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I'm listening now for the first time to the Mendelssohn Piano Trios on Pentatone, and I am deeply moved by the beauty, energy, and charm of music from which I really didn't expect much. Every SACD I own which features the young Julia Fischer (I believe I have every one currently available) is almost beyond criticism. Whether she is playing solo, in a trio, or accompanying an orchestra, her tone is voluptuous, her intonation perfect, her interpretation seemingly a combination of the best features of every other performance I've heard. Is it just a coincidence that every recording is well nigh perfect, and that everyone associated with the performance seems to be playing at their peak and in perfect sympathy with her? Have I been put under some kind of a spell by this sorceress of the violin? Is she also bewitching every orchestra, every recording engineer, even the damn microphones?Would Pentatone PLEASE get this woman to record every violin piece ever written before the spell is broken?
Follow Ups:
I placed a review of Fischer's unaccompanied Bach on sa-cd.net shortly after its release. I did compare her to Grumiaux. On a thread at sa-cd.net, the director of PentaTone wrote that he passed on my review to Fischer. Unsurprisingly, she didn't reply.She is due to record the Elgar for PentaTone. Apparently, she is the best selling artist of this label, which explains why PentaTone have revised their website, so that the first pictures one sees now are of her.
. . . Babe Violinists!It reminds me of last year here in the SF Bay Area when we had Julia Fischer, Lisa Batiashvili, and Lara St. John all appearing within a couple of weeks of each other. Bliss!
Anyway, on to the points raised by your posting and some of the responses below:
With regard to the repertoire she gets to record, I think Ms. Fischer has done rather well for herself in her association with Pentatone. It seems as if they're releasing her performances on a regular basis. I believe Pentaman said they have another couple of her releases in the pipeline for this year: the rest of the Mozart violin and orchestra works (Concertone, etc.), as well as the Brahms Violin Concerto and Double Concerto. So she's certainly getting her opportunities. I would love to have her performance of the Saint-Saëns First Violin Sonata (which she played so brilliantly in Berkeley last year) available on recording.
With regard to the sound quality of Pentatone recordings, I agree with you that most of them sound close to state of the SACD art - especially including Fischer's recording of the Bach Sonatas and Partitas. I don't know what more you could want in the engineering for these works - wonderful string tone and perfect balance between direct and reflected sound (at least IMHO!).
It's interesting that jsm mentioned Count Grumiaux - I have the Pentatone quad SACD reissue of the Brahms Horn Trio and First Sonata with Grumiaux and friends, and, as fine a violinist as he is, he does overbalance the other instruments in both of these works - and not to the benefit of the music. Contrast that to the Fischer and friends Pentatone SACD of the Mendelssohn Trios, where the balance among instruments is truly exemplary, and you're on a higher level of musicianship (at least in that respect!). So although Count Grumiaux was indeed a great violinist, there are areas of interpretation where I prefer other violinists to him. So in this larger sense, I do agree with jsm that there are so many aspects to violin playing and all around musicianship that it's a bit crazy to say that only one violinist is "the best". (And I know you weren't saying that, as you've already explained. :-) )
It certainly doesn't hurt that she is a babe, in a Jodie Foster kind of way.It must have been a real treat to hear her live performance. Was her tone as sweet as it is on recordings? I've seen a lot of "star" violinists, and not all of them sounded so good in person. Maybe it has something to do with the instrument they select for a performance, but I found some to sound thin and wiry, almost unpleasant, even compared to recordings. Quite a disappointment to hear live instruments sound worse than a favorite disc!
Wish I could have heard Grumiaux live.
You asked if her tone is as sweet heard live as on the recordings. This brings a smile to my face and an involuntary chuckle. Oh man - the recordings don't but begin to tell the story! I have heard her 5 times between October 2005 and May 2006 in Boston's Symphony Hall, Schenectady's Union College Memorial Hall and Baltimore's Meyerhoff Hall.When she wants it too be sweet, you never heard anything so sweet. But she is a master (strange to think of someone so young as a master of anything) of tonal color. She is capable of a veritable kalidoscope of tonal color. On Violinist.com another violinist commented that her notes, (referring to her performance of the Beethoven concerto in Baltimore) flowed out in a way that they were left suspended in the air, like stars twinkling in the night..
