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These rules are necessary but not sufficient to end up with a happy purchase.1. Buy the sound and not the brand: find out waht sound you like and then find the brands that make that sound.
2. Start by researching/auditioning the least expensive products first and then work up the price ladder: quality and price are related, but it's too complicated. This way you can tell how the incremntal sonic benefits are related to the additional cost.
You get the sound you like at the lowest cost.
Follow Ups:
partially true - I might add component sinergy, it is key.Fernando
I have to agree with you on the above, I also would like to add to it. Buying good sound doesnt mean that you have to overspend, some of us have the ability and the money to that but most of us dont. Buy what you can afford and TRY to get the best sound for your money and your ears, also, if you cant afford to buy new buy used. Like you stated in option #1 buy the sound first and not the brand. If you can afford the brand at a new price, shop for it for the specific brand at a used price.The "used" market is a Godsent to most so called "audiophiles"
Hi all, I just wanted to point this out, mainly because of the shock factor to myself, and that I actually wanted confirmation that I was seeing it, but I don't think I've seen these 2 words together this much in ANY of the asylums, especially this one, but here they are:"I agree"
wow, i feel like asking someone to pinch me . . . :)
BT
These rules are necessary but not sufficient to end up with a happy purchase.
That's a thing with audio - we can be happy with our purchase and not realize how bad it was until sometime later.1. Buy the sound and not the brand: find out waht sound you like and then find the brands that make that sound.
Sure but...
I think there's an almost infinite variety of kinds of sounds one might like. And even if one can generalize a kind of sound there are a variety of flavors to chose from.
Audio verbiage learned from reading magazines may have some usefulness but is misleading - especially to newbies. Hearing and applying and then quantifying a systems performance using such descriptors is only relevant if a listener is enamored with the general sound quality in the first place. Ie. unless one already loves listening to the system there's no need for such quantification.
But I hear it all the time - a listener describing the sound of a system using audiophile verbiage. To me it means nothing unless the listener is moved and/or captivated by the music/sound in the first place.
2. Start by researching/auditioning the least expensive products first and then work up the price ladder: quality and price are related, but it's too complicated. This way you can tell how the incremntal sonic benefits are related to the additional cost.
Agree. I believe if we can't build an under $3k-$4K audio system we can live with we shouldn't be buying expensive audio equipment.
Give me rhythm or give me death!
Regarding rule #2 where you say:"quality and price are related, but it's too complicated"
I don't think it's complicated and quality and price aren't always related, especially with our so-called "audiophile" gear and some of the junk peddlers out there.
I've seen some inexpensive gear that is well built with attention to detail using quality parts - and no unnecessary items like thick front panels with handles that can double as weapons.
And I've seen some fairly expensive gear that looks like it was slapped together as part of a high school shop class project. It amazes me what "audiophiles" will buy.
I won't mention specific brands because it will only cause a major stir not only from owners but from dealers who sell this crap.
Please share what you know.I guess this site is OK.We would like to know who peddles junk in the guise of audiophile goodies.Regards
I agree: not for every piece of gear, but on average it's true. I am safer off starting at the bottom as a result. There is some pretty good low priced stuff and some pretty bad high priced stuff.
"I won't mention specific brands because it will only cause a major stir not only from owners but from dealers who sell this crap."I'm sorry to hear that. I thought that is exactly what the Asylum is for--to share information so that others of us get the good stuff and avoid the "crap".
We are audiophiles here, primarily, not dealers.
Mel
nt
A caveat: sometimes a good sounding but poorly made piece of gear (tight budget) won't hold up. So the reputation of the manufacturer for durability and the like should figure into your thinking too, as in your case I know it does.
I'm on a fairly tight budget so I start with the most expensive option and whittle my way downwards until I settle on one which I'm unwilling to go lower than. This involves a lot of research about the cheaper products (i.e. the ones I'll actually be buying) and can totally change the goals. For example, I was in the market for an integrated push-pull tube amplifier and ended up with a Bottlehead preamp and a single-ended amplifier. I actually ended up overhauling my whole system and also replaced my phono preamp and head amp with tube gear because I had the vacuum tube fever. I think that happens to a lot of people, heh.Anyway, in that case I ended up spending a lot more in the end, but consider this: I was looking at a Jolida integrated (around $800) and ended up with a $350 amplifier and a $300 preamp. Still saved $150 from my initial goal, and I got something I'm happier with because it's really my own plan.
