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In Reply to: Wow, nothing since 5/20 on this board. We can do better than that can't we? posted by Tony on June 2, 2005 at 12:32:03:
Problem number one is everyone can't even seem to judge what this forum is about due to it's very oblique title "hip pop stop". I assume it to mean new releases that are perhaps unknown, but far too many seem to be connotating it with rap and hip hop. It's hip POP, not hip HOP people. My assumption is those people are mistaken, but who knows...... in any case the title ought to be rectified and this boards purpose made clear.Secondly, even if my assumption about what this forum is for is correct, NOBODY wants to hear about new music. New music to people means OTHER PEOPLES MUSIC, and without question the VAST majority of people don't want to hear 'other' peoples music. They KNOW they know what they like, and they don't need other people to tell them about their music.
Think I'm crazy? Go to the mall with your favorite disc (esp. a title unknown to the public) and TRY to give it to someone. They'll look at you like you're mad and NOBODY will take it off you. Those that would take it only do it out of fear or to get rid of you, and would dump it in the next recepticle once you are out of eyesight.
You not only can't make the horse drink, you can't even lead him to the well.
I've been posting on here a few years, and while I don't advertise my website I make it no secret. In all that time only ONE person contacted me thru interest after seeing it and asked for some title rec's to buy. I gave them to him, he actually bought them, and then got back to me telling me he liked them all very much.
Yet my traffic counter tells me I get about 20-30 hits a week coming from audiogon. But nobody asks questions, nobody writes to say they bought a reviewed item and liked it. One guy out of thousands, that's it.
Finally, while some may take offense it is my impression that many of the people here (and those listening to avant garde music in general) only do so to be different. I had a friend growing up who made a habit out of taking a piece of bread, going to his refridgerator, and loading it with whatever was handy in there: a pickle, mayonaise, pepperroni, some red beets, meatloaf, and then he'd fold it in half and eat it. 1% because he was hungry, 99% because he lived off the shock value it caused in others. IMHO too many people into "outside" music do so for shock value or to feel special or different.
The simple fact is, people don't care, and you can't make them care. Yet everyone will whine about the charts, everyone will whine there aren't good music programs and concerts on TV like there used to be, but if you present it to them they look at you like you're holding poison. The same is true about the gear we use. You can't make the general population care about that either.
It sounds like I'm saying this board isn't worth the space it takes up. I wasn't, but the statement is probably a correct one.
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That would be the equivalent of saying "Wasn't all the best 60's and 80's music about Brit bands? Maybe that's why nobody cares..." All the best jazz musicians are black, maybe that's why nobody cares... I'm the least PC person on the planet but that's almost the most racist reason for not listening to something I ever heard anyone give.I can't help that Britain in the 80's was the hippest place on the planet anymore than I can help that Scandinavia now is. What happens is that a band like the Beatles or Smiths come along and influence every other kid in that country to want to do the same thing, and then it takes off.
Meanwhile there will always be people who makes statements like yours above. In any case it's also wrong. Only 3 of my 7 most recent reviews are Scandinavian, and only 1 out of the next 5 to be done is.
In any case the point is if you want to ignore brilliant music because you have to pidgeon hole it, hey, knock yourself out. And if you are jumping to a misguided conclusion that they all sing in swedish or something, you are entirely wrong. Every one of them sings in english. I won't bother to get into why, but they all do, and that means virtually every indie band in the world regardless of where they are from.
So if you're telling me you went to the Labrador website like I directed and went to their clips page like I also directed and you couldn't find ANYTHING there you liked musically, then there is really no helping you anyway and in fact why you are even here is a mystery to me. And if you didn't go and listen then you are acting like a troll who jumped to an ill informed conclusion. But in many ways you demonstrated the sort of antipathy and resistance people always put up when faced with something new and "strange".
All I know is when I come across a new album that is supposed to be good, my first question isn't what nationality they are. If it's yours then you'll have to live and suffer with your own agendas. Like the old adage, "You just can't help some people".
Go to Rocky road & the first name you see is Coldplay. Isn't that a pop group ? It's not exactly 'rock' is it. Where do you put Nick Cave & the bad Seeds or Tom Waits or Bjork ? It isn't Rock either and if it came out yesterday and the songs weren't written by Handel then that makes it Pop music dosen't it ? Can someone tell me what the difference between Folk Music & Pop music ? If you subtract the money & the record label, there's maybe not much in it.I don't agree with the sandwich scenareo. If I hear a record I like, I go and get it. I couldn't care less if someone decides to slap a lable like 'trip hop' or 'acid jazz' on it. What about 'R & B'. Who invented that misnomer ? I'm sure there are people out there who listen to stuff to impress others but I bet there are few here and they may not listen to Pop music either.
By the way, I've never seen your site but could you direct me ? Pop music around here is thrash metal if you're under 20, Nationalist choirs if you're over 40 and Celine Dion if you listen to the radio. It's hell and I can do with all the leads I can get.