of course violinist like soloists on many instruments come with their own styles and interpretations. If one prefers violinist x over y, and it often varies on a work-by-basis, that of course doesn't mean x is a better violinist than y. For example, in general, I prefer Fischer's playing to Heifitz, who was an absolutely great technical virtsuoso, simply because I am not a fan of Heifitz' style of playing. I even find it annoying. However, when I make direct comparisons of the same piece, I prefer the playing of Grumiaux or even Zuckerman (not Perlman!) to Fischer. For example, a comparison of the Bach Unaccompanied Violin Sonatas and Partitas played by Grumiaux and Fischer is fascinating. It shows that Fischer really is a very fine violinist, but for me Grumiaux's playing has much more depth and impact. However, his style is different, and at the time of the recordings he was a very seasoned artist.As for Pentatone, I don't know what it is, but I have many Pentatone SACDs, and none of them has top-tier sound. Maybe I've been unlucky. On some, the CD layer is significantly better than than SACD layer; the Rossini Overtures is a good example of this.
Agreed that there are finer recordings of unaccompanied Bach. Notably Milstein and Szeryng. A lot more depth, which I believe originates from the grittiness of their tone (it's not as neat and tidy, but I find this music demands some edge). Unbroken chords in Bach's solo works need bite, and a lot of newer artists shy away from this. You hear that tendency in Hilary Hahn's recordings as well as Julia Fischer's. But these are still fine recordings.
Your experience with Pentatone SACDs mirrors mine for their RQR reissues. What experience do you have with there DSD releases?
It could well be that my less-than-stellar sound experience is entirely or largely confined to the RQR reissues. I'll have to go back and check. The Bach Sonatas with Fischer is DSD. I thought the sound on that was quite good, and I did compare the CD layer, which wasn't as good. I have heard more compelling or engaging sounding violins on other records than this, though.I mentioned the Rossini Overtures because it received very high praise for its sound in reviews. I found the MCH version had the poorest sound, the two channel better, and the RBCD the best sound on that disc. In fact, I thought the MCH sound put it among the poorer SACD recordings that I have. I was quite disappointed. I bought it at the same time I bought the Fischer Dvorak 9th, and the contrast in sound quality was striking.
Actually the Philips Dvorak you refer to was recorded by the same people who record the PentaTone DSD recordings ....and with the same Polyhymnia equipment. Read on the last page (before the inside rear cover):"Recording, mastering and editing facilities by Polyhymnia International BV on behalf of Emil Berliner Studios."
The recording engineer in this instance was Roger de Schot whom you may notice is the same engineer that did the Strauss Waltzes with Kreizburg and the Vienna Symphony for PentaTone.
PentaTone RQR recordings depend on the quality of the original Philips Tapes and on the quality of their preservation.
The new DSD recordings have all (so far) been done by Polyhymnia International. The best Philips SACDs were also done by Polyhymnia! Its a shame Universal employed Emil Berliner for their subsequent recordings because they are all drastically inferior to any of Polyhymnia's products.
Although I don't have a simple explanation for it (I can make up some hypotheses, though), it could be that some discs/labels sound better on some systems than on others. i am not doubting that Pentatone RQRs can sound great on some systems or to some people, but on average on my system they don't. On the other hand, most Telarcs (but not all), Philips, and Harmoni Mundi sound superb on my system. RCAs are a mixed bag.Do you have the Rossini Overtures? I only keep bringing it up because the reviews I saw just raved about the sound.
HowdyI used to wonder if it was my taste or lack of a resolving system, but I've taken to asking people which discs they don't like on their systems and playing them for them on mine and now I believe that tho there are many paths to audio bliss, not everyone strives for a system that plays many things well. Here's a post from Christine Tham after she visited me: http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/hirez/messages/218252.html
Here's a post from Christine Tham after she visited me: http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/hirez/messages/218252.htmlThis is certainly a sterling testamonial, but then you have to realize it comes from Christine "There Are No Bad Recordings" Tham! :-)
And I have many of them. In fact, there are times I wonder if the best sound on SACD is actually analog sourced, the second best DSD, followed by PCM sources.
