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Propeller Head Plaza Technical and scientific discussion of amps, cables and other topics. |
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Propeller Head Plaza Technical and scientific discussion of amps, cables and other topics. |
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In Reply to: "if you manufacture audio equipment you HAVE to investigate" posted by BS64 on April 8, 2007 at 12:35:47:
What I read in your reply is the words and attitudes of a "pre-Belter". Because once you latch on to the products/ideas, all of that changes. Of course there are many "tweak" products available, and many things someone could slap on a cd/cable, or under a component, and -of course- whether it makes a difference is up to the listener. But the yardstick you're using is a wildly varying one. The accessory products vary in their strengths, and just slapping any product or item you have around the house on a cd/lp/cable is unlikely to produce good results. It's not that easy to find ideas that work.How is a manufacturer supposed to design around an infinite number of possible tweaks or combinations thereof? Very simple. They DON'T. I don't know what your experience with the manufacturing trade is, but they don't take every possible combination or effect that could change the sound. And that's presuming they know what they all are, which no manufacturer does. The correct answer to your (rhetorical) question is that manufacturers -focus- on whatever aspect of sound reproduction interests them. One might argue there's a near infinite number of possibilities for cable geometry/design, amplifier design, cd player design, etc. And every little part that a manufacturer uses in an electronic component may have many alternates. You're not expected to try them all, you're only expected to produce something that sounds good to you.
One might also argue -against- your statement that "it only makes sense that gear be designed using above average ic's and stranded cables". Many claim that science is on their side when they say "above average ic's and stranded cables are a myth", RIC is all that matters. So you should recognize that what make sense to -you-, only makes sense to -you-. Which is why I agree again that we should let the end-user decide which aftermarket ic's, cables and tweaks provide the presentation they are after. Where the problem lies, is where many won't ever try products that challenge their orthodox views, and for which they can't or won't understand how they work. So they cut themselves off to a great deal of products that may provide the presentation they are after.
"If you believe that arbitrary, inanimate objects in the room might be affecting the sound you are hearing, you will never know where to begin or when to stop. "
It's not a "belief". Arbitrary inanimate objects actually do affect the sound you are hearing. "Knowing where to begin" is easy. Knowing when to stop is no different than with conventional audio products. If you start building an audio system when you're 12, does that mean you're addicted to improving your audio for life? For some it is, and they don't mind that at all, since they have perpetually better sound and better enjoyment from that. And for them, the great thing about audio is, you can always improve your sound. For others they say "this is the end of the line for me". This doesn't change because of the audio products you choose to buy, you know.
>>Yes, some gear is "voiced" using wires, amps or speakers from a particular high-end manufacturer. But buying a combo of such products is not a guarantee that the presentation will be to the end-user's liking. That's why there are so many different design philosophies from the manufacturers. <<
I agree. However, I must say for some 20+ years there's been an exception to that rule, which is that buying any combo of products from PWB -is- a guarantee the presentation will be to the end-user's liking (if previous products have been). That's because they are unique, being the only line of audio related products that don't really rely on a "design philosophy" from the manufacturer. I've never tried a product of theirs that wasn't to my liking, and I've never heard another customer say anything like "I didn't like the sound of this one. It didn't synergize with my cd player". Primarily because conventional products change -components- of the sound. So what they change shouldn't exaggerate the sound you already have, otherwise you'll have a conflict, which is called "bad synergy". The PWB products, while they each have their own qualities, change the sound in a -global sense-.
>>IMO, one must start the process of building a system with the stuff that is IN the signal path. Not near it.<<
That's obviously an opinion only based on your experiences with the stuff that is IN the signal path. So it can only and will always be a one-sided opinion, that does not see all of what is true, or all of what is possible. The biggest influence on your sound is what is outside of the signal path (ie. your mind), not in it. I do agree however, that one must start the process by focusing on what is in the signal path. Even these esoteric audio products do require a working hifi system!
But your view is that once you've got a working hifi system, you should just "set it up properly, then sit back and listen". That won't resolve the problems you're not aware of, that create a barrier to what you can acheive with that working hifi system. That may be okay for someone who just wants a radio in their bathroom that's "showerproof". It is not the basis for an audiophile system. If you are a music lover who wants the best sound at the best value, then you do need to "sweat the small stuff"; the stuff so "small" you don't see it or think about it. But its not difficult to do, and you don't have to be obsessive about it. So no, I don't think you need to "worry about the bottle of air freshener sitting on the shelf in the same room" as you say, that's just plain silly. Unless of course it has a barcode on the bottle.
Objective Audiophile 2007
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Follow Ups
- Re: "if you manufacture audio equipment you HAVE to investigate" - Posy Rorer 17:53:33 04/15/07 (1)
- "Unless of course it has a barcode on the bottle" - BS64 10:56:14 04/16/07 (0)
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