Propeller Head Plaza Technical and scientific discussion of amps, cables and other topics.

---

[ Follow Ups ] Thread: [ Display  All  Email ] [ Propeller Head Plaza ]

---

[ Alert Moderator ]

---

Same O, Same O --- But at least you have something to say

Posted by jj on April 20, 2003 at 23:31:02

In Reply to: DBT, Part 2 posted by Jon Risch on April 20, 2003 at 20:02:20:

Jon, did you ever hear of controls? Come on, you can tell if a subject isn't paying attention, isn't sensitive, etc. That's what controls do.

As to stress, etc, well, run the test right and you won't have any more stress than you would otherwise.

Your point about training in situ is almost understated. Any subject must be intimately familiar with the test setup.

Now, the point that "this is hard to do" is quite true.

On the other hand, nearly every "mistake" I've seen in a test (that was done fairly cleanly) resulted in false positives. Negative tests, despite all the rancor here, are (*&(* hard to come by.

Btw, .1dB isn't a really good choice of numbers. The detection ability of the ear depends on a bunch of things, including the type of stimulus, etc. There is no one rule.

Now, as to the "analytic" stuff. NOBODY HAS ONCE SHOWN EVEN A TRIVIAL BIT OF EVIDENCE THAT THIS ALLEGED PROBLEM IS A PROBLEM. People can, and do, hear down to basic mathematical and physical limits in DBT's. People also hear to the same limits in various kinds of DBT's, cognate SBT's, and things like signal-detection tests, of course learning and getting down to thresholds at different levels and rates.

Enough different test methods have been used that one would SEE some effects here, I think, if there were any worth worrying about.

Oh, and shall we both see what Jitter-by-coffee has to say? After all, he's made a whole set of extraordinary claims, alledging that he can use untrained subjects, and many at a time, but we have not ONE actual detailed result from him.
-- Do not seek the treasure! DO NOT SEEK THE TREASURE!

This post is made possible by the generous support of people like you and our sponsors:

Atma-Sphere Music Systems, Inc.

---

[ Top of Page ] [ Contact Us ] [ Support/Wish List ] [ Copyright © 2025, Audio Asylum, all rights reserved ]

---

[ General ] [ Speakers ] [ Tubes ] [ Vinyl ] [ Digital ] [ Hi-Rez ] [ Video Asylum ] [ Cables ] [ Tweaks/DIY ] [ Music ] [ Films ]

---