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In Reply to: Re: Stand questions posted by Peter Gunn on March 6, 2007 at 06:14:38:
Hey Peter,I apologize for not being too clear.
I will be mounting them on the SIDE walls (if that is not too far apart, I have to check)about 6ft into the room.
The speakers will be facing each other, and I'll sit about 3ft back from that plane. Kind of like big headphones. It does sound crazy, and if I had never tried this setup, i would easily dismiss such a post as the work of a nut. But witht he tweeters closest to the listener, this is the best setup I have ever had. It is weird, but the sound stage is really huge, and between the speakers and the normal front wall, so it stages like a normal setup. Except that I am telling everyone where the speakers are, I could easily win money of a blindfolded listener by asking where the speakers are. Not sure if the stock ones work in this config.
I was planning on making something like a picture frame around the driver itself...no mdf, and attaching the new frame at the top and bottom using those triangle shelving brackets that some people use for floor stands.
So the top and bottom will be braced with the brackets. I could run a flat steel beam down the whole length, but I wasn't too sure that was necessary. I was thining that I just needed the "frame" to be ont he left and right vertical sides of the driver, but am wondering if I should do the horizontal as well. Any thoughts.
The other thing is that I live in earthquake country, so having them on the walls wouldn't be a bad idea.
Follow Ups:
Just don't use metal fence posts, OK? :^ )I really wish I could beam you into my room for an afternoon. That might just solve your whole problem :^ )
Anyway, for whatever reason, your room, your gear, your dimensia or a combination of all 3 you like maggie headphones.
My new frame is essentially a complex picture frame, although the pieces are permanently attached (at least it is to be hoped) and picture frames are not. If you can make yourself something like that, yes, it should work.
My only problem is don't they need to be out at least 2 feet to sound right? Supporting them that far from the wall.... I'm drawing a blank right now. Obviously you'll have to attach to studs, but how you minimize the structure while maintaining strength I don't know. In your case you may almost have to make something out of steel.
Is being on the wall really safer in a quake? I suppose, as long as the wall doesn't come down. I don't know how you people deal with that.
Good luck with it, and if you get stuck feel free to email me.
Hey PG,QUit building those really nice stands, and start working on the beaming technology!!
Yeah it does seem like dementia, but I am telling you it sounds better than a normal setup. THe trick is to be very nearfield say 3ft from the plane of the speakers, and of course they need to be vertical.
ANyhow, it will be a while before I get around to this, but I think I have it figured out.
The only issue I can forsee is that the studs need to line up on both walls, or I am sunk. However, the way I plan to do it, I can easily make them floor standing.
ALso, they can be a ft off the side walls, but the sound is affected more from the distance to the front wall...just like normal. So, as long as they are say 4-5ft or more from the front wall, it will meet the "hey don't they have to be 2ft from the wall" requirement.
It really is the coolest effect, and from looking at it, you would never guess it would work, but it really does.
See, I had a 1.6 owner come and listen and he said tha the modded MMgs sounded better than his 1.6s and he was jealous. If there was an issue with teh setup, he woudl have said things like "how do they sound in a normal setup?" or "have you thought about setting them normally?", etc. But he didn't.
"I carn't doo it Captian. You know I don't like beaming maggies..."I'm not going to second guess you. If you're happy it works for me.
My advice is to get 2 large sheets of finished plywood (your choice on species), finish the edges with trim molding if you like and attach it to your wall studs. Make it large enough that you can attach the maggie bracket to it. With it secured to the studs it won't come loose, and you can then screw the stand in anywhere on it without worrying about lining up a stud.
I have a similar incident to this that is quite peculiar. When I was originally building my attic room I was of course very interested (re-concerned as all hell) what the acoustics would be like, given the A frame ceiling. I had removed the insulation and flying squirrels from between the risers and laid the floor, and as it almost looked like a space I had my friend bring his maggies over and we set them up.
Sitting on a folding chair across the room, we were both treated to the most bizarre sound we ever heard. When you listen to speakers, even if they are imaging right and the sound is between them and not localized on the speaker itself, it still sounds like it's over there. This sounded nothing like that. It was as if we were wearing what we both called a "speaker helmet". The sound seemed to be coming from just a few inches from our head from every direction including behind us EXCEPT for in front. It wrapped around the tops and back of our heads, but nothing from the front. It was just like wearing a football helmet with hundreds of tiny speakers all over the sides, top and back playing at you.
He said it was the weirdest and coolest thing he ever heard, but he wouldn't want to live with it. I was mortified that the room would sound awful. Apparently it was just the bare wood roof and reflective surfaces everywhere, the A frame and lack of any walls that did it, because once finished finished it was fine.
Good luck with your project. If you can fit a triangle into your design it will make it a lot more rigid.
Hey PG,YOu really are a bright one. I never would have thought of that ply-wood trick....thank you so much!!!
It doesn't quite sound like what you are describing. It images like a normal nearfield setup- in terms of where the center image is. The difference is that it is not as precise as a normal setup. Which may seem like a bad thing, but to my ear it is a lot more like live music, which is never really as precise as stereos make it. It was like I added a tube amp, and got all the benefits, and none of the down-sides.
Also, the front wall (where you have your equipment and treatment) had windows that took up the maot of the wall. When those windows were opened, the system sounded the best. I don't know if it was because of the breeze that would occasionally blow or the fact that the reflected sound would dissapear through there, but man was it really realistic.
Trust me, I have had a normal setup for more than I have ahd the abnormal one, but I find it very hard to go back. I also think that this only works in nearfield...at least on the quasi-ribbons.
THere are some ribbon owners that swear by this set-up and do not do it nearfield either.
I will be setting up in the new house soon, and who knows, maybe this will not work as well and I'll end up with a more conventional setup.
Thanks again for the tip.
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