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Hi guys,As I've posted before my main system consists of a SET amp, tube CD, and a pair of Lowther horns.
Anyway recently I've become interested in dipol/baffle/active crossover/multi amped stuff. Obviously these items vary in application but it gives an idea of what I've been looking into.
As a second, play around with, system I've considered putting together a bi-amped, dipole system. The only catch is that I'd need to do it on the cheap! I've a 2nd CD player for a source, and could power the top part of a two way set up with an old Carver reciever I have. Inexpensive plate amps are plentiful as are active crossovers.
One of the crossovers I've found is dirt cheap at $60 plus shipping. It's a Nady unit. I did as search of this forum and found next to nothing concerning this unit.
It looks to be a 4 way crossover but I wonder if it could be used for different applications? They also produce a two way crossover for $10 extra bucks.(?)
Anyone know of these? Could it be a reasonable component in a second, experimental system?
I'd appreciate any and all input.
Rick
- http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Nady-CX23SW-3Way-Stereo-Crossover-?sku=183711 (Open in New Window)
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be about 1 octave below/above the actual xover point you are shooting for.set at 250hz the driver would start rolling off 1 octave before that so that when the 2 drivers meet they will sum flat.
Ron Welborne has high quality 2 way (active low and passive hi-pass) crossover kit .Have a look . I put it to getter and I'm just about to implement it into the system. Crossover is ~$100 and youll be able to knock some PSU for another $20. Regards. L
Contemplate this for me just a second.Source into say the Pyramid crossover, fed into two T-amps powering the Silver Iris coaxials?
Hey Rick,Just looking at specs, and never having heard the stuff, I don't see any show stoppers.
The Pyramid lists a THD of 0.01% and 2nd order filters, so it's at least trying. I do like the RCA jacks instead of the BNC/balanced, which would require adaptors for most. And the adjustability is nice, to find the best configuration. And it's frickin' cheap--Amazon has it refurbished for $55.
I suggest you buy one and give us a full report! :D
And, likewise not having heard it (big help I am), the Silver Iris "sounds" like a lot of bang for the buck.
If that's your goal--bang for the buck--Pyramid/Silver Iris seems reasonable.
I'm planning on the same idea, but maybe a notch more expensive--
Fostex FE166E and dual Dayton 15" Open Baffle Subwoofers per open baffle, and the DCX2496 ULTRADRIVE PRO DIGITAL CROSSOVER (paste!) which has a ton of flexibility, does equalization, and directly accepts a bitstream, allowing just one DA conversion (and no AD) in the playback chain. (Haven't heard them either--just take me out and shoot me.)
Your components seem like a good entry-level shot at the same idea.
But I've been wrong before, which is why I hope you'll report your experiences!
Best,
For use with creating 6th order BR or obtaining good room balance.
What type of system are you thinking of?Thanks
now than piss away money. Here is a link to some active crossovers. I will be using a pair of these with my vintage Altec Duplex speakers myself. At only $42 more than your $60 choice this might actually be a better deal at only $102 for the complete kit. The guy that runs the business was fast at answering my questions. He told me quite a few 2-way Altec speaker owners have purchased his crossovers and kits. It makes sense as the kit cost is appealing to anyone who has priced having their stock crossovers rebuilt, or buying new aftermarket passive ones. For the Model 19 and other 2-way VOT owners it makes sense as the stock crossovers are left alone to not affect the purists who want to buy stock speakers with the original crossovers still intact. Using one of these is a viable alternative. Good luck! John"Active crossover kit for our 2 way 4th order (24db/octave) Linkwitz-Riley active crossover. Image shown assembled.
Board is a full stereo (2 channels) with on-board regulated power supply. Board features 2 inputs (Left/Right) and has high and low pass outputs for both right and left channels. Kit includes board and all parts for a fully functional 2 way stereo crossover. Includes power transformer, parts list, schematic and assembly instructions. We use high quality parts, such as 2% tolerance polypropylene capacitors and 1% MIL spec resistors. Unit is very low noise and distortion, making it suitable for use with high efficiency loudspeakers, where other units may be objectionable. Suitable for mounting in an existing enclosure.
