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In Reply to: Ludicrous claims posted by kerr on February 25, 2007 at 16:33:35:
"Ludicrous claims are the basis of the rift between subjectivists and objectivists. An objectivist ludicrous claim, for example, would be Peter Aczel's claim that all amplifiers sound alike (with his impedances, not clipping, etc accounted for). Do you agree with his ludicrous claim?"Why do think the claim is ludicrous? I do not see it as ludricous because many amplifiers that genuinely sound different do not satisfy one or more of the criteria listed by Aczel. For example most if not all zero feedback amplifiers have high distortion and high output impedance, and as a result generally modify the behaviour of the partnering speaker .
Music making the painting, recording it the photograph
Follow Ups:
HowdyYou said "For example most if not all zero feedback amplifiers have high distortion and high output impedance, and as a result generally modify the behaviour of the partnering speaker."
So do my amps have high distortion or high output impedance?
Type Solid State Configuration Mono Power Supply Transformers 2 x 1kVA Power Supply Capacitance 216,000µF Class Of Operation A/AB RCA Inputs 1 pair   (normal & phase inverted) Balanced Input XLR Input Device Type J-FETs Input Impedance 47,500 ohms Input Sensitivity 1080mV RMS Output Device Type Bipolars - 20 Output Binding Posts WBT Output Power @ 8 ohms 750 Watts Output Power @ 4 ohms 1400 Watts Output Power @ 2 ohms 2200 Watts Frequency Response 10Hz - 200kHz   +0/-3dB Output Impedance 0.005 ohms Damping Factor   (static) 1600 Gain 37dB Dynamic Headroom 6dB Signal-to-noise Ratio 100dB @ full power Maximum Output Voltage 75 Volts Slew Rate 80V/µs Maximum Current - Peak 85 amperes Maximum Current - Continuous 35 amperes Crosstalk @ 1kHz Not applicable IMD Unmeasureable THD   (20Hz - 20kHz @ 1 watt) < 0.02 % THD   (20Hz - 20kHz @ 750 watts) < 0.05 %
Well, rather let us put this way, those specs suggest that the amplifier is NOT a "zero negative feedback" amplifier .
Music making the painting, recording it the photograph
Well, Sim Audio claims "no overall feedback" on their site, rather than no feedback, and it does appear to be an excellent amp.http://www.simaudio.com/moonw10.htm
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"Nature loves to hide."
---Heraclitus of Ephesus (trans. Wheelwright)
HowdyI sure like them :)
Simaudio choose their language carefully "no overall feedback" ,I looked at their site and they use negative feedback but not global negative feedback 8), so there you have it's all about marketing your product in the best possible light.
Music making the painting, recording it the photograph
HowdyThere is a difference between feedback only on the output transistors and more global feedback, i.e. it not just marketing.
Howdy,I sent a comment to you over the weekend over a post thetubeguy1954, are his posts which amount nothing more than personal character attacks going to stay?
Tubeguy has his issues, as he usually reacts defensively before cooling down, but personally I find AJinFLA's posts to be incredibly rude and immature. If you're calling for one transgressor to be deleted, then be prepared for many more to follow.Too bad so many "audiophiles" have to be assh@les. I imagine that the personality flaws we witness so clearly in the Asylum have a greater effect on chasinfg people away from the hobby than little jars of pebbles do....;)
"Tubeguy has his issues, as he usually reacts defensively before cooling down"Are you now excusing thetubeguy1954 terrible conduct on this board on account of AJ behaviour?
" I find AJinFLA's posts to be incredibly rude and immature"
You could say the same for many other posters, this board was supposed to be a forum for technical discussion that can be validated by meters or controlled listening tests. However it has not turned that way, the insecure have set up camp and as a result, most of the knowledgeable posters have either been banned or are staying away.
"I imagine that the personality flaws we witness so clearly in the Asylum have a greater effect on chasinfg people away from the hobby than little jars of pebbles do....;) "
I know you are joking :D
"Are you now excusing thetubeguy1954 terrible conduct on this board on account of AJ behaviour?"Absolutely not: I'm pointing out that there is a lot of bad behavior on this Forum. Bad behavior coming from opposite "camps" doesn't cancel out: I think it is actually cummulative.
"You could say the same for many other posters, this board was supposed to be a forum for technical discussion that can be validated by meters or controlled listening tests. However it has not turned that way, the insecure have set up camp and as a result, most of the knowledgeable posters have either been banned or are staying away."I HAVE said the same about many posters here. Where I may disagree with the implications of your assessment is that IMHO one of the worst offenders was Soundmind, who often had interesting things to discuss, but simply couldn't do it without resorting to insult and schoolyard bullying. The ease of acting the part of the donkey's rear end has no connection to type or breadth of knowledge of the poster, and certainly has nothing to do with being an insecure subjectivist or an insecure objectivist.
"I know you are joking :D"Well, a bit. Actually, given the "debates" I continue to have with Geoff Kait, my statement simply points out how strongly I feel that even with extreme disagreement, as hobbyists who share a love of music, there really is no need for such rancor. Frankly, I've stopped learning from people here, and no longer find the squabbles fun in the least.
Cheers! I've got a beautiful recording of Ellington and Blanton waiting for me......;)
HowdyAs I have stated repeatedly here, I am not a moderator of this forum and as such certainly don't get comments from posts here. Also, as I have mentioned, no one has stepped up to moderate Propeller Head Plaza so I don't know who gets comments from Prop Heads besides Rod.
Hi there,I said "zero negative feedback" not "zero global negative feedback". whatever their marketing literature says, it is simply a different take on the same old principle i.e. applying feedback to improve the linearity of an active device(s).
Music making the painting, recording it the photograph
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