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In Reply to: Cables aren't components... posted by mkuller on February 21, 2007 at 12:24:53:
Cables *are* components, in my not-so-humble view....especially when many hand-fabricated designs can cost thousands of dollars and affect system performance so greatly.
Follow Ups:
...power conditioners, power cords, room treatments, etc. which can all be very expensive?
no matter what the value.
You cannot steal abandoned property. The orignal quoted paragraph from a Fermer reveiw is the discription of abandoned property. It cannot be "stolen". When a manufacturer sends cables for whatever reason and fails to take them back, at some point they become abandoned and are the no longer the manufacturer's property. Legally, abandoned property can be sold.
I think you should return what is not yours without being asked to.
Not doing so is stealing.
Being a gear-head I always had a lot of tools, many of them Special Service Tools purchased from car manufacturers at great expense. My "friends" would borrow my tools and then never return them. It pissed me off that I had to "hunt" for them weeks later.
Had I not gone to retrieve them, would the tools then have become the property of my friends?
Maybe the point is moot because half of the time I did not get them back because they had become "lost".
After a few years of that I no longer lent out tools. Then I became the bad guy.
I think you should return what is not yours without being asked to.And usually, that is done. But what if the manufacturer says...."that's o.k....hang on to them." There are a myriad number of reasons a manufacturer will do this, and you will require mind-reading capabilities to discern those reasons. Anything other than that, you are speculating, and reaching, as are some of the other posters.
Not doing so is stealing.
Absolutely not. What are you all of a sudden....the morality police? Again, you do NOT know all the circumstances, and you were NOT party to the transactions, be they reviews or long-term loans. There is no question that these affairs should have open disclosure (such as listing gear or cabling as long-term loans), but for you and anyone else to presume a lack of ethics and/or condemn others' actions without knowing all the details is equally irresponsible.
when a loaned out cable does not "come back" on time.
Go ahead and tell me....you have demonstrated a poor ability to read minds, but try anyway.
Don't forget, reviewers get sent many cables and don't want the out of pocket expense of shipping to return the cables. According to JA, manufacturers pay for the shipping both ways. Why should reviewers get stuck with the expense. If it isn't worth the money or cable companies to pay return shipping why should it be worth it to the reviewer.Maybe, cable companies should clearly state that the cables will be property of the magazine after they are reviewed.
In my experience, many reviews are arranged directly between the reviewer and the manufacturer/distributor, with approval of the magazine editor, of course. And usually (again in my experience) the reviewer gets reimbursed by the manufacturer/distributor for any shipping costs post-review.
Power cords are cables, so they are components, as well as power conditioners. Both directly interact with the power supplies of active gear.I would consider room treatments ancillary to the system, but wholly part of the room acoustic.
I am going to disagree with you on this one. The audio field needs two different terms to describe on the one hand devices which directly, positively, effect the music signal and on the other, those which can only have a negative effect.Traditionally, devices positively effecting the music signal have been considered a "component." Accessories being all else. Power cords, cables and rooms can only have a negative effect on the signal. Improvement only comes from reducing the deleterious effects of the wire, the room.
Insisting that accessories be called components is unnecessary. Unnecessary unless you are an accessory manufacturer seeking to elevate the importance of your product. They have been mighty successful in that regard. They seem to have convinced you ;)
First, in the case of AC cords, the "signal" properly speaking does not pass through them.Second, this easy rebuttal: Some (many?) cables reduce/remove RFI/EMI -- which would have a *salubrious* effect on "the signal".
Third, if you really want to discuss negative effects, look to the designs that virtually require such ameliorations in order to sound good.
First, a cable is not a power cord, but that is so obvious . . ..Second. Cables add RFI/EMI, that is not beneficial. And sheilding adds an additional set of problems to go along with skin effects and dielectics.
Third, ?.
... shouldn't they be considered components? I'm only half kidding.
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