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speaking of ESL-57's: I am getting close, I really am

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So at this point, I've solved one problem but still seem to have another.
Saturday, I flipped the metal frame stands that came with my 57's on their sides (they're not quite cubic) and shimmed the back edge of each speaker about 3/4". This put the tweeter panels close enough to on-axis for my somewhat low-slung listening chair. N.B. these stands are "made in England" and were reportedly designed for the Quad.
Now, the "only" problem remaining is the midbass. It's rather wool-ily prominent, almost a bit resonant. I don't think these are supposed to sound so phat... are they? Now, these '57's are utterly stock, the back-damping stuff is still inside. I may still not have them far enough from the wall (only about 3 feet when I tried 'em Saturday) and/or far enough out of the corners (about 2 feet from side walls). On the other hand, perhaps they don't like my EICO HF-81... although experience dictates that this particular one, as I have re-capped it, is a bit "lean" sounding with most dynamic (PM) speakers I've used it with.
I am eagerly open to suggestions (even non-affirming ones)!
One of the stands in question may be glimpsed barely, in its default, "landscape" orientation, holding up a home-made (tho' not in MY home) BR cabinet loaded with a Fostex FE-207E FR driver. These are very nice sounding little rascals, too, BTW. Yes, that is one of the '57's cowering behind the Fostex, with one of my Bob Brines designed ML TQWT's and its little supertweeter way back in the corner behind everybody else. But I digress.

all the best,
mrh

Follow Ups:

Re: speaking of ESL-57's: I am getting close, I really am - Mickey Bob 09:55:52 03/06/07 (0)
You want them to sound less 'wooly' in the bass? Get 'em OUT of the corners.
Assuming your 57's are in reasonable shape, my guess - audiogatorjim 16:14:59 03/05/07 (1)
would be the amp. My configuration was similar to yours; the amps I used were a Fisher SA 300, Dyna 70, and a Marantz 8B. All sounded very good and not wooly at all to me. Why not try a Stereo 70, which sounded quite good. In my opinion, they sound just fine on the stock feet, but only for nearfield listening.
- I have only one stock foot :-( - mhardy6647 18:23:02 03/05/07 (0)
  I think that leaves me about 5 short... but, hey, the price of these was right!
  
  all the best,
  mrh
Re: speaking of ESL-57's: I am getting close, I really am - kentaja@yahoo.com 10:17:52 03/05/07 (1)
To my ears, with the ESL near the floor, they always sound a bit wooly, loose, and fat, as compared to raising them off the floor. Not so bad on the floor with classical, but your typical pop/rock recording, with their heavy emphasis of mid-bass, makes the ESL far too fat and ill-defined in the mid-bass region for my tastes.
Raising them much off the floor may reduce ultimate extension, but the clean-up in the mid-bass region is well worth the trade-off for me. For classical music, one may prefer them on the floor for the better extension, but even then, if you like good extension on classical, you really need a sub.
The Eico is a great little amp but with something like the Quad it will not have the best bass control IMO. For best bass control, power amps with large, stable power supplies provide the best results. I also like 6550/KT90 power tubes for good bass control.
With them raised off the floor, an amp that grips the bass tightly, I would still say the bass is a bit on the prominent side, with a touch of a resonant, one-note quality. These errors are small in nature and be greatly reduced, if not eliminated on most recordings, with careful room placement and a power amp with a vise-like grip on those bass panels. A more rigid framework also does wonders in this regard, but then that is quite a bit of fiddling!
Lack of bass, contrary to the very old wive's tale, is not an issue the ESL suffers. Forget about the bottom octave or so, but from there up is has plenty to offer and the trick is getting control of the immense mid-bass reproduction capability of the ESL.
- this all sounds very cogent and congruent to what I've heard... - mhardy6647 12:32:10 03/05/07 (0)
  ... maybe my ears are keener than I thought :-)
  Your point about the l'il HF-81 is well taken. I am not sure I have anything better to offer up, though. Every other decent tube amp in the house is a PP7591, which a priori is a step backwards IMNSHO, or a cheap(er) SE amp with zero added NFB, which will have even less damping than the PP's.
  Guess I really do have to start saving up for an 8B. Anybody got a spare? I can restore it myself if the iron's OK.
  
  all the best,
  mrh
Re: speaking of ESL-57's: I am getting close, I really am - drquad 10:11:15 03/05/07 (2)
You might try positioning your ESL's away from the corners, further out in the room (somehow), & raised up from the floor about a foot. Then maybe we won't have to talk about the possibility that your treble panels have lost some sensitivity...It's been a long while since I heard an EICO HF-81/Quad match up but my recollection is it wasn't as good as the then brand new Dyna St-35 in the bass dept. Could have been the other way around tho...
Sandro
- http://www.geocities.com/drquad@pacbell.net (Open in New Window)
- I think the tweeters are OK - mhardy6647 11:30:47 03/05/07 (1)
  (but I don't know for sure).
  The best placement so far's about 16 inches off the ground, about 3 feet out of the corners (yes I can go farther) and tipped forward about 3/4".
  
  all the best,
  mrh
  - Re: I think the tweeters are OK - drquad 11:56:25 03/05/07 (0)
    If your t. panels are up to speed & you've positioned your Quads the best you can in your room but you still feel the mid bass is overly ripe, the next step is to consider a high pass filter & a subwoofer or two. Obviously, this scheme attenuates some of the signal normally directed to your bass panels. One very positive result is the midbass is quite a bit cleaner, especially at higher listening levels. The downside is the added expense & complexity. Anyhow, you might check my link below:
    Sandro
    - http://www.geocities.com/drquad@pacbell.net/bassaddition.html (Open in New Window)
re: stands... I am so dumb! - mhardy6647 08:08:17 03/05/07 (0)
The stand in the photo is NOT in its "default, landscape orientation". It's portrait; that's what gave me the idea of trying the ESL's that way! Sheesh!
Too much head cold and not enough medication today...

all the best,
mrh

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