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These days most of the better CD players I hear seem to roll off the treble a bit and I find myself longing for louder and more forward reproduction of cymbals and other hf.Can anyone reccomend a CDP under 2k US that they know to be bright and clear in this area?
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I thought the same when I was cdp-ing a couple of years ago. Cd’s have a digital edgyness to them that most want no part of, but found many cd players seemed to be over compensating with a soft, rolled off, too forgiving top end. Like you, use a cymbal as hf test and want the “bite” of the real thing. I’m not familiar with the newer models, but check out the SimAudio and Naim brand.
Believe what your ears say - not hearsay.
Any experience with the Equinox? Listened to it at a local audio dealer a few times but that wasn't with the equipment I have.Is it good in its price range or can I do better for less? TIA!
Yes, I had a chance to spend some time with the the equinox a couple of years ago. In the same system, thought the equinox :
· equaled the much more expensive universal player (orbitor?) on redbook
· was cleaner and more articulate, but not as warm as Rega Jupiter 2000
· didn’t have the liveliness and detail of the Nova or Eclipse
· was good, but thought it as well as others in the ~2k range were sortof in no man’s land.At the time, the units in the 3k price tier were the sweet spot…better than the lesser priced units and a stones throw away from the SOTA units I heard. The offering in the 2k range simply didn’t do what the 3k stuff did and not much more than the sub 1k stuff. These days cd players are much like computers with each generation getting cheaper, better, but less durable. My guess is the sweetspot is less and perhaps some of the newer units would be worth exploring before deciding.
RF noise adds spurious overtones that make the treble seem more forward and "clear." However, careful comparison with reduced RF noise reveals that cymbals, especially, are less precise even they sound more up-front.A good test piece for this is track 11, "If you go," on Shirley Horn's album _You Won't Forget Me_, Verve 847 482-2. The piece opens with complex cymbal work on two different cymbals, and has some featured cymbal accents. Even a little RF noise causes the cymbal sound to get mushy and imprecise.
The CD player or computer source is a source of RF noise as well as one of the primary targets for it. Treating the AC supply to reduce noise going both ways is important. A CD player that is less susceptible to RF noise (perhaps through better power supply and chassis design) may sound dull in comparison to one that is more susceptible upon immediate listening. It takes careful analytical listening to discern whether the test unit reveals more or less honest detail in things like closely-mic'd cymbals.
Exactly what I was thinking Al. I had a similar experience with a guy that was using plasma ion supertweeters with his Klipsch La Scallas. When I first heard them it was almost too bright to stand it. We then plugged these tweeters into a PS Audio Powerplant, which effectively isolated them from the rest of the system and all the brightness went away like fog burned away by the sun! It seemed to me that these tweeters (which operate at high voltage and high frequency to make the plasma) were polluting the power for the rest of the system.
-Winamp with Otachan ASIO output plugin.
-Console by Audio Teknika as VST host for Thuneau Allocator/Arbitrator (crossover/EQ/phase correction)
-$125 Creative X-Fi Xtreme music sound card in ASIO mode.
-6 channel output for stereo low/mid/hi tri-ampingDrivers are time aligned to within about 10 microseconds. No typo. Micro.
I have a $2000 CDP with Burr Brown DACs that almost sounds as good. ;)
Once I upgrade to a Lynx 2B or AES16/Aurora8 combo, I figure there is no turning back.
Same here.I love the treble on my PC based system.
It is really detailed, but not annoying or harsh. It is hard to describe.
"Seductive". The high end is seductive. ;)How's that for a subjective buzzword in the making? ;^D
I think PC people should try PC Audio. PC Audio is about tweaking, DIY, experimenting, and just plain fun. If you like that kind of thing, by all means do it. If one hates computers, they should stick to CDP's and Universal players. I don't think it's really wise to "prescribe" PC Audio to those who are not interested in it. It's the interest (and passion) about it that makes for good results. And I guess the same can be said with top notch CDP's.
In my case, every track I've listened to in the last 18 months has been from a hard-drive and through a PC Sound card. I try CDP's and DVD players once in a while, but I start missing the high end sizzzle and shimmer of the PC system really quick.
And you're right Dawnrazor. It's NOT fatiguing. I find CD's extracted metculously and played through a good PC system to take on a sort of SACD quality - in both the imaging and SQ departments.
I know I'm hooked.
Presto,I agree, and you are right about the non PC people for what you and I do.
BUT, there are more and more companies that are making non DIY solutions.
VRS Audio Systems comes to mind, and there is Zero One audio (pc based, but any audiophile can grasp it), or even Cambridge has a dedicated piece.
Then there is the Olive stuff. This market is growing, and one day almost all "CDPs" will be custom built PCs.
So there, I highly recommend to everyone looking into these solutions! :)
This is based on sound quality alone, and if you factor in convenience, you can't beat the PC route IMHO. But you KNOW that already...
connected to a decent quality Pre Amp, Amp and Good quality speakers above all. Frankly those are more important than the CD player.
Well, I'll suggest two. I've been A-B comparing a Super Tjoeb with Upsampler against a custom NOS TDA1541 Dac. The Tjoeb has a sweet treble that extends quite a bit more, and I have been paying particular attention to cymbal crash/decay and percussion brushwork. Cymbals and treble in general are more prominent with the Tjoeb, and the soundstage is more focused. But the Tjoeb is significantly under your $2K limit. Another suggestion is the Tent Labs CDP (some basic DIY req'd). I think this CDP will be extremely hard to beat under $2k. A CDP comes down to power supply, jitter-minimization, analog stage, IV conversion and DAC...and Guido has zero'd in on all these areas. I imagine the noise floor in his CDP is incredible. Unfortunately, this rec can only be based on what I know of his design. I have one other suggestion going down a different path. Augment your current speaker with a ribbon supertweeter. I had no idea what I was missing until I brought home a speaker with a ribbon tweeter.
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