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Giving up on SACD

71.105.116.25

Posted on December 22, 2018 at 08:16:24
Minimum SACD player that is any good is $4,000 Marantz. Optimal is an entry level Esoteric for $6,000.

Yeah SACD is probably the best for discs but the cost of something good only to have it fail is not worth the cost of the SACD hobby, so I have gave up.

 

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I got my stock Sony 5400 at half price, over 10 years ago., posted on December 22, 2018 at 08:34:57
oldmkvi
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Still going.
I wouldn't want to replace it tho, too much $, as you say.
Sony HAP Z1 is used way more anyway.

 

RE: I got my stock Sony 5400 at half price, over 10 years ago., posted on December 22, 2018 at 08:44:14
I would re-buy DSD files of the Nine Inch Nails and Dead Can Dance discography in DSD as my DAC can play that from USB, but nope not available.

I have an Onkyo C-S5VL I am using after my $2,000 Yamaha stopped playing SACD but it does not sound anything like the Yamaha when it worked. I took apart the Yamaha and cleaned the laser and it worked only to fail months later again. Delicate SACD technology is not worth it anymore for me. I don't live in Japan either so this is not worth it anymore for me. SACD/DSD is absolutely incredible but I am not about to sell my car just to listen to the 20 or so SACDs that mean something to me unfortunately.

 

Can't you get the yamaha fixed?, posted on December 22, 2018 at 13:53:27
hawkmoon
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Plenty of people who can bring it back to life.

 

RE: Can't you get the yamaha fixed?, posted on December 22, 2018 at 14:52:10
It plays back Redbook fine, I would fix it myself if I knew what to do. When I took it apart it only had one laser so I am not sure where the problem is.

 

RE: Giving up on SACD, posted on December 22, 2018 at 15:05:02
Aaron 01
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I ripped all me SACD's from my Oppo 103, then converted them to hi rez PCM flac. Took a bit, but not too long. They still have that great SACD smooth analog sound, and sooo much easier to play now.

 

Contact Bill Thalman, posted on December 22, 2018 at 15:10:15
hawkmoon
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He can do it-url added. It will be worth it.

 

RE: Contact Bill Thalman, posted on December 22, 2018 at 17:48:37
Thanks for the link, I may do that.

 

RE: Giving up on SACD, posted on December 23, 2018 at 01:08:15
Disbeliever
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Still using my 10 year old Sony XA5400 faultless so far with heavy use. Just as good amazing value Sony BDP, X1000ES ,however TV connection required. I shall not be giving up on SACD.

 

Actually..., posted on December 23, 2018 at 10:08:08
oldmkvi
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I'm thinking of the BDP 1000ES for my Den System.
It would do double-duty as Movie and SACD Player.
I read elsewhere that someone thought out was as good as 5400, which I also have.
But there's a new Pioneer Uni Player just out, twice as much $, bigger chassis.
The Sony is tempting because I think their products are under-priced for what you get.
Once set up w/TV, can you play an SACD without turning on the TV?
My Marantz that died was like that, use as a cd/SACD player, no TV need for that.
What Hi-Fi gave the Sony 1000ES 5*.

 

He is great and not that far from you, IIR., posted on December 23, 2018 at 10:09:38
oldmkvi
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If he can't fix it, it ain't broke!

 

RE: I got my stock Sony 5400 at half price, over 10 years ago., posted on December 23, 2018 at 10:35:12
Alan505
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Do you own any of the MoFi Dead Can Dance SACDs? Talk about spending an arm and a leg on a format! I've managed to pick up The Serpent's Egg and Torward the Within for under $50 each which is quite an accomplishment.

At this point it's a boutique format IMHO. Apparently there is still enough physical format demand to justify new releases and re-issues. Case in point; Pink Floyd's Wish you were here 5.1 SACD will be re-released on 12/26.

 

RE: Actually..., posted on December 23, 2018 at 12:35:37
Disbeliever
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I have not found it possible to play an SACD on the Sony BDP-1000ES without it being connected to my TV.

 

RE: Giving up on SACD, posted on December 23, 2018 at 15:58:37
HighEndWire
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Have you tried turning the player off, putting a hybrid SACD disc before hand and then turning it back on. That has worked with some players and sometimes it may work for a little bit.

 

RE: Giving up on SACD, posted on December 25, 2018 at 17:05:18
TimB5881
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I have had my Sony SCD-CE775 for almost 20 years. It still works good, but SCD-CE595 only plays cd's

 

RE: Giving up on SACD, posted on December 25, 2018 at 17:06:48
bean
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Buy a suitable unit and rip your SACDs, and do the computer audio thing. That's what I did. DSD rips sound great and very good DSD capable DACs are pretty cheap.

I used to be a physical media stalwart, but no more. Good sounding spinners are just stupid $ now.

 

Hear that............, posted on December 26, 2018 at 12:50:55
Sordidman
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When my APL Universal dies, - I am going to get another APL DAC that doesn't convert to Analog, - or, - get a Chord DAC and forget about spinning disks.

I finally got my digital front end to be "very close" to SACD quality, (at least the quality level of my average SACDs), anyway.

Cheers,



"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"

 

RE: Hear that............, posted on December 27, 2018 at 08:26:15
Felixer
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Interestingly, I noticed tonight that over at MDT (a leading UK classical music specialist), on their pre-order chart of all new classical CDs for sale, the top 3 sellers (for pre-orders) are all SACDs. Seems SACD has carved an impressive niche in the classical market. Nor sure what the problem is with your machine ... but I sometimes clean the laser on mine, and that usually helps. I wouldn't bother ripping your SACDs: downloads as a format are pretty much dead, with the market shifting to either physical format for collectors, or streaming for instantaneous (throwaway) consumption.

 

Thanks but....., posted on December 27, 2018 at 09:20:09
Sordidman
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Hi,
Thanks for responding....

I don't have an issue with my player currently....

Of over 30,000 songs, - less that .05% is classical in my realm.

No one is making SACDs of any significance now: and what they are making are very limited production (extremely derivative or re-make) of past work that was on vinyl. The most popular is 70s rock for wealthy 70+ year olds. In general, classical music SACDs, don't go out of print as fast as the more popular runs. That is just fine, - but it doesn't bode well for an industry that has died due to many reasons beyond the lack of acceptance of higher resolution discs. The winning argument has always been, (for the scale to make SACD a viable format, - the general public has no interest).

On one hand it is great that all major record labels would perish from this earth. But, - my point was that the absence of discs, and new FPGA tech can turn EVERYTHING into DSD and the products will have this different process of D/A conversion. The more popular is the PS-Audio DirectStream DAC.


"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"

 

FPGA tech can turn EVERYTHING into DSD, posted on December 27, 2018 at 09:56:52
oldmkvi
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So does HQ and a DSD Dac.
That's what I'm using.
Also Sony HAP Z1 turns even mp3 into good sounding DSD 128.
Very happy with the results.
Just can't afford PS Audio, or new Marantz Disc Players/Dacs.

 

RE: FPGA tech can turn EVERYTHING into DSD, posted on December 27, 2018 at 10:28:04
dbphd
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As I understand it, when you rip an SACD you're actually ripping the CD layer, is that correct? IIRC whenever I've tried to rip a SACD only disc it's rejected. I've resorted to buying the DSD download from Acoustic Sounds for certain discs, e.g., Time Out.

 

NO!, posted on December 27, 2018 at 12:26:17
Sordidman
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Only certain types of FPGA configured DSD devices take lower resolution 16/44 level and CONVERT them to DSD.

Most DSD DACs play redbook level at redbook level and DSD level at DSD level.

IMO, - nothing that says Sony on it performs well: but that's just my opinion...


"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"

 

SACD allong with most hi rez is a fools errend, posted on December 27, 2018 at 12:52:42
lokie
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Boom! There, I said it.

Optimizing low rez will get you sooo much more satisfaction and bang for your buck, than chasing after some ghost of audiophile nirvana. Hi Rez is a waste of money, full of false expectations and is for gear lovers, not music lovers.

 

No!, posted on December 27, 2018 at 13:07:23
Kal Rubinson
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You can rip the CD layer or you can rip the DSD layer. It is just a matter of knowing what you are doing.