I'm sure she is not the absolute best at everything she attempts, but, so far at least, all of her recordings are on a very high level of artistry and sonics. I agree with you about the Grumiaux Bach being an equally attractive or slightly better performance, but what really pushed Ms Fischer to the top of the list for me was the Pentatone recording compared to the aged (but well preserved) Philips recording. Grumiaux is one of the artists I would like to resurrect for the purpose of modern recording. Perhaps after she is seasoned with passing years and numerous performances, she will be capable of offering the same insights into the music as do veteran players. For such a young woman, however, I find her skills far exceed those of the wiry-toned Hilary Hahn and some of the other young lionesses.I had the privilege of hearing Zuckerman only a couple weeks ago with my local symphony orchestra playing a Bach Violin Concerto. He was also the guest conductor for the evening, and he gave a rousing rendition of the Tchaikovsky Fourth Symphony, a work I never cared much for. As soloist, his honeyed tone and freshly sprung rhythms reminded me of, you guessed it, Julia Fischer! Or maybe it was the other way around...
I've never heard a criticism similar to yours regarding Pentatone SACD's. Many that I have, though certainly not all, feature some of the very best sonic representations of an orchestra or chamber group. Even the older Philips quad recordings are superb when reprocessed with DSD. May I suggest you audition the Mendelssohn Piano Trios or Mozart Violin Concertos as a good example of new recordings that are really outstanding for the musical content and sonic qualities?
I believe she is scheduled to perform the Elgar Violin Concerto with Yakov Kreizberg in the Spring of next year. Since this is such a big and important concerto perhaps Pentatone have recording plans. Let us hope so. I agree, she is a very special violinist.
Dave
And I actually LIKE Julia Fischer.Her playing is NOT the "be all/end all" of the violin, however. Nor are Pentatone's recording choices for capturing solo violin.
Thanks for your mature comment.I never wrote that she was the be all/end all of violin playing. I wrote that I really enjoy her wonderful recordings. Rather than merely provide sophomoric criticism, perhaps you could make some recommendations of your own. Anyone with your moniker should have a well-informed opinion of fine performances and recordings from which we could all benefit.
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But all that floppy-mouthed gushing was just too much to bear. It's a bit like the audiences at most classical concerts these days who leap to their feet shouting "Bravo!" following a performance that would earn a rating of "Moderately O.K."Miss Fischer is a wonderful player, and based upon what little I've seen of her in interviews, a very intelligent and pleasant human being. But, please, re-read the original poster's comments, and you may agree with me that they sound like sickening hero worship.
You certainly have a sour and humorless attitude. When a new talent bursts upon the scene and produces a string of remarkable recordings right out of the gate, I think it deserves proper recognition, even celebration. I apologize if my enthusiasm and whimsical attempt to stimulate discussion offended your snobbish sense of propriety.There are other posts here, by people more interested in discussing this topic rather than criticising contributors, that make comparisons of Fischer's skills to Grumiaux and other renowned artists. I think that speaks volumes about what she has already accomplished, and she's only 21. I know she has a long way to go and a lot to prove (and, I hope, improve). Yes, you might say this youngster is my heroine, but I certainly don't worship her. I worship Beethoven and Brahms.
My other heroes are the Pentatone executives who were smart enough to recognize her talent and make a huge gamble on it. In these days of multiple releases of uninspiring dreck poorly recorded by middling talents and reissues of ancient and sometimes incomprehensibly revered classics (Why? Because it's cheap, that's why!), the management at Pentatone and their artists deserve our thanks and our money for giving us the opportunity to hear something vibrant and fresh with truly remarkable sonics. It's the happiest of coincidences (probably not really witchcraft) that at least some of these new releases feature the ingenue Ms Fischer, and they're all very, very good. Obviously, everyone involved in these recordings is doing their utmost to give us lasting value and pleasure, and they deserve to be praised for that. A record company that cares about its product and its customers? How unique! Pardon me for bringing it to your attention.
It's too bad that you don't use this forum as an opportunity to offer something positive or informative to its participants. In your posts on this topic, mostly what you've done so far is disparage the style of my post and insult me. Perhaps you should stick to the topic and stow your condescending personal attacks.
We're getting WAY too far from the point of my original criticism: fawning praise is nauseating.If it was your intention to add some levity by being "whimsical" in your original post, then I offer my apologies. You haven't been posting here long enough for me to recognize your true "voice" vs. an affectation that you've adopted for a single post. To me, it sounded like a pretentious windbag trying to impress.
Still, I ask you to re-read your original post, all the while imagining yourself using these EXACT words in a regular conversation with family and friends. At the minimum, I expect you'd get rolling eyes. Most people should also expect and feigned gagging and comments that include the word, "dork."
