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In Reply to: I’m in love with Maggie! posted by osuhog on April 4, 2007 at 08:01:04:
I'm really happy for you. I have owned maggies in the past and can say that in the right system, they are very special.However, they aren't the only game in town. And the way you are gushing makes me wonder if you have ever been exposed to high quality sound in your home. As good as the MMGs are, there is much better to be had from magnepan and others.
Anyway, not trying to take the wind out of your sails, just pointing out that your only point of reference is mid-fi speakers. And BTW, the MMGs will sound even better when you decide to pair them with some good electronics.
But the bottom line is that you are digging your music.
Follow Ups:
> > However, they aren't the only game in town < <what would you recommend in the $500 range?
"Live life as if you'll die tomorrow... -Ghandi
Learn life as if you'll live forever..."
"> > However, they aren't the only game in town < <what would you recommend in the $500 range?"
Comparing modded MMG's with other $500 speakers isn't really being fair, to the other speakers that is =^] . Try something in the $800-$1000 range maybe.
I haven't heard modded MMGs, only stock. But see my recommendation below for the GMA Europas. These are excellent monitors that I could easily live with.
Check your facts....$999 for the Europa vs $550 MMG?
No, check YOUR facts. Used Europas are 500.00-600.00. And when you mod a pair of MMGs, they are no longer 550.00 either.If you want to talk new prices, the Usher S-520 will give the MMG a good run for the money.
Yes, the MMGs are good. But not the second coming that some would make them out to be.
Again your asking someone to spend twice as much
If you are spending 250.00, and don't have the wherewithall to spend another 250.00, you should probably just buy a table radio and be happy. Because food and shelter are going to be your main concern, not 500.00 speakers.It's not like the difference between 10K and 20K, or has that fact eluded you?
should I get the fish filet or the filet migon?;the McCoffee or the Starbucks 'just reach in my pants pocket and take my money' latte..
and etc., ect.,
This IS a crazy World we're in!
"Live life as if you'll die tomorrow... -Gandhi
Learn life as if you'll live forever..."
Table radio...MMG's...Table radio...MMG's...hmmmmm....tough choice.So Oz, where does it stop?
What about my projector? Heck, it's only another $500 to get a higher resolution, brighter DLP.
Receiver? Forget that, only another $400 and I can get into an entry level preamp. Ahh, forget entry level, if I’m going separates, why not spend $500 more and get something with some actual build quality.
Pro amp? Are you kidding, only $400 more gets me into a good entry level audiophile amp. Of course, now I need 4 more channels of amplification for my surrounds since I went with a preamp over a receiver. No big deal, just another $800 for two more amps.
And on, and on, and on...
So, to you there are only two levels of A/V consumers out there and nothing in between, the table radio people, and the elite audiophiles, right?
On another note, I come by food and shelter for my family just fine, thank you. I know you weren’t necessarily directing that at me, but there are plenty more like me out there so I will speak for all of us. :)
I happen to have a budget every month. So much for gas, so much for groceries, bills, kids activities, and yes, entertainment. Part of my entertainment budget goes to athletics, as my wife and I are huge sports fans and season ticket holders to football, baseball, and basketball for Oklahoma State University. We also try to take the kids on at least one sports vacation every year. Last year we went to St. Louis to see the Cards whip up on the Astros. :)
Yes, my Audio/Video hobby is lumped in with the rest of our entertainment budget. I do have to be a bargain shopper, but I do take care of my family first, and a few hundred bucks isn't something I just throw around without a lot of thought.
Thanks for reminding us that we are all playing at different levels with different ideas of what is good enough.
Believe what your ears say - not hearsay.
"son, I can't afford to send you to college because the guys down at the plant make fun of my power amp I'm using. I've decided to get Brand 'X' and you're going to have to go into the Peace Corps instead"
"Live life as if you'll die tomorrow... -Gandhi
Learn life as if you'll live forever..."
LOL!!! My 3.6’s were more than what we had budgeted for. On the ride home, was actually thinking about how our kids would be better off without a college degree.
seems yours is dead on; good deal!
"Live life as if you'll die tomorrow... -Gandhi
Learn life as if you'll live forever..."
I like your thinking - very rational. I think you have a very nice system for $2,000. If it sounds good; it *is* good.
> So Oz, where does it stop? <You know they call this place an asylum for a reason.......
