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I just received my Grungebuster 2007 and have been fooling around with it for a few hours. Let's just say this: The 2007 is the best CD/DVD mat I've ever tried. I'm not hearing ANY curtailment of the high frequencies, which was a common criticism of the older versions of the GB. When it was compatible, my reference was the Marigo Signature 3-D. Unfortunately, the Marigo was finicky and didn't work in several of my players. Well, with the introduction of the GB 2007, the Marigo is gonna start collecting some dust. I've been using an album by Hazeldine called "Double Back" as a recent demo disc, and with the 2007 the music had considerably more energy, presence, and detail than with the Marigo. I was pretty shocked. Of course, the $64,000 question is whether the mat will lose its stickiness. My 2.2 lost it rather quickly, and not even dabbing it with masking tape or rinsing helped. The standup guy that he is, Steve is refunding my money for that one. But he says that the 2007, with an additional layer of elastomer, will not have that problem. I hope not, because sonically, this thing is absolutely stunning--even on a transport as advanced as the VRDS-NEO. For $20, it's a no-brainer in my book. FWIW, it has the same effect on DVDs.
Follow Ups:
I sold mines ASAP as I did not hear any difference....
YMMV!
...just return it for a refund?
big shipping cost.
I did not loose money.
I suggested thebuyer installing a new clock; he was not sure about that improvement
I had the original and then the 2.2. I liked both very much,perhaps the original sounded a bit better. The original was harder to deal with and eventually I lost confidence in its ability to stay on a disc when it spun off a disc as it tried to read it. I thought the 2.2 was about as good sounding and easier to deal with. However, within a week discs were coming out of the player with four sides(in a square pattern) starting to come off the disc. I had two 2.2's and did all the right things in terns of handling. Shortly after a 2.2 came off in the transport and I had to open the unit and fish it out as it bound the tray from moving freely and no disc would read. Being a Trivista SACD I have to baby this transport as there are no more. Thus my quandry. Steve says the 2007 is thicker than the 2.2 and I tried the thin adhesive hubcaps which will never fall off and are thin but they don't sound near as good. I am thinking of going back to the original full size mat because it is thinner where the transport grabs the disc but its total weight is more and that could stress the transport. I wish the thing didn't improve sound the way it does and this wouldn't be an issue but it is. Things just don't sound near as good now w/o the grungebuster and the HF is a bit bothersome sounding and edgy w/o it. Now I wish I didn't know what I am missing! I'm spoiled. Of course Herbies refunded my money on the 2.2's but I want that sound back w/o the fear of transport damage. Oh well.....
the 2.2. It is considerably thicker and heavier and adheres MUCH better. The various layers of material seem to be the perfect combination. I'm noticing a more relaxed and "natural" flow to the music amidst more detail and presence. Like I mentioned in my previous post, this is a serious upgrade to the 2.2, which I prefered to the original, "full size" GB. You owe it to yourself to give it a try. Herbie has a solid return policy if it doesn't work for you.
"I always play jazz records backwards, they sound better that way"
-Thomas Edison
I ordered a 2007 and another original full size which I always liked more than the 2.2 for sound.The 2.2 was easier to deal with of course. It is the fact that the 2007 is thicker and heavier that bothers me. I don't want to stress the transport and spindle motor. Steve at Herbies of course will take good care of whatever route I go. When the 2.2 fell off in my CDP I emailed him and he credited my account without even asking. He also didn't say send them back or anything, just gave a refund. I did send them back. He has great customer service, products and policy and a strong business ethic. I like giving him my money.
Sorry to hear about your problems using the CD mat. I have a Musical Fidelity A5 CD player. Got it used and have had it for a good 7 months or so. When I first got it, I was amazed at how smooth and clean the top end sounded; no glare, no digitalisis (is that a word?). Then I got the Grunge Buster 2.2 CD mat. Now I can't listen to the player without the GB. Without the GB, I hear high end glare that I never noticed before. At first I thought I was losing some low level detail by using the GB. Then I did a listening test with my wife. She didn't know which playback had the GB and which did not. After multiple A/B/A's, she would pick the playback with the GB each and every time as the selection that sounded the best to her ears. She thought everything sounded clearer with the GB used in the playback. I convinced myself that even "if" there was any loss of low level detail, there was a gain in image specificity that just made everything sound better. Music simply doesn't sound as pleasing and enjoyable without using the GB. I haven't had any problems with the sticking and staying down. I borrowed an older GB (not the original), which had been used quite a bit, and eventhough the edges wouldn't stick that well, the mat always stayed firm on the disc. (I'll knock on wood [my head] for good luck that I don't have the mat come off in the player and jam the tray.)And, Steve, at Herbies, is a standup guy. Always treated me fairly. My only complaint is that the 2007 came out less than 2 weeks after I got the 2.2. If I had known a new model was coming out, I would have waited and got the 2007. Guess he needed to get rid of some of the 2.2 inventory before those 2007s came in. Though, to be honest, I wouldn't have thought that a newer version would be all that much better, but it sounds like it is. Maybe one of these days I'll try the newer one and compare. Every product I've bought from Herbies as worked wonders. Some products have been more subtle in the improvements than others, but they've all worked wonders nonetheless.