I hope you also re-read MY posts, noting that, not only did I NOT disparage Julia Fischer, I complimented her. (Pentatone, however, has been hit or miss, for me. I gave up buying their disks after only two hits out of six.)
While I have sampled several of Julia Fischer's recordings, the only one I actually own is the unaccompanied Bach. I rarely listen to it, mainly because of what I consider excessive reflected sound which muddies up the clarity of the solo violin. It also sounds too closely-mic'd, unnaturally highlighting string and bow noise. It's funny that you mentioned the "wiry-toned" Hilary Hahn, whose tone and cleaner recorded sound I prefer. I've got tickets to her performance of the Sibelius concerto this coming Tuesday.
While I admit to stomping on your original post, I'm not looking for a war. Truce?
You mentioned Hilary Hahn. Having been a big fan of hers since 2002, it took me some time to recognize that some notes of hers have a characteristic that while not quite wiry, leaves a lot to be desired. I have heard Hahn live in Baltimore's Meyerhoff Hall, three times in Carnegie Hall, in Boston's Symphony Hall, twice in Boston's Jordan Hall at the New England Conservatory, once in Avery Fischer Hall, three times in a high school auditorium in Skaeatles NY, and three times last summer at the Verbier Music Festival in Switzerland. I know what she sounds like; I know and love her playing.So far I have heard Fischer only 5 times (in the Meyerhoff; at Symphony Hall, Boston; Avery Fischer in NY and in Memorial Hall at Union College in Schenectady). But though I only heard Fischer maybe a third as frequently as Hahn, I can say unequivocally that Fischer is the more interesting (interpretively speaking) artist and has a MUCH greater variety of tone color, whose hues are markedly more beautiful than anything I ever heard from Hahn.
Hilary is good, but Fischer completely mesmerizes her audiences and takes them on unique musical journeys employing a range of tonal color and a sweetness of tone (when she feels it is appropriate) that Hahn can only dream about. Both can be excellent in matters of phrasing, but here too Fischer maintains a real edge. Her understanding of the Beethoven concerto as realized last May in Baltimore transcends every other performance I ever heard (I have about 20 on LP, CD and SACD.) Grimaux's PentaTone RQR performance, for example, sounds pedestrian to these ears by comparison.
Julia Fischer is, above all else, a profoundly lyrical player. However, she is sufficiently well trained and disciplined that while she exerts at times extraordinary plasticity of tempi, taking essential time to linger, where musically beneficial, over this or that passage to give the melodic content its full due, she never, ever, fails to maintain the forward momentum of the music she plays. To quote one of the critics writing of the Baltimore Beethoven, "While she made time stand still, she never impeded the forward pulse of the music."
While I have sampled several of Julia Fischer's recordings, the only one I actually own is the unaccompanied Bach. I rarely listen to it, mainly because of what I consider excessive reflected sound which muddies up the clarity of the solo violin.Are you listening to two-channel or multi-channel? I find that sometimes, when I compare the two-channel tracks to the same multi-channel tracks, the engineers seem to have mixed in too much reverb from the rear channels into the two-channel mix. (I don't believe I've even listened to the two-channel tracks of the J. Fischer Sonatas and Partitas.)
...not that I have anything against multi-channel. The configuration and multi-use nature of my listening room simply makes multichannel impractical. I'll have to take your word for it on this one.The DVD that was included with my set suggests that the recording was closely-mic'd in an empty church. And it sure sounds like it. You can clearly hear the clicking sound that comes from the bow changing direction on a string, as well as the 'surface noise' of the rosined bowhair as it scrapes across the strings. These are all normal sounds, but they don't project well, and in a concert venue only those in the first few rows would have a chance of noticing them.
Also, for me, there is a sense of unease about the performance on this disc, and it could be that the in-your-face character of the sound is a contributing factor. Julia Fischer's speed and intonation are impressive, as is the gusto with which she plays. But, compared to my two favorite recordings of some of these works, those by James Ehnes and Hilary Hahn, Julia Fischer's feels rushed, shouty, and less lyrical.
That said, she could run her hands through a meat grinder and still outplay me.
