|
Audio Asylum Thread Printer Get a view of an entire thread on one page |
For Sale Ads |
125.133.32.128
In Reply to: Re: Totem Mani2....where's the bass? posted by danlaudionut on May 5, 2007 at 18:51:52:
Do you really think he Mani 2 has deep bass at high levels even with high powered amps -- I have heard the Mani 2 with big 350watt SS into 4 ohms from the likes of Bryston and Adcom. I think the YBA and Arcam gear are able to run the Mani-2 just fine (well not their small integrateds like the Integra and alpha amp lines).The first though I had listening to the Totem Mani-2 was nice speakers -- where do I buy the matching sub.
Follow Ups:
Yes Mani 2s have deep strong bass.
Maybe they weren't broken in yet or
they were not driven by the right amps.
I said high current not high powered amps.
BIG difference because Bryston and Adcom
are NOT high current amps, neither is YBA.
Upper Arcam amps can do it - higher the better.
Simm is what the Totem owners use in their systems.
I have heard them with Simm and awesome bass.
I am sure Krell amps could drive them too.
The "big 350watt SS into 4 ohms" specification
means absolutely NOTHING these days but stable
into .5 ohm continuous load would mean something.
That is high current not "big 350watt SS into 4 ohms".
As far as tubes - go with 845/211/805 SE or PP.
These will power anything if driven decently.
I'm pretty sure the Totem here does not go below 3ohms - that is no problem for Bryston or Adcom. The Totem's had more than a year on them.Let me clear - they have deep bass for a standmount of this size - but in overall terms - well it's no surprise that Totem makes bigger speakers and subs.
RGAThere are several speakers that have
"normal" impedance curves that perform
better with high current amplifiers.
The notorious ones are Dynaudio and Maggies.
I am sure there are others but
those are the ones I am familiar with.
Like there are speakers that thrive on
higher on output impedance amplifiers.
Matching amplifier to speakers is normal.
Mani 2s use modified Dynaudio bass drivers so
they NEED high current amplifiers to drive them.
Read ANY review of Dynaudio speakers
and they say the same thing.
Nothing new here.> > anything that Arcam can run - a Bryston can run
Listen to Maggies or Logans with
Arcam and Bryston amplifiers and
you will realize that's incorrect.
Don't get me wrong I like Bryston
with the right speakers though.
Actually the dealer selling ML says that Bryston works better than Arcam.I'm sorry but every time someone complains about an amplifier mismatch like this I roll my eyes. It is 100% Totem's responsibility that when THEY choose a dealer that they MAKE SURE the dealer is connecting an appropriate amplifier. According to you there are only a handful of amps that will drive their speakers properly so IMO that is terrible speaker design or a speaker maker making excuses for their sound.
They need to either start building CD players, turntables and amplifiers and sell complete systems (which they should be doing) or at the very least compile a list of gear that they believe is BEST for their speakers and post it on their website.
I mean if Totem doesn't care about what gets mated it with them in the showroom - why on earth should any consumer care about Totem speakers? But then they are now all sold at big box outlets and not in high end dealers so I guess they said it all.
RGA#1 I have heard Bryston and Arcam on Maggies.
I think Bryston does indeed sound better but
Arcam has much better drive for more extended bass.
ML are even harder on amps than Maggies so ...#2 It is your money so you are responsible
for an educated/proper choice in amplification.
If you shirk your responsibility you get burnt.#3 Totem responsibility is honest dealership PERIOD
Dealers are trying to sell product PERIOD
We are responsible to be sceptical at dealerships.
Research and listening are our responsibility.#4 Many amps can make good sound from the Mani 2s
but we were discussing what it needs for deep bass.#5 Totem is NOT sold in big box stores AFAIK.
1. Bryston can sound lean I'll give you that. They are about Brute force not subtlety.2. #2 and #3 It is your money so you are responsible
for an educated/proper choice in amplification.
If you shirk your responsibility you get burnt.Sorry don't agree. Companies like to pawn the responsibility off so that if you e-mail them to wonder why their product sounds poor they can say or the dealer can say - "gee it's the amp maker's fault." Dealers may deliberately mix and match garbage to the speakers so that buyers will be in an endless upgrade mode -- but I prefer to deal with companies who at least try to ensure that their speakers are matched with gear they think is acceptable.
If Totem does not care then why should I care about Totem? Simple as that PERIOD.
i'm curious to see it.
KumaThe impedance curve is in the UHF magazine
http://www.uhfmag.com/Issue76/UHF76.pdf
Page 31 has the graph. Link Below
Impedance curves don't tell the whole story.
There seems to be an undefined (as of now)
factor(s) involved in driving real speakers.
I have designed/built many speakers with
Dynaudio and other drivers and realize this.
My favorite tweeter is the D260 - I have 4.
My brother prefers Morel tweeters and mids
and Dynaudio as the woofers in his bedroom.
He has Maggie 2.7s in the living room.
Maggies have a fairly flat impedance curve but
many have found using the Zero autotransformer
does wonders for the bass by increasing the
impedance seen by the amplifier.
This is the same factor I am proposing.
Amps Current Capabilty vs Speaker Impedance Load
Higher current capability of the amp and
higher impedance of speaker are two ways
of accomplishing the same results.
Some speakers are more susceptable to this variable
while others seem to care less about it.DanL
Having tried the speakers, I was just curious.I agree that the impedance plot alone does not determine how successful speaker/amp pairing would be. There are lot more factor involved.
http://www.stereophile.com/loudspeakerreviews/462/index7.htmlIn keeping with this thread's discussion I would post John Atkinson's Note as well, from the same page:
"In my original review, I concluded that while Totem's Mani-2 appears to cost a lot for a conventional-looking if well-finished minimonitor, its combination of clean treble, transparent midrange, natural dynamics, and powerful, extended bass allowed the music to communicate in a most effective manner. Although the current sample is a little more forward-balanced in the upper midrange, the Mani-2 is still enthusiastically recommended, particularly if you have a smallish room, value bass extension, and are prepared to pay for it. A solid Class B loudspeaker in this magazine's "Recommended Components."
NO wonder! :0
| ||||||||||||
|
This post is made possible by the generous support of people like you and our sponsors: