|
Audio Asylum Thread Printer Get a view of an entire thread on one page |
For Sale Ads |
63.253.136.154
I just bought my first DVD-A disc (the Beatles “Love” DVD and CD double set) and have a question.When I play the DVD-A in my Sony SACD player, I see three audio choice on the main menu: (1) PCM (2) Dolby Digital 5.1 Surround (3) DTS.
When I play the disc on my DVD-A player I don’t see any audio choices at all on the menu. This player also has a Dolby Digital and DTS decoder on board and of course can play regular CDs in PCM.
The sound of “Love” through the DVD-A player is pretty nice – although I’m not sure if it’s better than the Dolby Digital and DTS versions (because I’m using two different players) but it’s definitely better than the CD.
I would appreciate any insights into the menu mystery.
Follow Ups:
Interestingly enough, this disc is actually out of spec.
You're seeing the Video_TS, and the 3 streams are all on one file and can be accessed by hitting the AUDIO button.
Whilst this is fine for DVD-Video, it's illegal & OOS for DVD-Audio.
The specs state quite clearly that any VTS titles included in a DVD-Audio disc should have a limit of 2 streams, not 3.Appalling for a major release like this, and it should not be carrying the DVD-Audio logo.
Why is there such an artificial limit? If 3 streams can be squeezed in to the VTS, then why not?
In DVD-Video, you can have up to 8 Audio streams per VTS.
BUT - and this is the big one, the specifications for VTS in DVD-Audio are different.
A VTS for DVD-A can only have 2 Audio streams.
This is primarily because of a section of the specs that has been ignored by a lot of labels stating "All VTS Shall be pointed from the AMG (Audio ManaGer) of the ATS".
As this requires a "set system - Branch" command in authoring (When we link to a DD 5.1 or a DTS 5.1 stream in DVD-A we are actually jumping into the Video_TS from the Audio_TS) and as there can only be 2 Audio streams present in a single title in the Audio_TS, there are only 2 options for Set System. Audio=0 and Audio=1 (where Audio=0 is telling the player to access Stream #1 in the pointed VTS).
As most authors do not actually point or link to the VTS, this often gets overlooked. The correct way to do this where 3 (or more) streams are required in the VTS is to "Double-Author" and use 2 VTS, with 2 streams on each.
THe reasoning behind this is to give the end user more choice.
With linking done properly, if the content of a disc has
Advanced Resolution 5.1 (24/96 or 24/48)
Advanced Resolution 2.0
LPCM 2.0 (16/48 usually, sometimes 24/48)
DD 2.0
DD 5.1
DTS 5.1
Then it should be possible to access all 6 of these streams from the AMG. If you cannot do this, the disc is not correctly authored.
Is it the DVD-A authoring programs that create these out of spec discs or is it the authors?
Chances are high it's the authors. Most serious authors only use the Sonic DVD-Audio Creator, as nothing else actually gives you full access to the DVD-A specs.
It's a strange one and been the subject of often heated debates, because whilst most - and I stress most - players will easily handle these "out of spec" discs, it's not [i]technically[/i] DVD-Audio.
In the Beatles disc, you cannot access any of the lossy streams at all, so this is technically out of spec, although unlinked universals (or hybrids) are indeed common. It's all a matter of interpretation, and the spec states all VTS shall be linked.
My understanding (and many others) of the word "Shall" is that it must happen, has to be done, is not optional. Others disagree.
Nearly all the Warner titles are technically "off-spec".
Where it matters is at replication, and certain replication facilities will refuse to print a disc that fails verification for spec compliance. Here in the UK we have an insane situation - The company who used to be called Deluxe Media are one of only a couple who can replicate DVD-A, and they were bought out by Sony Media, who are now insisting on strict spec compliance.
Yet there are other replicators who will do the job & not be so fussy about things. What to do? It's probably better to stick with the specs, no matter how silly we feel the restrictions may be, because there are bound to be players out there that only conform to strict specs, and will therefore refuse to play certain discs at all. Hell, we know the Pioneer 563/565 has problems with discs that are to spec, never mind those that are not.
Thanks. Unlike CD-Audio which uses a different structure compared to the CD-ROM, AFAIK DVD-Audio is just a DVD-ROM meeting a certain spec. So why can't a DVD-A be replicated by anybody?
Your SACD player is most likely a DVD-Video player only so it defaults to the Dolby Digital and DTS menu. Your DVD-Audio player is probably set to default to Audio which in that case on this particular disc there is no option but DVD-Audio Surround so that is what it plays. If for a particular reason you would want to listen to the Dolby Digital or DTS tracks go to the menu set up and select video.However, Dolby Digital and DTS on most discs are of a much lower quality (using a sampling rate less than typical CDs) I don't know why you would want to listen to them. I say "on most discss" because there are 24 bit 96 kHz DTS Audio tracks that can pass on a digital connection if your player and receiver/processor can handle that signal which most new units can but older units (4+ years maybe) cannot.
DVD-Audio and SACD are only passable through analog connections. There are a couple of receiver/universal player combinations from Pioneer and Denon (and possibly others) that have a proprietary digital connection (Denon D-Link) that allow hi rez audio transfer.
The only Hi Rez audio I have heard of via HDMI is for the newer HD-DVD or BluRay for Dolby Plus and DTS new high rez version but so far that is the audio for movie soundtracks and very few at that.
Your DVD-A player is set-up to default to DVD-A. You can go into the set-up menu of it and have it default to DVD-V and then you will see the set-up choices (of DD, etc.) for a DVD-V player
Thanks, one more question. Can I output the DVD-A signal via the digital output to an external Dac? Or do must I listen only to the player's analog outputs?
Analog only is the rule. There is an HDMI version that will pass it digitally, but I'm pretty sure that the other end must be analog out as well.If these formats are almost dead, why won't they just open it up to the hobbyists/audiophiles that still care?
| ||||||||||||
|
This post is made possible by the generous support of people like you and our sponsors: