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In Reply to: Re: ...and speaking of oyaide posted by kenster on April 2, 2007 at 18:09:17:
"Have U tried retuning your system for the increase in resolution that the Oyaides provide?"okay, i'll play along... why don't you take a look at my system and tell me what you think i'm doing wrong. it sounds great with the furutech receptacle in place.
Follow Ups:
"why don't you take a look at my system and tell me what you think i'm doing wrong"I see U have a highly modified GTA SE-40 amp which is being fed by a modified Denon 2900. I assume it has it's own volume control as U don't have a preamp.
I also see U have employed an Isoclean 105Fll power strip but are only using one of the 4 available outlets. Either I'm missing something or U haven't listed all of the components your using in your system.
What I'm wondering is if U only have 2 components that draw electricity, why the Isoclean outlet strip? In addition, I would suggest U relocate the Isoclean from the rack to the floor and spike it thru the carpet to the floor beneath. Also insert child safety caps in the unused outlets to dampen their parasitic resonances.
U also list 3 Elrod power cords. I assume one powers the amp, the other powers the CD player and the 3rd powers the outlet strip? I am going to assume U are using one Elrod from the wall outlet to the outlet strip and then another Elrod to one of the components. That right there is most likely causing some of your problems.
If U could provide us with more system details, we just might be able to solve your Oyaide dilemma :-)
Cheers,
~kenster
P.S. Very nice system. Looks to be like a musical powerhouse!
okay... yes, the apl denon has it's own digital attenuator, so i've found that i like it much more without a preamp. the isoclean is there because of the increased detail, resolution and air it ads to the system. the other purpose for the unit is that it has a filter for any digital noise. i had a modified bpt jr. in there before and the isoclean was a huge improvement.your assumption was correct; the elrod sig. 2 feeds the isoclean, which feed another elrod sig 2 that powers the player. the elrod sig. 3 is plugged in to the wall and feeds the amp.
i'll try your suggestion of moving the isoclean to the floor, but i'm wondering what i may hope to gain from this. i also happen to have a ton of the child safety plugs, so that's an easy one.
"I am going to assume U are using one Elrod from the wall outlet to the outlet strip and then another Elrod to one of the components. That right there is most likely causing some of your problems."
i'm not sure what you're getting at there.
"i'll try your suggestion of moving the isoclean to the floor, but i'm wondering what i may hope to gain from this."With the Isoclean sitting on a shelf of your rack, it is going to modulated by the vibrations that are imparted on the shelf.
I am going to assume U have a cement floor under the carpet and if so, excellent. Make sure the Isoclean has firm contact via all 4 spikes thru to the cement floor. It should feel "solid" without any rocking motion and U may want to add additional weight to the top of the unit.
A little trick I use is to punch a hole in the carpet/padding with a phillips screw driver where the spikes will penetrate. This makes firm contact ALOT easier.....just don't do it when your significant other is around!!
"i'm not sure what you're getting at there."
Anytime there is a connection made via plugs/outlets, resolution is lost no matter how good the plugs/outlets are and with the Isoclean on the rack shelf, alot of resolution is being lost due to the observation sited above.
Try those tweaks and report back.
Cheers,
so i'm in there putting some safety plugs in and it occurs to me (for some reason) to look at the tubes in my amp... one of the drivers is "spotting" on top. so i shut everything down, replaced the tube with a fresh vt-231 and voila! the sound stage is back, the bass has returned and i have all the resolution i was looking for in the first place! it would appear that i've been the victim of an odd coincidence? i'm not sure how everything can be fine, then when i unplug it all, replace the receptacle and turn it all back on, one tube goes south, but that would appear to be the case.so, i'll apologize if i've wasted anyone’s time, thank all who responded, continue to implement kenster's tweek ideas and try to hold my ever so slightly embarrassed head up.
It's been a thoughtful thread so no worries, IMO. I'm glad you found the solution since I figured the original SWO-XXX and likely the Ultimo version should do fine with your Elrod's Furutech FI-15M(G) AC plug. If you now find the SWO-XXX Ultimo to be more satisfactory, but still pine for the Furutech FP-15A(Cu) AC outlet's more organic gestalt, ask Lee at CryoParts if he will do a return exchange for the new Oyaide R1 platinum + palladium, beryllium copper AC outlet. The R1 sounds like an FP-15A(Cu) mated with an SWO-XXX who then gave birth to a friggin GIANT :-)BTW, the R1 is *very* worthy of being mounted on an Oyaide WPC-Z aluminum bracket/carbon fiber faceplate system if you can afford it.
well duster, it's crazy: the xxx ultimo has now transformed my system and my system was no slouch before. i'm doing the whole "listening to all my old recordings again" thing and i now think my system is even better than i thought it was. i'll be picking up the wpc-xxx from lee in the next week or so. he was really great about this whole thing from the get-go, letting me burn it in for months with the promise of allowing me to return it if i wasn't happy with it. he's a top notch guy, who is good on his word.
What are ac plugs on your pc's that are going into the Oyaide?
"What are ac plugs on your pc's that are going into the Oyaide? "i believe david elrod uses furutech plugs as a matter of fact. do you think the synergy between the two is the problem here?
If it Rhodium my feeling is that it would not work well with the XXX outlet. Maybe you could recap for me what you are hearing that is unpleasent.I use the GX outlets and have liked them very much pretty much from the time I put them in the wall. All the cords that I make though use the 046 ends. I found the GX to have a very neutral presention with my system and to have great detail and extension without any etch.
I have also used the Furu Cu and Au recpt. and while tonally the where nice, the Cu suited my taste more so as the Au was a touch too warm, they couldn't match the Oyaide for detail, freq extention, and stage depth. I also think the Oyaide a better constructed as I had on both Furu recpt. a screw head sheer off while trying to tighten it down.
....that the particular platings are fighting each other in this instance. Duster and Kenster have heartily recommended a like-like combination of connector and outlet for some time. They've done a lot of careful listening, so I would rely on their findings. The Furutech/Furutech, or Oyaide/Oyaide connections seem to offer the optimal synergies.
While I don't think that your aquarium is totally sufficient for fully conditioning the XXX (in terms of high current), four months of constant current draw is a hell of a long time for any electrical part. I'm sensing that the XXX is simply not your sonic cup of tea, whereas the Furutech is.And that's where the rubber meets the road....your personal preference. Stick to what you enjoy. You don't *have* to like the XXX. It is entirely possible, as Kenster suggests, that you might need to re-balance your system with the XXX. This could entail more changes to cabling, equipment supports, or other tried-and-true adjustments. However, if you feel that the Furutech is providing the overall musical balance you like, then leave it be.
thanks for your thoughts alan. i agree with you completly on the subject of personal sonic preference. i've spent a the good part of tha past twenty years playing around with components, cables and isolation, and enjoy the entire process very much. i've heard many plateus of sonic bliss while wondering down the upgrade/tweeking path, so i'll generally try out the latest flavor of the day as it more often than not renders something that i find pleasing... that's just not the case this time and i'm wondering (as i've already stated) if i'm being premature or not. the only reason i asked the question in the first place is that i made a post about it back when i first purchased it and found that no one seemed to like the swo-xxx ultimo . i was wondering if that had changed with more time or not.
He did a recent testing, A/B, of the GX ultimo, the Furu (old version) Cu, an MRI outlet, and a tweaked P&S. His were not burnt in (except the tweaked older one). He told me his preferences in his system were: Ultimo, MRI, Furu in that order downward, and he's swapped out a few for the Ultimos. He does not have any special plugs in his system as yet, so this was an outlet to outlet shootout on his mail wall outlet to his Wadia source, not plug and outlet synergistic testing at all. (Use search.)Al's system is very nuanced and revealing. While I could not tell any difference (hadn't visited in several months), he could, but said the diff was of a subtle variety between the GX and the Furu. He wasn't sure if he would get the exact same result had he tried the Furu gold version, which would have been a more direct match.
He went through this after I touted the Furu Cu from my system, so that's where he started. Until that time he'd been happy with the tweaked older non-audio outlets.
I found the Furu Cu a big jump in my system after the tweaked P&S outlets. My FM tells me that all by itself, so it's not a complex interaction with the CD/digital source end of my system.
My guess is that this is idiosyncratic, not definitive, and that your taste and your system synergies are the determinant. If it were only an issue of burn in, I doubt that Al would have chosen as he did.
FYI, I experimented with carbon fiber (you can searh here) last year and came up with a definite improvement with CF on the wall plates and elsewhere a la Oyaide and Acrolink designs. You might like those with your Furus.
"FYI, I experimented with carbon fiber (you can searh here) last year and came up with a definite improvement with CF on the wall plates and elsewhere a la Oyaide and Acrolink designs. You might like those with your Furus."trust me, i've followed along and read it all... i was out of comission (in the hospitol) for a while at the begining of the year, but beyond that, i've been around and i fully appreciate the work and reporting that you guys have provided the forum. i'm ordering the either the furutech carbon fiber plate or the oyaide system this week. i haven't been all that impressed with the machina dynamica true covers either. i'll probably order one of the new furutech receeptacles as well.
....are enjoying the new XXX....a lot. I've even exchanged a few GX's for the XXX, where a customer ended up preferring it. Some are enjoying both in their system, as they offer a nice synergy, a particular sonic balance. Personal preference rules, as it should. In my view you are not being premature whatsoever.
....as a secret agent. :--]
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