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TAD 2001 response dip

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Posted on December 10, 2011 at 08:47:25
kwingylee@yahoo.com
Audiophile

Posts: 22
Location: Chicago
Joined: June 11, 2007
 Hi:

I have seen a small number of posts alluding to a response dip of the TAD TD2001 around the 2K region and a 30 ohm series resistor is needed to flatten the response.

Does anyone know where the dip is? As well as the amplitude and Q? I would like to electronically equalize it without adding a resistor into the signal path.

Thanks in advance,

Kwing
Kwing Y Lee

 

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RE: TAD 2001 response dip, posted on December 11, 2011 at 17:00:43
djk
Manufacturer

Posts: 6135
Joined: June 17, 2000
 It's totally horn dependent, the mouth is too small.

 

RE: TAD 2001 response dip, posted on December 11, 2011 at 20:28:44
kwingylee


 
I am using a LeClea'ch horn with a one inch throat - the JMLC350 from autotech. Its in one of JMLC's posts that I ran across the need for a 30 ohm series resistor on the TD2001....

 

"I would like to electronically equalize it without adding a resistor into the signal path", posted on December 11, 2011 at 21:20:16
eso
Manufacturer

Posts: 7842
Location: Long Beach, CA, USA
Joined: March 15, 2001
 So you'd like to add several components, or digitally encode, shape and decode a signal instead of adding a single resistor? OK, but that seems needlessly complicated and likely to do more harm to the signal than the single resistor.

To each his own.


eso
They were a carnival of American decay on parade, and they had no idea of the atrocity they had inflicted upon themselves." Henry Chinaski

 

RE: "I would like to electronically equalize it without adding a resistor into the signal path", posted on December 12, 2011 at 05:03:29
TubeBuilder
 Maybe either the driver or horn has to find a new Friend. There is horns out there that are flat with the tad without eq Yuichi's come to mind. I have some plastic jabo's ready but honestly I don't have much faith in plastic horns. I understand you have built the aria eso so I am sure you would infinitely greater knowledge on the subject. I just think why eq when you can get the right horn driver combo in the first place.

 

RE: TAD 2001 response dip, posted on December 12, 2011 at 06:48:40
claudej1@aol.com
Audiophile

Posts: 817
Location: Detroit
Joined: August 17, 2007
 I am using a LeClea'ch horn with a one inch throat - the JMLC350 from autotech. Its in one of JMLC's posts that I ran across the need for a 30 ohm series resistor on the TD2001....>>


OK, so why the resistance to a simple resistor solution. Just stick one in and see what happens. Why make it more difficult. Just TRY IT!!

 

RE: TAD 2001 response dip, posted on December 12, 2011 at 09:39:04
kwingylee


 
Claude:

I have one attached right now. I like the results.
Its just that, since I am using a active XO with a lot equalization functions, why not just equalize the dip out?

Kwing

 

RE: TAD 2001 response dip, posted on December 12, 2011 at 10:14:48
weltersys
Industry Professional

Posts: 685
Location: FL
Joined: September 28, 2004
"I have one attached right now. I like the results.
Its just that, since I am using a active XO with a lot equalization functions, why not just equalize the dip out? "

Kwing,
No reason not too.
Your horn driver combination will be unique, and may differ by a few dB even between your drivers, so any EQ you apply should be done for your units, not on the basis of some other measurement.

As an added complication, different DSP (digital signal processor) have different "Q", even if your drivers and horns were identical to another set, the correction would need to be defined for a specific DSP.

 

RE: TAD 2001 response dip, posted on December 12, 2011 at 11:07:45
kwingylee


 
Claude:

I have one attached right now. I like the results.
Its just that, since I am using a active XO with a lot equalization functions, why not just equalize the dip out?

Kwing

 

RE: TAD 2001 response dip, posted on December 12, 2011 at 12:08:02
claudej1@aol.com
Audiophile

Posts: 817
Location: Detroit
Joined: August 17, 2007
 Well, ok then, why not. Short out the resistor and try active EQ, which would be my choice anyhow. You didn't say before.

 

RE: TAD 2001 response dip, posted on December 12, 2011 at 18:53:24
kwingylee


 
Well I was able to find the reference from DIYaudio, in a post by Jean M. LeCleac'h himself:

"RE: Hornresp and TD2001 simulation

Posted by Jmmlc (A ) on November 7, 2007 at 08:39:16

In Reply to: RE: Hornresp and TD2001 simulation posted by haukito on November 7, 2007 at 06:22:42:

Hello Haukito,

Yes, on my main sytem I am using TAD TD2001 compression drivers on Marco Henry's J321 horn.

A great improvement, both at mesurement and listening is obtained when using an amplifier with a large output impedance (Zout larger than 36ohms). This fills the famous -3dB dip at 1600-1900Hz of that driver (origin of which is explained in Kinoshita's paper in JAES).

Best regards from Paris,

Jean-Michel Le Cleac'h"

Thanks for all of the advice. This response pretty much explains why its 30 ohm and characteristic of the dip (BW = 300Hz, with a -3dB dip centering around 1730Hz. I will try to do some measurements when I start playing with my active EQ settings (EV Dx-38).

 

If you want to really improve your system loose the EV Dx units., posted on December 12, 2011 at 20:31:43
eso
Manufacturer

Posts: 7842
Location: Long Beach, CA, USA
Joined: March 15, 2001
 Build PLLXOs for your various amp inputs and keep the signal in the analog realm.

eso
They were a carnival of American decay on parade, and they had no idea of the atrocity they had inflicted upon themselves." Henry Chinaski

 

RE: If you want to really improve your system loose the EV Dx units., posted on December 17, 2011 at 07:50:54
kwingylee@yahoo.com
Audiophile

Posts: 22
Location: Chicago
Joined: June 11, 2007
 That is my next step... To make some measurements to confirm the listening tests and then build a passive XO to replace an amp and the DX38.

I do like the fact the digital XOs having the ability to delay the upper frequencies relative to the low end in order to compensate for the arrival time differences.

Any ideas are welcome.
Kwing Y Lee

 

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