Obviously "genres" and names are used as an aid to catagorize things so we can communicate with each other better, but of course things will always fall in grey areas bewteen those categories.Part of it also has to do with the history of pop music. For the sake of saying it, I'll explain it. Pop music is of course "popular" music and has always referred to music that was popular with people because it had catchy melodies they could sing or whistle.
If you have ever seen the movie the Wonders that is what things used to be like. Record companies were happy having the hit song of the summer, even if the band never struck gold again. Somebody else would come along next year. The result was tons of artists in the 50's and 60's getting notice. There are as many worthies now, only they get no press whatsoever.
However, it was the independent labels that found that new talent for them, and when they all died off in the 70's due to that decades recession, the majors were left alone and clueless and by the 80's they had changed their policy entirely. Instead of 10 new bands selling 100,000 copies each, they tried to make 1 "supergroup" who'd sell a million alone.
A problem arose for them in the UK during the 80's however as the scene there caused a rebirth of indie labels (where Nick Cave and Bjork/Sugarcubes belong) which was producing tons of great new bands. The US majors didn't want tons of new bands. They figured it would confuse buyers. They just wanted to sell 5 million Madonna records, they didn't want people buying New Order records instead, ESPECIALLY if it was an import sale.
At first they ignored it hoping it would go away. It didn't. So then they started signing these bands (thereby making import copies of their stuff illegal here) but then they would do almost nothing to promote or sell those bands. Like Home Depot buying out other chains just to shut them down.
This went on until the 90's, when 2 things happened: The UK scene finally tanked, and the US majors got a new idea. They took a few bands like Smashing Pumpkins, Nirvana, green day etc... and made a "new" category they called "alternative". That's what Coldplay is. And IMHO all these bands now sound the same: Trite and crappy. They mutated the beast to make it look like they were giving you a choice, but in fact they are not.
The indie scene has indeed arisen again and it started about 95-97, but it is now located on the web, and instead of the UK it is now Sweden that is shining.
My website is the Indiepop Spinzone. How do I know about stuff? I didn't actually until I found out what was going on, and that the scene existed but solely on the web. I thought it ended back around 1990 and I had bought virtually nothing in the 90's. Places one used to get info, like the NME, had become even more usless than I imagined and where not clued in themselves to what was going on. I got clued back in about 1999-2000.
I didn't mean everyone is like the "sandwich scenario". I know people like you are out there. I just think a large number are however.
OK, now if and when you visit my site you're going to be a good 5 years behind. That's a lot, and it's easy to not know where to start.
First go here - Labrador. It's probably the premier Swedish label right now. The album on the right with the leaf on the cover is the new Sambassadeur LP. In the description box is a link for a video. If you have a good internet connection click it. (be warned, you might actually be singing it by the time it's over. I don't want you getting too happy too fast :^ )
If it's loading too slow then click the tab at the top for the sounds page. There's so much there you could spend the rest of the year with just that.
Also on my site if you click the link for new reviews there you can access my top tens lists for the past 2 years. I would especially point out Ronderlin, Sondre Lerches debut, Postal Service, James Kirk, Corduroy Utd. and the Hepburns for starters. (and the Club 8 self titled album) Also on my main page there is a link for a shop I host called popsicle. The new Holm album and Labradors new LP (the band not the label) Instamatic Lovelife can be had, and both come highly endorsed.
TO purchase any of the rest, check my links page. Tonevendor, twee kitten and parasol are the best bets to find it, but look at amazon too. You can often find used copies for only a few bucks.
OK, let the smoke clear..... is that it? Well, it will get you started. You can also listen to clips on my site radio, and if you have a question please ask me any time. Oh, and what is this music called? Generally anymore it is just "indie", but as you say there are countless flavours in it, like there used to be.
Good luck on your very worthy pursuit. May god take mercy on your wallet.
I have never seen it stated so clearly.
Many thanks for the links - I now have some work to do. The devil with economy.Best regards,
Especially if you like it. I love a happy ending.....
Howdy. I checked out your radio playlist. I really liked Guitar, 'house full of time' Ashby, 'Anyone, Anywhere' & Ralph Myerz 'clouds'. Gonna see if my record dealer man is as good as he thinks he is.Best regards,
No slight but a lot of this is quite hard to come by.The Guitar is getting hard to find already. I looked around and only twee kitten still had it here . At that it's a special order. Keep em crossed.
NOBODY has that Ralph Myers anymore. It was only a limited EP and it appears it has gone OOP. The tracks I stick after the reviewed items I put on because I like, I don't always check if stuff is still available before I do it. And with things like they are, many releases don't get pressed over 1,000 copies.
As for the Ashby, I'm interviewing them (her) right now and she is on a quirky german label that goes out of it's way to make things hard to obtain. This new album is available in the US only here right now.
However their debut can still be found used and I'd suggest you get that. I think it's still better. Try here
If you liked Guitar, you might wish to check out both the Radio Dept. and the Legends. (both on Labrador, clips can be found back in my original link) And while there substitute the Mondial for the Ralph Myerz, you'll be glad you did. And just trust me, buy the Ronderlin album.
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