Oz
By the way, after all I posted, if I found something that would really be a noticeable improvement for a few hundred bucks, I'd be all over it, don't worry. Honestly, I'm not interested if it's something that I can't point out fairly obviously in a blind test. Here's my point, and this is what separates these Maggies from every other speaker I’ve ever heard, to me...Let’s say I decided to do some testing. I would start off with any given pair of good, quality, box speakers that I’ve ever owned, or heard for that matter. The speakers would not be seen, only heard. I would listen to any number of songs I choose. Something of good quality that I’m familiar with. Maybe listen for 10 or 15 minutes.
The next day, a the same time, in the same listening position, with everything else being exactly the same, I perform the same test with any other pair of good, quality, box speakers that I’ve ever owned, or heard for that matter, again :^).
Let’s say I perform this same test, on 5 different sets of speakers, 3 times each, randomly, 15 days in a row. Let’s say I have a list in front of me with each of the 5 speakers listed. Until now, I honestly don’t think I could tell you if I was listening to a $1,800 set of Paradigms, $400 set of DIY, or a $500 set of B&W’s, as long as it was a good, quality set of speakers.
After spending a week with these new Maggies, for the first time in my life, I am absolutely certain I could pick them every time. It’s not even close. I don’t know if I just have an ear that prefers the planar sound or what, but it is like nothing I have ever heard personally.
Oh yeah, my testing method would also have my IB sub running from about 60hz on down, and level matched with each set of speakers. Doing this, you could even throw some pretty small monitors in there and the lack of low bass wouldn't be evident.
"You know they call this place an asylum for a reason......."
You make some very good points.
Although I've heard lots of much more expensive speakers that were better to some degree or another than my 1.6s, so far I've only heard 1 speaker that I would give them up for, and a box speaker at that.They were the Devore Silverbacks at over 15K per pair. I heard them at Stereophile's Home Entertainment show in NYC 3 or 4 years ago. Best sound I ever heard from a loudspeaker, period, Probably 17K or more by now. Even at that price they're inexpensive compared to their competition. At one tenth the price, the 1.6's can hold their own against most expensive speakers except perhaps in the area of deep bass much below 40 hz.
The Devores’ lack of enclosure colorations and congestion caught my attention too. Amazing purity, transparency, and resolution w/o being sterile or warm...just natural. If anything, found the Super 8' soundstage was slightly forward (but not in your face), images were tight and focused, but didn’t fill or energize the room. It excelled with acoustics and vocals, but seemed to lack pace and weight with more complex tunes. However, the Silverback have all the strengths of the Super 8' with a bigger soundstage, more lively, and didn’t feel limited with music genre. So far, the Silverback is one of the very few fully enclosed, cone driver speakers that I’d consider dumping my 3.6’s for.
I know this is all heresy on a Maggie site. What can I tell you, I'm not perfect. :-) You forgot to mention the tight deep natural bass. Steve DeVore was demonstrating them in one of the bigger hotel rooms at the New York Hilton. Not an ideal location. But, he obviously spent a lot of effort with setup, electronics, placement and room treatments. I use my flawed memory of that short listening session as my standard for what I'm trying to achieve at home. I'm going to the next HE show next month in NYC. Steve Devore makes his speakers in Brooklyn, I believe, so I hope he'll there again with the Silverbacks. I need a fix.
All maggies, all the time is getting old. I wish the other dipole users and those who moved on to something else would chime in more. Dipoles need room to breathe and don’t perform their best in a shoehorn. Dipole-ish conventional speakers like the Devores, Gallos, Piega, Vandersteen maybe better alternatives in a small room. I left out the bass b/c in another posting could only come up with words like bootylicious, well rounded, taut. Yeah, I was thinking about jlo butt…hopefully the new meds will kick in soon.
Believe what your ears say - not hearsay.
Well, for just a little more my choice would be a pair of Green Mountain Audio Europas. For me, they are better than MMGs and can be had for around 550-600 on the used market.
Agian you are asking someone on a budget to spend almost twice as much
See above.
I’m not rich, and I have 3 kids under 10 to raise, so I am a huge “bang for the buck” kind of guy.TV – Sanyo PLV-Z1 16X9 LCD projector – $500
Screen – A sheet of drywall, painted with Kilz, and masked with flat black pait – $15
Receiver – Refurbished Harman Kardon AVR-340 - $250
Amp – Behringer EP-2500 from Ebay - $250
IB sub – 4 Mach 5 18’s, BFD EQ, & Nady XA-900 amp – $500
Wire – 12 gauge oxygen free copper wire – $15
Media Center – Modified XBOX running XBMC networked – $100
Magnepan MMG’s, modded crossovers and raised up vertical on DIY stands – $400
Is my projector cutting edge? Absolutely not. Would a Stewart screen outperform my drywall? Yep. But in my light controlled environment, this is a great setup and everybody that sees it, absolutely loves it.