I am back to using the full size mat and very happy. My wife too quickly noticed(from the couch) that the "digital" HF edge was gone and the system had a much nicer sound.
Hi Quint,
Nice to hear that you have gotten a new toy.
By the way, do you still bevel all your new CDs? I have one too.
Can you comment on how the Herbies GB 2007 work with beveled discs?
Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year!
HI, WB:
I no longer trim my discs becuase of two reasons:(1) After a while, the ADS started leaving radial marks on every disc I used it with. They were most apparent on black CD-Rs. They didn't affect playback, but it was nonethless unnerving to see them. I tried everything: adjusting the blade, tightening or loosing the bolt, going easier on the blade, etc. Nothing worked. I then thought it must be my unit, and bought a new one. Same problem. I then decided to seek an alternative solution. I instead started marking the edges of my discs with black marker and using Jena Labs CD treatment. That combo has the same effect as the trimmer, and I don't have to worry about marring. A couple of people have reported the same problems with the ADS, but most haven't.
(2) I got tired of the routine and just wanted something simpler. I've found it.
Hey, if the ADS works for you, by all means keep using it. It definitely *IS* effective. No doubt about it.
BTW, I don't recall ever trying the GrungeBuster in conjunction with beveling. Don't see any reason why it wouldn't work, though. It's cheap enough to try, and if it doesn't help, you can always return it.
Have a very merry Christmas. We're heading off to Florida in a few hours. Gonna be a welcome change from damp, chilly Michigan! :)
Is that the expensive German thing, around 6,7 or $800?
Sort of getting off the subject I ordered 3 sets of his binding post washers for my speaker and amp binding posts.I think this product is a great idea since posts loosen and a better mechanical connection is usually a better sounding connection.I also suggested to him I'd love to see power cord end dampers.He could use the washer material cut to fit the cord ends with cut outs for the blades and grounding plugs.Since plug sizes are universal in the U.S. would only have to offer one size-I told him I think they would sell well if reasonably priced
I agree about the power cord dampers. I'm planning to order in a week or so the Grungebuster 2007 -- and some washers mainly to try out on power cords the kludgy way (one per bladed). I could definitely imagine doing a full equip of audio plugs.
Mine should show up very soon. Funny about the 2.2, it sticks very well to CDs with less
artwork (silkscreening), but when given a light rinse DOES adher better to the heavily silkscreened discs for a play or too. Then it needs another rinse. Regardless, any problems with the 2.2 adherence factor are soon to be a thing of the past, but I'm happy to hear the 2007 may be immune to this problem.Yea Herbie"s!
"I always play jazz records backwards, they sound better that way"
-Thomas Edison
Herbie's GB 2007 arrived about a half hour after that last post. REAL easy to stop the Toumani Diabate/Ballake Sissoko "New Ancient Strings" CD I was listening to (for what?, certainly over the hundredth time...) remove the GB 2.2 and put on the GB2007. I completely concur with your observations: more detail, presence and certainly cohesion. The few bass notes plucked here and there have more definition and character to them and ALL the harmonic complexity between the two koros is better defined and presented, without loosing any of the musicality of the recording.No minor upgrade or tweak hear! EASILY worth the $20.00. Now have on Cassandra Wilson's "Belly of the Sun", another reference favorite. Man! What a great overall improvement... The other tweaks in the Herbie's bag (EL34 tube dampners, sheet of GB material and Ebony domes) will have to wait a few days while my ears continue to bask in this great CD mat tweak/upgrade!
I think it's important to note that with two very different systems we have both noticed such a vast improvement/difference with this one particular tweak.
"I always play jazz records backwards, they sound better that way"
-Thomas Edison
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