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Well I am down to making a final decision . on a Cary 308 or 308T. I have both a good tube amp and pre-amp in my system so do I really need the tube version cd player? There is about 1K difference in price. Will I get that much more in the tube version with my tube system? Unfortunately my local dealers do not have these available in there shops for listening.
Appreciate any advice.
Follow Ups:
I can only apply my recent experiences with the 303/300 and those experiences would tell me to recommend the tube stage machine.The SS side of the 303/300 is merely adequate. With the stock tubes the tube side of the 303/300 is merely adequate as well.
With the right tubes and interconnects the 303/300 becomes a very special machine. I upgraded to some NOS Mullard cv4003 and the improvement was magical. Much better soundstage, tonality and dynamics. I haven't solved the interconnect problem yet but I am feeling something very revealing (Nordost) may be the answer.
The Nordost interconnects will not help you with this player. From a technical perspective, you obviously can't reveal what is not present in the signal to begin with.
I have Truth Links on the player now, and they are not the right cables. One of the things the tubes give you is dynamics, and I am thinking that a cable that will preserve that is the way to go.I do feel this player is more detailed than the Sony XA-777ES I have to compare it to...But it's been a lot of trouble to get it there. I was doing some listening last night after my most recent upgrades and it was impressive. Once I get it settled in I will try to do a review and detail my difficult relationship with this player.
The 308T was one of my all time favorites. I've had the 306/200, 308, 308T, and 303/300 in my setup. The 303/300 is incredible but for the price I think the 308T is the sleeper. Nothing very special about the 'regular' 308 IMHO but the 308T will bring tears of joy.
sounds like a good recommendation.
Someone will slam me for saying so but I think the tube output from the 303/300 (their latest $4K player) is not much better than the 308T. Enjoy.
AbeCollins
My deep admiration for your courage in giving honest, founded and unambiguous advice. I have followed all your views on the Cary subject. Based on my own limited experience I could attest to the validity of your opinion, as an experienced Cary CDP user/owner . Although I do not have direct 308 experiences, my other experiences in the 303 vs 306 discussion clearly tells me that the tube output for 303/300 is not as impressive as others might claim. I heard the arguments about the need for tube change. If this is so, I am sure the 308T could also benefit from tube change and so one could never make any conclusion on which one is a better buy (I tried to avoid to say a better machine, better buy takes into account of price/performance and other constraints). In making buying decisions, one must base on firm views under given circumstances, and not based on hopes that an inferior choice would be overturned by tweaking.Not everyone would agree with your opinion or my opinion. It is important to share the opinion and let the recipient make up his/her own mind, by adding or subtracting his/her own biases and preferences. I found it amazing that many inmates prefer to criticise other peoples' opinions while they are afraid to tell their own.
Good luck!
Thanks for your comments. I have tried various NOS tubes with the 303/300 as well as the 308T. The 308T is a stellar performer in my opinion and a very good value within the Cary line.
I had the 308-T for several years. It was sold when I got the new 303-300. To me, the 303-300 is in a different league. The 303-300 is more musical and has more of the analog-like sound (to my ears, in my system).I do agree that for the money, the 308-T is the sleeper. I also agree that you are hearing what you are hearing.
My guess is that the jitter reduction in the 303-300 is the key element of the difference in the sound. It gets the swell and blending of orchestral music closer to analog or real music. The 308-T just did not have this quality. The 303-300 also has a more palpable image, much more substance, especially on solo vocal and choral music.
My amps are monoblock tube, that may make a difference. Also, I connect the CD player directly to the amps, no preamp in the chain. That could be another key reason why they sound different to me (a preamp could homogenize the sound of the 2 players with its own signature).
Anyway, to each their own.
Enjoy the music.
My intention is not to slam the 303/300 but I sincerely feel that the 308T is so close in performance that it makes the 303/300 seem rather expensive. They are both outstanding cd players.For what it's worth, I observed that the 308T tube stages take their signal directly off the DACs while the 303/300 appears to have a couple burr-brown op-amps inline with the signal path to the tube stages.
The 308T uses the tubes for both voltage gain and output stage. And as you noted, no op-amps used in the tube signal path. The 303/300 only uses the tube as an output buffer stage coupled to an op-amp gain stage. I'd like to know how the 308T compares to the old 301, that also used the tubes for gain.
You're probably right about the 303/300 using the tubes primarily (if not entirely) as buffers. I didn't trace the circuit path but I distinctly see a couple burr-brown op-amps and a handful of transistors just prior to the tubes. See: http://mycollins.net/audio/Cary303-300/Cary-08.htmlIn the 308T I seem to recall seeing a couple tube pins hand wired directly to the DAC module - no transistors or op-amps anywhere in sight possibly providing a more 'pure' signal to and out of the tubes. That 8-pin DIP IC that appears toward the bottom right of the tube board is actually a LM555 timer chip which sets a turn-on delay for the tube output coupled through the small switching transistor adjacent to the relay. These have nothing to do with the audio path. See: http://mycollins.net/audio/308Tubes.jpg
Call me nuts but I stand by my 'audio memory' and recall being very excited with the performance of the 308T and how well it responded to some NOS tubes I tried. In particular, I really liked the Amperex Bugle Boys with the 308T.
I am not familiar with the older Cary 301.
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