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SET Amp Sweet Spot

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Posted on May 3, 2023 at 04:46:58
dsockel
Audiophile

Posts: 147
Location: SE
Joined: April 1, 2004
 My Cary 300B SEI amp is in the shop so I picked up a little Decware integrated. The Cary puts out 15 watts and the Decware SE34I.3 puts out 6 watts. My speakers are 97db efficiency Audio Note speakers.

I pretty much have to run the Decware at 90% of the max volume to get the same volume as 30% on the Cary which is perfectly understandable.

Question: The Decware sounds pretty damn good and warms up much quicker than the Cary. Does running the Decware at nearly full volume hit its sweet spot where for the Cary, my room is too small to find its sweet spot?

(Please no flaming about why the Cary sucks, etc.)

 

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You might be conflating "volume" with output power and sensitivity, posted on May 3, 2023 at 09:01:11
Chip647
Audiophile

Posts: 2695
Location: The South
Joined: December 24, 2012
 Amps will have different sensitivity levels. Meaning one amp may go to full output with 0.1 v input while another may need 2.0 v to reach the same power output level. If by volume you are meaning the position of the volume control potentiometer on the preamp or amp, that is just an indication of the sensitivity of the amp.

To know if you are running the Decware at 90% you have to measure the output power. If you are hitting over 100db on the peaks you are likely using most of the power of that amp, (you are also damaging your hearing!)

In short, if it sounds good, it is good. You would hear distortion on the peaks or crappy bass if your were driving the amp too hard. By the way SET amps are class A and run at 100% all the time for plate dissipation, so in that case, both are running 100% all the time. Your concern is for sound quality an distortion.

 

RE: SET Amp Sweet Spot, posted on May 3, 2023 at 16:12:00
Triode_Kingdom
Audiophile

Posts: 10181
Location: Central Texas
Joined: September 24, 2006
 There's no sweet spot in a Class A SET in terms of signal amplitude. Distortion simply increases as the volume is turned up.

 

RE: SET Amp Sweet Spot, posted on May 3, 2023 at 23:07:53
Paul Joppa
Industry Professional

Posts: 7319
Location: Seattle, WA
Joined: April 23, 2001
 I've been exploring in the last several years the thought that there is indeed a sweet spot in the distortion signature; that is, a little bit of second harmonic improves the listening experience but too much covers up the details.

Whether it's masking of some distortion products, or emulation of the natural acoustic nonlinearities in the ear canal, or something completely different, ... or just another mass hallucination ... remains to be determined.

If true, the effect seems to be highly sensitive to the specific source music - spectrally dense material such as symphonic music wants much less than small-scale chamber music for example. It seems to be highly sensitive to the particular listener as well.

Or maybe it's all bogus after all.

 

RE: SET Amp Sweet Spot, posted on May 5, 2023 at 10:58:36
Triode_Kingdom
Audiophile

Posts: 10181
Location: Central Texas
Joined: September 24, 2006
 It seems to me that defining the audible effect of distortion in each particular case is a tough call. So, I prefer to push it down to levels that I hope won't be audible and go with that. One can always add even-order distortion in other ways if that's deemed desirable for some reason. I just don't want to be stuck with it for every tune. :)


 

RE: SET Amp Sweet Spot, posted on May 10, 2023 at 16:22:35
Ian L
Audiophile

Posts: 1373
Joined: July 5, 2002
 Your post made me think of a couple of things.

I remember hearing years ago an EE opine that tube amplifiers tended to sound their best running at about 70% of their power rating.

Chris Merren's mention in the linked thread of the C-core (relative to EI in the same context) sounding "thinner" could be relevant to this conversation as well.

 

RE: SET Amp Sweet Spot, posted on July 21, 2023 at 14:25:51
Retsel
Audiophile

Posts: 1240
Joined: April 17, 2000
 Hey Paul, any idea if you are feeding the 300B into a higher impedance load (I am running my 15 ohm Lowthers with permalloy parafeed transformers operating on the 8 ohm tap) if that affects the amount of odd vs even order distortion, or does all the distortion decrease the same due to the higher load?

Retsel

 

RE: SET Amp Sweet Spot, posted on July 23, 2023 at 02:05:01
sony6060
Audiophile

Posts: 1465
Location: USA
Joined: August 8, 2014
 The sound of an amp is greatly based upon the preamp/driver tubes and coupling capacitors. The Decware likely has superior components.

 

RE: SET Amp Sweet Spot, posted on August 11, 2023 at 14:38:23
sony6060
Audiophile

Posts: 1465
Location: USA
Joined: August 8, 2014
 This post has been sitting in SET for over two months with nothing new!

 

SET'ers...we are a splinter group... in a splinter corner.... , posted on August 16, 2023 at 19:19:14
The Killer Piglet
Audiophile

Posts: 4780
Location: FL
Joined: January 2, 2002
 of a splinter hobby with a receding fanbase.

KP

 

RE: SET'ers...we are a splinter group... in a splinter corner.... , posted on August 17, 2023 at 05:44:51
RPMac
Audiophile

Posts: 378
Location: So. Mississippi
Joined: January 3, 2005
 The problem with SET's is that they don't play loud enough for most people unless with the right speakers and even then, most want louder.

 

RE: SET Amp Sweet Spot, posted on January 15, 2024 at 07:42:37
morricab
Distributor or Rep

Posts: 9230
Location: switzerland
Joined: April 1, 2005
 According to Cheever, it would also be SPL dependent. So, a higher sensitivity speaker with the distortion in the right pattern at a level that optimizes masking at the right SPL for that speaker/amp combination could provide an optimal experience.

 

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