Find me a better preamp/amp combo than the AVR-340 and the EP-2500 for $500, and I’ll check into it. Remember, this is a double duty, 50/50 HT/music system.
Subs, don’t even think about it. There isn’t a commercial sub on this planet for under $1,000 that can touch my IB. Flat to 10hz and SQ is amazing. I’ve owned Sunfire, Paradigm, Velodyne, and dual SVS. None can compare.
Wire? Hmm, I guess this really just matches the rest of my budget system, although I’d be open to trying something different, with a lot of skepticism.
XBMC, the most comprehensive and functional media center out there. A GREAT, GREAT, piece of equipment. Nothing even close in price can do what this thing does.
Maggies? What can I say. As mentioned, I’ve owned Paradigm Studio 60’s ($1,800), as well as many other “mid-fi” speakers. They all sounded great, but none of them wowed me like these Maggies. I don’t care if they are a $500 speaker. The “realism” of these speakers, in my setup, is the best I’ve ever heard.
So, I’ve got just over 2 grand into my entire setup, video and audio (including my 2 sets of surrounds). As far as the audio portion, this it’s the best jazz, guitar, piano, & vocals I’ve ever heard in my 34 years. Maybe I’m just living under a rock. :)
You got it. Ozzy buys his polo shirts at Lacoste: designed in France, made in Peru.
I guess your humor is lost on me, but I'm not some snobby "audiophile" that has an uber expensive system and poo poos those who don't. My stuff was actually put together with a lot of thought and the care of placement and room treatment probably tailor the final result more than the components themselves. I just shudder at the thought of someone using a receiver as a preamp and a pro amp with something as demanding as maggies. But it's not MY system is it?
Ozzy, MMG's are revealing but not as demanding as the bigger Maggies, or so I've read. I prefer to think of them as "suggesting". As in "If you like how I sound now, think of how much better it can be with a few "upgrades"!
Look at the glass as half full rather than half empty. MMG's,(especially modded), can make a receiver and a Pro-amp sound good. MMG's with very good gear, can give back much more than their price would seem to suggest ;^).It's a shame you haven't heard the MMG's in their modded state. They really are a MUCH better speaker than in stock form.
Ozzy, I know you found some speakers you like better than Maggies. All I can say is, they must be pretty good! Maybe one day I'll get a change to audition a pair ;^) .
Fair enough. You make some valid points.I am waving the white flag.....
I may be a Pro-amp kinda guy, but I WILL try some of that high-end stuff. Thanks to you and others here, I'll know what's good ;^).
Just my two cents. I love to see budget systems that sound good far more than I like to see $100,000 systems. Anyone should be able to put together a good system for $10,000+, doing it on $2000 including video is great.When I was in college I had a set SMGa's I bought for $200, an Adcom preamp I bought for $150, Hafler DH-220 for $115, Velodyne F1000 $500 and a Denon CD player $300 as a demo. The great thing about that system was that it was set up well enough and sounded good enough, I was never disappointed when I listened to it, even after hearing $50000 systems.
I would be willing to bet that if I sat down and listened to your system I would feel the same way. It may not have the last bit that a lot of money buys, but I bet it sounds damm good and much better than anything you would find in a store for $2000.
Didn't mean to step on your toes. I'm no fan of Denon or Behringer, but I guess for movies that would be ok. Hey, as long as you like it, who cares what I think?BTW, most inmates who know me better will think I am mellowing out in my old age, and they might be right. There was a time when I'd go toe to toe with you, but hey, just enjoy your system.
Yeah, you wimped out. Keep that up and the next thing we know this place will have a reputation for being civil. :^ )
Who said anything about Denon? :)
Sorry, Harmon Kardon, Denon......all the same ;-}
Hi OzDidn't you just own Von Schweikert speakers?
Yep, VS is gone and I back with another pair of Montanas. Just couldn't stay away.....
There must really be something to these Montana speakers. ( <:
Might be, but IIRC they aren't the only speakers Ozzy has owned more than once...
...as in Mike Keneally?
Yup. He's probably my favorite living rock musician. I have seen him live five or six times, Got all the records. Incredibly talented, and a very nice person.
As a Zappaphile, I am very familiar with Mike Keneally. He's a very talented guy and I like his music - no, it certainly isn't for everyone, but I'm glad there are other people out there listening to him!
Hmmm, refresh my memory.I owned two pairs of Montana SP2s, one pair of them twice.
True that I have owned several different pairs of VS speakers, but never the same model twice. What could you be referring to?
I might be mistaken, but I could have swore that you owned a pair of 1.6s more than once. Maybe took the same pair back?
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