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In Reply to: Re: So, what was the earth shattering VMPS news? nt posted by ekovalsky@cox.net on October 17, 2005 at 14:27:23:
For a second opinion:Posted on the VMPS Forum at audiocircle.com Tue Nov 4, 2003 under the subject "VMPS cabinets":
"I have seen some "piano black" and standard oak finishes and agree they weren't the most attractive I've seen. But I must say Sal (VMPS cabinetmaker in Socal) did a wonderful job on my walnut RM40's. Yes they are veneered "boxes" but they do meet my (and my more picky wife's) criteria for "furniture quality". I just found out the cabinets for my RM/X have not walnut veneer but inlaid walnut panels...doubt you will see anything like that coming from PRC. There are some things that can only be done with fine American craftsmanship, although everything comes at a price (usually about 3x what I expect it to cost!)
...lower production costs will help Big B keep his his business healthy so he can keep making more great speakers."
(ekovalsky)There are a dozen more posts from you praising the RM40 and RM/X sound quality, bass, smoothness etc. You even published a pic of your whole family dancing blissfully to the sounds of the RM/X.
This all changed just a few months ago when you came by a pair of HP's reference Alon's at 30 cents on the dollar. Perhaps our quality paled by comparison to your new speakers, but not according to you. Do I have to pull up all those positive posts you made to the VMPS Forum through 2004?
Why the vendetta?
BTW you are incorrect in all your assumptions about our new Constant Directivity speakers.
Follow Ups:
Brian,I do find your marketing techniques somewhat suspect. The stories are cute, but I'm curious to see what the hype is all about.
I've posted voluminously about VMPS speakers on the AC forums but stopped per your request. My enthusiasm about your products took a nosedive when all the performance issues I raised were dismissed by you as being related to my ignorance or my room, and were then confirmed independently by other owners.
As a reminder the walnut cabinets were never delivered. After putting me off with excuses for several months, when I asked for my money back you conjured up a piano black pair and shipped them out pronto. And you picked up the hefty freight bill which was most generous. I'll say it again -- Dorne's piano black lacquer RM/X cabinets were awesome.
Yes I do now have HP's reference in my listening room. Despite your criticisms of Carl Marchosotto's design and choice of drivers, I'm totally satisfied with them. As they should at their price point, they signficantly outperform the RM/X in every parameter. Particularly in the mid and upper bass where I could never get good integration and impact from your speakers. Their frequency response is dramatically flatter too, obviating the need for any correction above 120hz.
And it has been wonderful to have speakers (used ones in fact) that have not required me to attack them with a Dremel or soldering iron to get them to work properly. Both of those tools, and a few others including a multimeter, were part of the un-included VMPS accessory kit.
The only times you needed tools or soldering was to install the free upgrades I sent you during the 1 1/2 yrs. you owned the RM/X.I am not familiar with the Alons, having only seen pictures. They performed poorly at the Stereophile HE show where the "HP reference system" was met with hoots of derision from audiophiles and press alike.
You should also mention, every time you point with pride to your new speakers, that they retail for $126,000 the set and you paid $40,000.
They should be better than anything for that money.You made amateurish in-room measurements which you thought gospel. I sent you accurate nearfield measurements which showed none of the problems you complained about. You chose to ignore them.
You received exemplary customer service from me and your dealer John Casler. I met with you at CES and offered an in-home visit for the price of a $59 plane ticket. You declined.
Your later posts on AC, and a truly awful, mendacious email you sent to John Casler, show me you have lost all perspective on the audio hobby.
Your nasty attitude, paranoia and turn-with-the-wind opinions are simply scandalous from a man of science like yourself.
The next time you post something derogatory anywhere on line about VMPS, pause and reflect that you said the exact opposite many times when you were an owner. You should feel very, very foolish.
Thanks for the kind words!Yeah, the RM/X didn't need any hard core work. You sent me as a free upgrade a replacement passive radiator set painted with glue.
But remember my RM-40s with the planars drivers that would either not work at all, or cut in and out constantly ? I had to remove eight drivers from my new speakers, dremel off two aluminum rivets from each to replace with hardware you sent me after about six weeks, then resolder the wires back on. Then I find out later from the dealer that some of the panels just may have had the wrong impedance... after checking with a multimeter and finding about half were different than the others, another whole set of drivers was sent so out went the old ones and in went the new ones.
There was also a woofer whose surround fell off after a few months of light use, but that was fixed with Elmers glue and a cast iron frying pan of appropriate size. No big deal.
My amateur measuremements may not be gospel but they did demonstrate some problems with the speakers -- like absent deep bass below 35hz and major cancellation issues between driver groups. And depending on how they were positioned a hole around the bass-mid crossover point. My new speakers (which were $35k -- definitely a luxury purchase) don't have these problems with the same measuring equipment and room. But neither do some much less expensive speakers that several former VMPS owners now have.
