the performers. I can do this in my own system and his system was the only other I have visited to give me that same overall effect.
InDaGrooves table caught that same magic in spades and the 300lb base probably gets the table that much closer to perfect.
I think a solid cabinet for a Russco with sand or sand and shot would be ideal. Sand is a superb resonance trap.
This was also explained to me by a long-time LP12 owner as being a technique for determining resonance problems in a suspended table--and as a setup and tuning tool. The shorter the sound (the less ring) the better, indicating the degree to which the table is efficiently dispensing with external vibrations. In that case my understanding is that dampening itself isn't a goal. But I see the benefits of working to minimize the amount of mechanical sound getting to the stylus, for sure. This was a major goal in the things I did to my Russco to eliminate or drain mechanical sounds that were previously getting to the stylus via the platter and armboard. After some work, I got lucky as no rumble or other mechanical sounds can be heard even in an LPs dead wax now. However tapping is certainly heard! Some day I'll make a tall hollow mount and fill it with sand, and I won't be surprised if it again transforms the sound.
I *LOVE* gray hammertone. Best color ever.
--
Al G
Born To Tinker!
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