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HiI read through most of the EAC post (like: http://db.audioasylum.com/cgi/m.mpl?forum=pcaudio&n=9107) but did not find an answer to my observations:
When trying different ripping speeds with EAC (and also with different drives from NEC/LiteOn/Sony DVD-Burners, Yamaha F1 CD-Burner) I get the impression, that I do not get better ripping results with slower speeds. How do I get that assumption? Well, if you observe the little red dots, that show how much error-correction and/or re-reads needs to be performed, those little red dots sometimes show higher values at slower speeds, while at max speed, they don't show up at all. It also happened to me more than once, that with a ripping speed of 8x or 12x, EAC could not recover any data and took forever to get over a certain point of the disc including the message, that a certain portion could not be read, while at max speed, it did not show any signs of correction at the very same read-point.
How do you rate that observation - do EAC/the drives really read better at max speed or do they just not notice/skip the errors, because the read-speed is too high? Or am I drawing the wrong conclusions from the little red dot-behaviour?FYI: I used drives, that varied between C2-capable over accuraterip-able to with or without buffering. I usually always enable the buffering-switch to be on the sure side, all drives were accurate-rip able, I also switched off the C2-switch with the one drive that was C2-capable.
Follow Ups:
When using EAC secure mode, the drive rips at whatever speed it rips. For example, my LG 4167 will rip at an average speed of about 24x in secure mode, while my LiteOn 5239S only rips at 3-4x. How did you manage to control the ripping speed? Or were you just switching betweeen secure mode, fast mode and burst mode? If so, there's a lot more going on than just ripping speed. For example, burst mode does no error correction at all.
It may well be that your drive was simply optimized for a particular speed and slowing it down causes more errors since it is now running at a non-optimized speed.Data extraction from a CD is subject to error correction schemes, whether music or data. For example, when you install an operating system (whether Windows, Linux or another) there are millions of lines of code that must be read perfectly or the OS won't work correctly. I know of no technically savvy computer user that instructs his CD to extract program installation data at a particular speed.
If EAC gets an error, it'll re-read that portion of the disk until it gets it right. It should be irrelevant to you what speed it chooses to read the disk.
Hellosorry if I should have confused you and other readers.
I am ripping in secure mode, of course. What I was talking about, was not the ripping speed, but the DRIVE speed you can set in "drive options".
What I noticed was only a (possible) behaviour of the error correction and/or the ability to read a CD without errors.In the drive options, you can either allow the drive to spin at max. speed or set a certain, let's call it, speed limit.
When EAC extracts data from the CD (that's how I understood that option), it reads a certain portion of the disc as long until EAC is convinced it has captured the data without any errors. If this is not possible at the maximum drive speed set in "drive options", the disc is spun down (even to 1x or less drive speed) until the data is captured, or error correction jumps in or EAC gives up on that portion.
So, as far as I understood it: when the speed option is set to max., EAC uses the max. drive speed of your drive as long as possible. If drive options are set to 12x, EAC initially lets the drive spin with a max. drive speed of 12x.
On the other hand, you can imagine, that a drive-speed of let's say 40 (again: the drive itself spins with 40x, I am not talking about extraction speed!) may cause the laser to loose focus or jump out of the "groove". That's why I imagined, that a lower drive speed in options (let's say 12x) would make work easier for the laser pickup to follow excentricities, refocus on the pits etc., since the CD spins slower. It's like driving: following a small lane with 40 mph is easier than with 100 mph...
But the red error correction dots show more activity with lower drive speeds than with max. speed. That's, what my question was about...
Sorry again, if I may have caused confusion. I hope, my answer has clarified my point and question.
You should set the speed to "Actual" and "Allow Speed Reduction During Extraction". This allows EAC to adjust the drive to the ideal speed based on error readings AND the quality of the individual disc in the drive.
Hi
and thanks for the advice - I had "speed reduction" already ticked and now have chosen to set my drive to "actual". It was an interesting experience to me, that maximum read speeds (especially towards the end of the disc, when ripping speed displayed in "secure mode EAC" goes up to 6 - 7x) provide better results than when the drive is limited to a lower read speed, which theoretically at first sight seems to be easier for the laser...Regards
Joerg
I looked at that option (in Drive options, Offset/speed tab, speed selection). According to the tooltip help, the options in the combo box are drive dependent. I have two computers with two drives each, and it turns out the only option I have here on all of my drives just says "Actual". That's why I was confused, because I've never seen any numbers in this combo box, just "Actual". I guess I've just always ignored it for that reason :-). Thanks for the clarification.Have you tried "test and copy selected tracks" to do multiple passes and compare CRCs for test and copy? If so, do you get mismatched CRCs at all? If not, maybe the best thing is to just use the fastest speed that gives no mismatched CRCs with a scratched disc.
but i noticed the same thing and asked myself the same questions. I started ripping at higher speeds too because of this. I started with an NEC 2510 going real slow on my best discs. Somewhere down the line I came to the conclusion that I would see less struggle to read the discs at higher speeds, 20X seemed to work well, as well as 16X. No real difference between the two, but I chose 16X for a long time because us audiophiles like to suffer. Halfway through my collection I picked up a Plextor and Plextool XL. Best decision I've made. It ripped discs very well and I began to be comfortable with 20X and 24X rips.
You are using Secure mode I assume?Each drive has it's own sweet spot and with modern drives, it's not necessarily slower. Most current drives will actually do a worse job of reading at 1 or 4x than at 12x.
Yamaha F1 BTW runs very slowly with EAC, and I don't think it's actually a very good audio ripper (better burner).
Hisweet spot is exactly the right word for what I assumed, is happening. Still, I was a bit surprised, that with drives, where EAC offered ripping speeds of 18x, 24x before the "max." selection, would rip better @ max., which might be something like 28 or 30x then... At those high speeds, even smallest excentricities or "wobbles" on the disce would put enormeous stress on the laser/adjustment and the possibilities of wrong focus or "out of the lane"-reading errors increase exponentially (that was my theory...), so I thought, something like a more laser-friendly 18x or 12x may be better...
My NEC-drive for example only offers a selection in EAC of 10x, 20x and max., and it seemed to read (or not recognize???) problematic spots better at max. than at 20x or 10x...
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