|
Audio Asylum Thread Printer Get a view of an entire thread on one page |
For Sale Ads |
65.100.126.206
In Reply to: Re: B&W Nautilus 804 - review posted posted by ScofieldKjv on October 31, 2004 at 06:51:32:
I suggest you go find a pair of B&W Matrix 3 speakers and give them a good listen. Even though they are about 20 years old, they sound better in most ways than newer B&Ws. Of course, they didn't use Kevlar or porting, but they also had a much better cabinet than todays speakers. What flaws they had were flaws of subtraction, not addition.My big point is that B&W has been the recipient of a social promotion program by Stereophile because the owner/publisher of Stereophile and the chief editor were both big B&W fans and owners. And since most of the editors and many of the writers in audio went through the Stereophile school of audio writing, you'll see B&W held up as a model for how a speaker should sound. The problem is that there are a LOT of better speakers out there, especially for the same price, certainly with objectively flatter response and better quality drivers/cabinets. The flaws of the product have been twisted into "benefits", but you can look on any measurement of any recent B&W and see severe FR variations. Just like Bose is the posterboy for what's wrong with mid-fi, B&W has become the posterboy for what's wrong with high-end. So I apologize for my strong reaction, but please, there are lots of good speakers out there, give a great review to one that deserves it. Again, no speaker is perfect and if you can't hear the imperfections and comment on them, then a review is just a "promotion" or "advertisement", not a review.
Here's a link of 703 measurements, it was the closest I could find, but if you do a google search for "measurements B&W frequency response" you'll find all you need to know. People are *finally* starting to figure out via the internet that the emperor has no clothes and kevlar is a bad midrange material.
Follow Ups:
Hi John,It's no problem for us to have differing opinions. I did hear a set of Matrix series III a number of years ago and I have fond memories of them, but I do not have any extended experience with them.
It seems to me that you state Stereophile as making B&W into something they are not, yet I see the European audio press also very fond of B&W (the Nautilus line), so it must be a universal conspiracy.
I have no problem with you not liking B&W speakers, or at least their latest iterations, I just disagree with your overall assessment. Having a friend that had been to B&W this past year and listening to him talk about what he saw contradicts some of what you say.
I have an audio friend who has went through a lot of speakers over the last year or two, including N803's, S805's and Matrix (Series II) and many other brands; he purchased the Matrix speakers from fond memories and regretting selling a pair, after getting them he realized it was more of fond memories.
You'll notice that B&W and Paradigm among others don;t send them speakers for review - because they know that when faced with blunt honest opinions both brands could take a rather big beating. The 703 and new Paradigm Studio 100V3 IMO are atrocious speakers given the amopunt of money they want for them. Both should be 3 digit not 4 digit speakers IMO. I think that B&W takes a beating more so than they should but this new 700 line is much more expensive than the CDM series and IMO not any better - IMO worse and they even look worse. I don't get that. Two of the best speakers of recent years from B&W has been the DM 302 which I owned and had no kevlar or metal driver and is better than the 303, and the CDM 2SE. The 2SE I liked a fair bit given the money and it was easily better than the Totem Model 1 which cost 50% more money.I just think B&W is too expensive. The 705 is $2300.00Cdn and versus the Audio Note AX Two at $700.00Cdn I would like to know what the price justification is. The AX Two is shipped in from Europe is about the same size so shipping isn;t going to be hugely different. The AX Two is made by a much smaller company uses good vifa drivers looks very well built and has nice connectors ---- oh and sounds a helluva lot better is more efficient. The B&W's LOOK better and everyone has heard of them and not so with the AX Two. BUT, this is the point. I could listen to the AX Two long term or some lesser priced Dynaudios and Gershman Acoustics but the 705 - well I don't get it. I loved the 302 and I can recommend the N805, CDM 1NT and 1SE and 2SE(despite some problems) and Matrix 805, 801 and the Model Nautilus. But some of these big companies seem to be pricing themselves for snob appeal than sonic quality.
nt
And UHF does not seem to be homers either given the lackluster reviews they've given Bryston and some off handed put downs(or at least non drooling attitutes) to Paradigm in their advice column.I think B&W is beat up unfairly to some extent - the 600 series is in line price wise with most competitors and I prefer the 604S3 at $2,000Cdn over the Paradigm 100V3 at $2700.00Cdn. Since Paradigm is in Canada IMO there is no way it should be priced this high - it sounds like the $1500.00 Energy. But name appeal works.
This post is made possible by the generous support of people like you and our sponsors: