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In Reply to: Turntable design & audio snobbery - What is a turntable supposed to DO? posted by soundnut on September 7, 2006 at 17:53:18:
"So - what is the function of a turntable? Not the arm or cartridge, but the turntable itself? I would say it is to spin the record at a constant speed & keep the record free from undue vibration or noise generated by the room or the motor. If a turntable does these things, then I would say it's achieved it's goal."....Snobbery? Nonsense.
Actually, you missed the most significant role of the turntable. That is to provide a stable and tuneful environment to fix the tonearm/cartridge system to. You can't separate these components from each other. They need to work as a system and together they provide the "voice" of the final product.If the plinth is made of materials that are not music-friendly (some would say that certain acrylics, lead and other metals, and Corian would fit in that category) or if it is unstable, not level, etc. it doesn't matter if you are using a $10,000 tonearm/cartridge combo. It's still going to sound like crap. Very expensive crap!
Since you have these three turntables, go ahead and rotate a single tonearm/cartridge combo to all three. I guarantee that with at least one of the turntables, you are going to say to yourself, "Gee this cartridge sounds like crap."
The cartridge is always the first piece to get blamed, but it's usually just a really bad resulting resonance between the various pieces that make up the turntable system.An analogy would be like putting Michelin racing tires on a pickup truck. They may be the best handling tire on the market, but they would not automatically make that pickup truck handle like a sports car.
Close to the Edge, down by the river....
-Ray
Follow Ups:
Hey Ray.You said:
If the plinth is made of materials that are not music-friendly (some would say that certain acrylics, lead and other metals, and Corian would fit in that category) or if it is unstable, not level, etc. it doesn't matter if you are using a $10,000 tonearm/cartridge combo. It's still going to sound like crap. Very expensive crap!
& I said:
"So - what is the function of a turntable? Not the arm or cartridge, but the turntable itself? I would say it is to spin the record at a constant speed & keep the record free from undue vibration or noise generated by the room or the motor. If a turntable does these things, then I would say it's achieved it's goal."
So basically, we're on the same page.
And you also said:
"Since you have these three turntables, go ahead and rotate a single tonearm/cartridge combo to all three. I guarantee that with at least one of the turntables, you are going to say to yourself, "Gee this cartridge sounds like crap."
The cartridge is always the first piece to get blamed, but it's usually just a really bad resulting resonance between the various pieces that make up the turntable system."Once again, I'm in agreement. My basic point was that the setup, system "harmony", and build quality & design of the product is of much more importance than whether it's a belt, DD, or idler. And spending a fortune on a turntable is fine if that's your bag. But truly fine performance is achievable on a good non-megabuck turntable through proper matching of tonearm/cartridge/turntable and by proper geometry and setup.
You are right on target, of course. I am using acrylic and lead in my DIY, but as you once told me, a little goes a long way. I used a little in places, and those places where I used a lot were very carefully considered. Still, you can find megabuck turntables that are basically solid acrylic for a plinth with lead tossed around indiscriminately simply because because acrylic looks glitzy, and lead sounds good on a brochure. Well, looks are great, but you don't listen to looks or brochures. There needs to be a balance. So, do you buy any four hundred dollar turntable, and assume it is nearly as good as the best? If you are an idiot, you do. There are good inexpensive solutions, and there are fantastic expensive ones that are actually designed with performance in mind. What there isn't is a free lunch. You will spend either time or money, or both, to get great results, or you'll run into a major stroke of luck. You won't get top results from a commercial product for a cheap price because like I said before, there is no such thing as a free lunch.
"You won't get top results from a commercial product for a cheap price" ...A good place to learn has been this NAD. Each upgrade adds something and you get hands on experience with the concepts while improving your lot as you go. Tweekability, in this case, is a benefit.
Now, in the end, I could probably get all the components into a plinth that is built 'like' what I now have but diverges on what I've learned. Use a DC motor, mass mass mass, two arm accomodating, etc etc. This might be called fun.
Since I know that there is more to be had a 'set and forget' table would merely, well I WANT to improve it.
I don't want to spend megabucks and I think that any of us that think our entry level tables are any more than that are deluded....that doesn't mean I am not an idiot. I don't think I get off that easily.
"...Tweekability, in this case, is a benefit."Indeed!
The original VPI 19 (Audio Linear TD-4001) and the AR XA were great test beds.
I am on my third go around on a DIY and the design will represent the sum total of everything I have learned from my previous efforts and tables that I have tweaked.There is no free lunch, unless you are a copycat :-)
Close to the Edge, down by the river....
-Ray
Tom
.
Close to the Edge, down by the river....
-Ray
Tom
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