We stock values for the crossover frequencies listed on the pull-down menu above. For frequencies not listed, please contact us, and we will make efforts to satisfy your requirements."
I have the EC-24 crossover from Audio-Kits. A fellow music lover in our local users group has the Marchand, and I almost bought one as well, but found the Audio-Kits crossover first. The selling point for me was the power supply, which is part of the kit. That is a big deal in making it easier overall, instead of having to come up with a way to power the crossover. The parts included are very good. Better than the Marchand (but the Marchand is still a nice unit, to be fair). After building the EC-24 (which went smoothly) and listening to it for a couple of weeks, our users group got together for a bling listening test. We compared the EC-24 to the Marchand, a couple of homebuilts, and a few commercial 'PA' crossovers (Berringer, Rane and an Audio Arts). The PA units were not even close, sounding harsh compared to the EC-24, Marchand and the other homebuilts. The first place finisher was the EC-24, edging out one of the better homebuilts, with the Marchand coming in 3rd. The differences were slight listening to most of the rock music samples, but when we got to Classical smples, it was much more noticable. On Bernsteins 'Suite from Candide' (reference recordings RR-87), the EC-24 had noticably better dynamics than the other units, and did a better job on recovering the hall ambience. On 'A feather on the breath of God' by Hildegard of Bingen (MHS 5167500), the differences were again very noticable. Overall, this kit is very hard to beat, in my opinion, and our little listening test has sold a few more units to our members.
But with units like the Pyramid, Nady, ect. what do you find objectionable?Thanks
Thanks John,That's a resource I hadn't seen. The options are multiplying, which is great! Have you used this unit yet? I'd love to hear some experiences--I like what I see.
For what it's worth, Marchand Electric makes nice passive and active line-level crossovers, though they are a step up in price.
Thanks again,
in my xm-126. Taking care of my elderly Dad for now has definitely crushed the audio toy buying budget right out of me. I do not want to spend over $1K for another Marchand unit so this one at $102 seems to me to be one very good deal. I will be using it with my 15" Altec duplex speakers. I have one of the older versions that was built to mount in the ceilings. These originally came with onboard mounted passive crossovers mounted on the duplex speaker frames. My pair came without them. I plan to drive my pair of speakers with a vintage tube receiver with 2 sets of speaker jacks for use with a HDTV in a bedroom. With the CRT tube I will, or I should have no problems with image quality woes due to the alnico type magnets in the vintage Altec duplex drivers. Not all that is left for me to do is scrounge a pair of speaker enclosures for my vintage Altec drivers. John
Respect and best wishes on caring for your Dad. It's neat that, even on a budget, a resourceful person can still have creative fun and good sound--re-imagining vintage gear, and combining it with new concepts and/or technology. Good stuff, and good for the soul.Coincidentally, I have the Marchand XM126 kit, as yet unassembled for another project. I too want something different and economical for my high-efficiency open baffle system.
So far that audio-kit EC24K looks good. I nosed around the site, and it looks promising--they are working on a tube crossover, and have polls for visitors to vote on future products (I'm not a shill for them--really! ;^)
Thanks for the tip, and good luck in all your endeavors.
What are you waiting for? Toss that together, and use it in this system until the other starts taking shape!I love mine :)
not had Nady - that 2-way 12dB/octave xover looks kinda high at 250 lower limit (If I read it right)had cheap Pyramid Studio Pro PR3000 -(might also be a Pyle version under different #-?) 12dB/octave slopes again but could do underlap and controls can be set "flat" with no rolloff - for example with a 21" woofer on OB set 21" for 50Hz lowpass (helping to eq) and 100Hz highpass for a 12" coaxial
specs on unit ebay
Did it serve it's purpose? Any sonic issues with it?Freddyi, do you have any experience with other crossovers that you could compare the Pyramid unit against?
I'm sort of looking into a boxed subwoofer, 2 channel, with an open baffle unit on top. Maybe dipole, I dunno.
Thanks for the input Freddyi.
I picked up one of these a while back to play around with active crossovers on the cheap. Mine is the Pyle version (PYX-3X) but it is the same as the Pyramid. I've been pleased with its performance, although I don't have any experience with other active crossovers to compare it with. I chose it over the other similarly priced units by Behringher after reading some complaints from owners about the reliability of the Behringers. One thing I like about the Pyle/Pyramid (same company I think) is that it has RCA inputs/outputs (and also 1/4") so it's more compatible with a typical home stereo system than the ones that use only 1/4" and balanced inputs. The only thing I don't really like about it is that the crossover frequency points are preset not continuously adjustable. It seems very quiet though, but again, no experience with other designs. I'm also not using them with high efficiency drivers. I've only used mine as a 2-way up to now. . . . Charlie
Charlie, have you considered upgrading? Or does the Pyle/Pyramid unit suit your needs well enough?Thanks
I'm pretty pleased with it as it is. I mainly wanted to check out the whole concept of active crossovers without spending much and the Pyle/Pyramid certainly accomplishes that. I'd used active crossovers occasionally when I used to do live sound mixing but I wanted to have one to play with at home. The kit mentioned above might be better but then you have to assemble it. If you want plug and play the Pyle works quite well. The system I'm using it with is probably a bit unusual. I picked up a pair of old furniture style cabinets a while back that have some Bozaks installed in them. These are the early Bozaks with the paper cone tweeters mounted in front of the woofer. I never liked the sound of the tweeters so I disconnected them and I'm running the the cabinet with the back removed so its kind of an open baffle of sorts. For mids and highs I'm using a pair of Genesis V6 cabinets - 6 1/2" woofer and inverted dome tweeter in a ported cabinet with its passive internal crossover. Using a Pilot SA-260 EL-34 amp for the Bozak and a Pilot 500 EL-84 amp on the Genesis. At some point I'll try some other speakers and use it as a 3-way. . . . . Charlie
hi Rick - Pyramid wasn't too bad for what I tried with transnova hafler amp on 12" and 200w amp on 21" - didn't run any boxes and not owned "good" active crossover yet.
And you might check the Behringer units over on partsexpress They have some cheap ones, and I think Behringer is better-known, for what that's worth.
thanks - got cx3400 laying around in pile - would try digital but leery - partly due to maybe not being able to see or work interface on their old eq.
http://www.parts-express.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?Partnumber=248-664
Any thoughts gentlemen?Rick
- http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Nady-CX22SW-2Way-Stereo-Crossover?sku=183703 (Open in New Window)
Hey Rick,Thanks for the links and the idea.
I'm building a similar all-open-baffle system, with my current bogie being:
* Fostex FE166E fullranger for highs (Madisound)
* Dual Dayton IB385-8 15" IB SERIES open baffle woofers per channel (partsexpress)
* Behringer DCX2496 ULTRADRIVE PRO DIGITAL CROSSOVER (partsexpress) crossed over at 180Hz
* 300B SET for the highs, sand for the lows.Chris has tipped me about sending the bitstream from a Squeezebox straight into the Behringer, bypassing any additional AD/DA conversion, but that's another thread. ;^)
The Nady has potential, particularly for a system using analog sources--high S/N, low price. My one concern from the specs is the relatively high lowest crossover frequency of 250Hz.
That's a bit high for my (and presumably your) purposes. One of the appeals of fullrange speakers is running without crossover in the crucial frequencies, and 250Hz is getting up into the vocal range. It might still be okay, but given that the Nady doesn't offer the option of crossing over lower, I'd lean away from it.
But of course $70 isn't much of a risk, so it might be worth a shot. If you do, please report back!
Hope this helps,
George
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