The DVD that was included with my set suggests that the recording was closely-mic'd in an empty church. And it sure sounds like it. You can clearly hear the clicking sound that comes from the bow changing direction on a string, as well as the 'surface noise' of the rosined bowhair as it scrapes across the strings. These are all normal sounds, but they don't project well, and in a concert venue only those in the first few rows would have a chance of noticing them.Yes I agree. (I saw the DVD too.) - I like this type of sound however. I usually prefer to sit "close to the action", and, in moonlighting as a piano accompanist, I'm often onstage with the violinist! So it partly boils down to what you're used to and what you prefer.
I have another question which you may be able to answer. Another listener (local) told me that in one of the sonatas or partitas (sorry, I don't remember which one), Fischer did not follow the score exactly and instead used what sounded (to him) like a nineteenth-century emendation in one section. He also said that this is the same thing that Szeryng does in that spot on his recording. (Don't know if he was talking about Szeryng's mono version or his stereo DG version.) Do you know if this is true? - If it is, it's probably another reason I like Fischer's recording! :-)
Yep; it's a matter of personal preference. Sometimes I like the "up close and personal" sound, and I usually prefer it for chamber music, since it tends to provide better separation of the instruments.(My favorite of the few Pentatone disks I have is the Keisuke Wakao oboe recording.)I don't dig close mic'ing for full orchestra works, because it robs the strings of their lushness, and I don't believe it represents an acurate portrayal of the event from ANY seat in the house: nobody, not even the conductor, can be simultaneously five feet away from each section of the orchestra! I know most will disagree, but, as exciting as they are, (and I own eight of them) I don't think the Living Presence SACD releases sound as natural as their Living Stereo counterparts. To each their own.
As for the supposed deviation from the score by Julia Fischer, I can unequivocally state, "Uh...I dunno." I'm only intimately familiar with the Partita #3, having played most of it as bowing practice. If asked to guess, I'd say the Chaconne from the Partita #2 is the most likely candidate for monkeying around in.
If I can locate the score, and can find some spare time away from kids, wife, cell phone, computer, and customers.....
Please reread all our posts as often and as carefully as you want--especially the one about barfing. Take your own lecture to me about heeding my "voice" to heart. Just think how much better (and closer to topic) this thread could have been if you had responded to my original post as others did: with critical or constuctive arguments instead of attacking me. That's called an exchange of ideas instead of a flurry of insults.I maintain that all my friends who know anything about classical music and recordings would have at least smiled at my comments, then presented a respectful or possibly humorous, maybe even sarcastic response to them. No one I know would have been nauseated by them or feigned gagging. I couldn't care less about eye-rolling or name-calling--I've rolled plenty of eyes before, and many of my friends think I'm a dork anyway just for listening to and caring about classical music.
It appears that no one else here was upset in the least by my style, either. What my original post did for everyone else was to stimulate a discussion regarding the performing merits of JF and Pentatone's recordings of her (and others). You were the only person to attempt to belittle my comments and me personally, and you did it quite sophomorically. Twice. Apology accepted. I apologize for calling you sour and humorless. Truce by silence.
I do respect your contrary opinion regarding HH's and JF's tone. Being a string player yourself, you are certainly better informed to make a judgment. I heard Ms Hahn last year with my local symphony, and I thought she was just okay. Many thought the piece she played was a very poor choice: one of Paganini's concertos. Although technically challenging, it was absolute fluff and thoroughly boring. I did NOT give her a standing ovation. Just heard Zukerman a few weeks ago--now there's a sweet tone. He played and conducted a Bach concerto and conducted Tchaikovsky Symphony No. 4. Altogether an excellent show, and for that I stood and applauded quite enthusiastically.
Nothing, of course.FWIW, I agree with you, based on the one recording I have of Ms. Fischer. I do not consider myself to have the experience, training, etc. to express an opinion about the quality of the peformance, so I won't. But, on a kunckle-scraper level, I enjoy listening to it.
The commercial realities for classical music are that the repetoire is not being materially expanded. What is being "expanded" is the advent of new performers who can deliver appealing performances and, for people who care a lot about sonics, recordings that do a better job of capturing realistic-sounding sonics.
If someone like Ms. Fischer can generate interest in the music and an outfit like Pentatone chooses to promote her in technically well-done recordings that, it seems to me, is something to be applauded. One would hope that, at her age, she has more development to go as an artist. To say that is not a criticism.
To dimiss her out of hand, it seems to me, is both unfair and foolish if one cares about the music.
"To dimiss her out of hand, it seems to me, is both unfair and foolish if one cares about the music."I don't recall anybody having done this. Who are you referring to?
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