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In Reply to: Option. posted by grantv on November 16, 2006 at 12:05:51:
Thanks for your help! In terms of your second suggestion: what kind of connector would you use to split the amp's output to the Maggies, on the one hand, and the subwoofer on the other. Can I simply double up speaker connectors, have two sets of wires coming from the same output?
Follow Ups:
I strongly agree with the recommendation to run your Maggies full range and supplement with a sub only for the lowest octaves. The trick has always been getting the best match/integration between the two.Vandersteen runs the sub off the speaker outputs, and also inserts a capacitor on the input to the power amps (between the preamp and the amp). This filters the signal (first order high pass filter), so the main speakers gradually play less and less below the cutoff threshold while at the same time, the sub plays more and more. Hopefully seamlessly. My problem with this has been two-fold. First, the quality of the capacitor is critical to the sound. The stock Vandersteen one has a truly negative impact on sound quality, although an alternative one can sound OK. The bigger problem is that the crossover level is too high. That is, the Maggies will play cleanly down to around 40Hz, so there's too much Vandersteen footprint in the Maggie's sound.
A better approach is that used by REL in the Strata II. There you can select the crossover level and gain to get the best match to your Maggies. Using a much lower crossover level is much easier to integrate, and the systems I've heard set up this way are much more seamless.
So it depends on where your sub looks to get signal. If you have a low-level input, you could add a "y" connector from your preamp output, assuming you have one.
Dunno if this helps you. Subs are a good thing IMHO. I no longer use one in my system, ever since adding the Mye stands to my 1.6qr's. that stiffened my speakers up to the point where I felt I could live without the sub, and gain a lot cleaner (if less robust) bass line.
YMMV,
I agree the Vandersteen in-line x-over could be better. It was very easy to make my own with better caps. I do, however, feel that bringing the sub in to the mix approximately an octave above the speakers lower -3db point (regardless of whether using a low- or high-level signal) has a better end result than using it to fill in below the -3db point. It does take more setup, but I find it blends much more seamlessly. A shallow first order slope is key. Of course, YMMV.
I assume that you're trying the zero's to present a higher impedence to your amp. The subwoofers that accept input from the amplifier terminals present a high impedence to the amplifier, so they can be attached to the same amplifier outputs as your speakers.I read your message to say that you're using the Outlaw bass management module to manage the frequencies fed to the speakers? I don't know this unit. Does it allow you to treat your Maggies as full-range? If so, that's how I'd run them.
If your sub has the controls that allow it, then you can fill in from the bottom up, starting with the lowest frequency cutoff that you can and raising it only after listening to a variety of bass-heavy source material. The trick is to get the mesh right between the sub and your Maggies. I found that speaker positioning was more than half the game in accomplishing this and getting a smooth meld. Most rooms will have stronger/weaker bass modes. It's useful to identify them and use them to accent or ameliorate the bass augmentation as necessary.
I found the Rives CD (available on the Rives site) very helpful in accomplishing this. It's calibrated to work with a Ratshack sound pressure meter. You can play test tones and measure with/without the sub, and in different positions which will give you a lot of ammunition for getting the best match.
Hope this helps!
'Can I simply double up speaker connectors, have two sets of wires coming from the same output?
'Yes. I run a pair of Vandersteen subs which have high level inputs. The speakers and subs are fed via the same amp outputs.
The wire need not be large nor high end, it's only carrying a signal to the sub. Just run a second set of wires from the amp output. Vandersteen subs are a nice choice. Finicky to set up, but great when they're done.
have any sonic benefits , v.s. running a low level connection from preamp to sub?In my system my sunfire signature sub is connected to the second set of outputs on my VTL preamp.
I set the xover at about 35hz and have the volume fairly low..works pretty well
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