Maybe I should have taken you up on your in-home visit offer. But there is only so much that can be accomplished with micrograms of putty on a passive radiator and 0.1dB L-pad adjustments.
The letter I sent to John Casler expressed the opinion of many other VMPS owners, not just myself. I've owned many other good speakers besides VMPS, most of which I have fond memories of and still would recommend to others.
But I am just a nasty, paranoid, turn-with-the-wind, scandalous, foolish man of science by day, audiophile by night. Don't worry I won't publicly comment on my VMPS experience any more. I curiously await the substance of your new invention.
You're right, we had plenty of problems with the original Sonigistix panels, with their pressure-fitted signal-carrying aluminum rivets. We ended up sending rebuilt panels to all early RM 40 owners.
Sonigistix denied the problem, even after I hired Bascom King to confirm its existence, and the efficacy of our cure.The manufacturer went out of business because of this design flaw, although he denied its existence to the very end.
The Sonigistix panels work well for their intended purpose - low cost computer speakers. The real flaw has to do with your reasoning to use them in your line of "hifi" speakers.
Most Sonigistix panels went into Kia automobiles or full range home speakers under the "Monsoon" brand name. Most failed in the field because of the mechanical design flaw I describe.
This is standard operating procedure for VMPS. Right around the end of the summer/early fall they launch their marketing campaign about cutting edge technology that will be released at CES or just prior. They string everyone along for weeks on end with spotty information and a bad picture or two. After the product is introduced, Brian raves about how some Tech TV judge at CES had to change his panties after hearing this new technology. About a month or two after CES the complaints start coming in and there about a dozen or so "upgrades" that can improve this revolutionary technology.These "fixes" are in addition to the standard drill of broken drivers, marred cabinet finishes, missing gaskets, bad pots, loose internal wires, failed caps, vibrating cabinets, cracked bases and a whole host of other quality control issues. These are all well documented over at Audio Circle. There has been a surge of other great sounding speakers with a build quality that embarasses VMPS and I think sales have slowed quite a bit- hence the marketing drive about this new technology. A lot of VMPS owners have gotten off this train ride and are quite happy. YMMV.
This was so predictable, here is part of an e-mail I sent to a friend in August.
"I’m sure right about Sept-Oct there will be some miraculous new technology Brain has discovered that will debut at CES 2006. Top secret. Classified Code Red. No one knows. Not even Brian! Casler will go into excruciating detail on how it will be cutting edge, make all other driver technology obsolete, and was developed when Brian was sitting on the crapper with diarrhea at CES 2005 after eating bad sushi with Pimp Daddy Bongiorno.
Existing VMPS owners can perform surgery on their current speakers and upgrade for a reasonable fee. And we go round and round and round……………….It’s called the VMPS Circle Jerk!
Glad I’m an ex-member! We should all go out and celebrate!"
Cheery little fellow, aren't you?
It will pass. It's that time of the month and I'm constipated as well.No need to make me an enemy. Just offering my "take" on things. I wish you neither physical, spiritual, emotional, or financial distress.
Hi V-PMS,What a man you are.
You come to a public forum, write a whole list of negative claims, and hide behind a silly name.
Not man enough to post your name?
That stand for Very Poorly Made Speaker, which cause grief much like woman with PMS.
Back to cranky, I see.Go to this year's "Bound for Sound". See Marty de Wulf's reviews of the RM 40. Read the words "absolutely gorgeous" and "high end beautiful."
BTW there are VMPS bashing sites all over the web. Knock yourself out.
Brian,I wonder how Marty de Wulf would describe these $2500 turkeys you sent me and then refused to refund my money?
Andy
You ordered a custom lacquer finish which was marred in shipping. You then decided to go with the RM 30 in a different finish. The dealer, John Casler, handled the entire transaction. I did not refuse to refund your money since you never paid me any.If you are unhappy in any way contact your dealer. My understanding was you were content in your choice.
Look closely at the pictures and notice the hundreds of fisheyes in the paint. These must have been there when they left your shop, so all the damage was not due to shipping. Hence, my reluctance to let you repaint them.You originally agreed to refund my money but then changed your mind and offered only credit after I sent them back. The only reason I purchased another pair of speakers was to sell them as factory sealed to minimize my losses.
I offered to paint a new pair with acrylic, a harder finish. You said no. Then I offered to issue John Casler a credit.
or learn to use a spell/grammar checker.
No problem. The difficulties we have encountered over the years can be traced to two factors, IMHO:
1. we push the technology envelope hard. It often takes time for the MTBF curve to settle.
2. In the olden days I cared little about cosmetics--solid and decent was all I wanted. Then we won CES, my company was profiled on ABC News, all hell broke loose. We didn't get really good cabinets for 18 months after the win, and our panel required major rebuild for reliable operation. Plus I was pining for Constant Directivity which made me one-track minded.Just received my patent-app-as-filed in the mail. It was a proud moment. I hope this body of work will be my legacy to the audio community--did I mention the application is universal?
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