So going down the ladder can be a fun adventure and is very rewarding for me... instead of going up until you find the lowermost unit you're willing to accept, why not go down until you find the uppermost? I also always give myself a 72 hours' waiting period before deciding to buy something. I change my mind so much that if I'm settled on one thing for that long, I know that I'm committed to it and won't have buyer's remorse or am making an impulsive mistake. And it works, for me at least.
Only flaw with 'going downward' is that you will generally find you become accustomed to a level of refinement in the better gear that you wouldn't have 'needed' had you never heard it! A bargain CDP may be very good and sound fine until you hear something that solves its problems, of which you were unaware. Coming down to it, you will hear the unsolved problems....
I think that it's good to know what could be possible.
Of course sometimes I regret it but knowing is better than not knowing, imho. ( this put an item in question into the right perspective and comes in handy to deteremine the VFM )
It's takes strong character is all I'm saying. When I hear something truly better, I am greatly drawn to finding ways to get it. My character, you see, is not so strong as yours may be. I don't drink $100 wine and drive $75K (and up) cars. But I do look at Manets and cathedrals! It is my professional obligation to have informed opinions of Audio Note Dac 5's and Kageki amps, so I deal with that. But I am deathly afraid of hearing an Ongaku, which, I'm told, is an appropriate attitude. Maybe that will be my Personal Test one of these days.
*But I am deathly afraid of hearing an Ongaku, *
The old saying is that 'you can take it with you' or 'you only live once' or something along those lines. :)
It also helps you know and evaluate your own equipment better. By hearing other (sometimes better) components, you get to know your own components strentghts, weaknesses and limitations that you may not have been aware of if you had not heard the better models. This also gives you the advantage to decide what less expensive tweaks might improve the component, from deciding what isolation for the component might work best to cheap or DIY room treatments. And, as an added bonus, you can intelligently discuss/recommend your component to others on forums like this as you will know the components attributes and shortcomings which may help someone pick one over the other when it comes to their own choices.
nt
I actually got to compare my Mapletree with a Hovland preamp that cost somewhere around 5-8 times as much. It wasn't in my house or with my system so there's a serious limit with my evaluation. Nonetheless, the Mapletree held its own fairly well. And, this was before I upgraded the umbilical cord which has made a nice improvement. The Mapletree presented much better bass than the Hovland. But, my friend who owns the Hovland says that the bass is the Hovland's Achilles Heal. The midrange and the highs in particular were not as smooth on the Mapletree as they were on the Hovland. Musical is such a subjective criteria so take the following with whatever grain you choose, but I found the Hovland to be the more musical of the two; the Hovland really engaged me. My friend who was thinking of parting with the Hovland like the Mapletree better on the first listen, but started re-evaluating that opinion on the second listen, though some tube rolling on the Mapletree brought him back to that end slightly. He never did sell the Hovland so I guess that says something. Nonetheless, it was a very interesting experience. I still really love my little Mapletree Ultra preamp, but maybe you knew that already (and I've beaten my endorsement of it through the forums to death).
Thanks for the comparison. Mapletree products are real value products. The secret is in the simplicity and execution of the circuits and a very short signal path + great parts. His stuff is elegant in its traditional simplicity and his good judgement. I don't know a better semi-DIY line out there, including Bottlehead, which is terribly over-rated.
Probably saves you from otherwise regrettable purchases 70% of the time.
I have a bit of fun by trying it on my least expensive system and then working upwards towards my best equipment.What seems pretty darn good on cheaper equipment which I think I may be satisfied with generally gets totally trounced as I work my way up.
There may be a diminishing return for cost (ie. something may not sound twice as good for double the price) and it would be up to an individual to try to get the best bang for their buck.I don't think it really matters which way one chooses to try the different equipment so long as they do so and not just settle for the one piece they have auditioned. Unfortunately, most hi-fi dealers in my area only carry so much. I'll never get the opportunity to audition what is most recommended in a specific price range for a piece of equipment.
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