 

RE: NO!, posted on December 27, 2018 at 13:09:57
Kal Rubinson
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From Wikipedia: "A field-programmable gate array (FPGA) is an integrated circuit (IC) that can be programmed in the field after manufacture. FPGAs are similar in principle to, but have vastly wider potential application than, programmable read-only memory (PROM) chips."

In other words, an FPGA can be programmed to do any task that the programmer assigns it. Most are not even used for audio. ;-)

 

Opposite for me, posted on December 27, 2018 at 14:27:17
Dave_K
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When SACD and DVD-A came to market, high quality CD playback seemed expensive to chase. Playing some of the good SACDs and DVD-As through mid-priced hi-res players (around $1-2k roughly) gave me sound quality that was at least as good or better than what I was hearing from CDs on significantly more expensive players. That's how I got into hi-res in the first place. I attribute some of the difference to the new formats, and some of it to new masterings that were only available on hi-res.

I don't buy SACDs anymore, but I still buy hi-res downloads. Some are worth the extra cost over the CD, and some aren't. I try to scour the net for opinions before buying, and generally I think I've gotten my money's worth.

 

RE: No!, posted on December 27, 2018 at 18:30:22
dbphd
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Kal, obviously I don't know what I'm doing, but you offered no help. I've been using dBpoweramp.

 

RE: No!, posted on December 27, 2018 at 18:46:24
Kal Rubinson
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dBpowerAmp cannot rip SACDs, only CDs or the CD-layer of SACDs. It cannot even rip DVDs.

To rip SACDs, you must use one of an expanding array of SACD players that can respond to the "sacd_extract" application. It began with using an older PS3 but now includes many more common players. This has been discussed on every audiophile forum and publication that I know of. Google will reveal all.

Linked below is one of my columns which has links to some sources.

 

+1 [nt], posted on December 28, 2018 at 00:05:05
Chris from Lafayette
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RE: No!, posted on December 28, 2018 at 03:45:43
PAR
I would just add ( from experience) that before committing oneself to buying one of the used players for hacking to allow SACD ripping ensure that the software needed is actually available.

Two types of software may be needed, one to allow the installation of the ripping software and the ripping software itself. Although you will find links to these in the online literature about such ripping the links to executable files are now often dead. I suspect that lawyers may have been busy getting some of them taken down.

 

RE: No!, posted on December 28, 2018 at 06:15:28
Kal Rubinson
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The place to check for live links is at ComputerAudiophile where they seem to be constantly updated.

 

I listen to Downloads and CD rips and Internet Radio , no SACD rips., posted on December 28, 2018 at 09:08:49
oldmkvi
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I need something for my SACD Player to do...
Internet radio is quite good through Sony Z1.

 

I'm pretty much with you, posted on December 28, 2018 at 10:51:47
David S.
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Me? For most of my SACD, I use my Sony SCD-777es, which is plugging away just fine.

Otherwise? I honestly do NOT find much difference in transports, and even my XBOX will spin an SACD and give me an output to a decent DAC.

 

RE: No!, posted on December 28, 2018 at 11:14:10
dbphd
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Thanks for the link, Kal, I have an Oppo 105D in one rack and a 205 in another. I use an Ayre C-5xeMP and DX-5 DSD for playing SACDs.

 

you are correct re: FPGA, posted on December 28, 2018 at 14:05:48
Sordidman
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Indeed, - most Field Programmable Gate Array chips are not used for audio.....

These DACs that use FPGA tech are the "process" behind up-converting everything received to DSD..

""FPGA tech""


"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"

 

Hi-res? Sometimes., posted on December 28, 2018 at 14:51:55
PAR
Ordinary redbook can sound fantastic if properly reproduced and if the original recording was good to begin with. Some (certainly not all) hi-res versions sound better. Some sound better period, some sound slightly better but only given direct comparison with the redbook equivalent. Without the comparison and just listening to a sequence of well recorded different albums, in general most listeners would be none the wiser as to which were and which were not hi-res.

Whatever the resolution the quality of the original recording trumps everything else.

 

"the quality of the original recording trumps everything else", posted on December 28, 2018 at 16:44:51
Chris from Lafayette
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I agree with that too. But that's not incompatible with preferring hi-rez, all other things being equal (which is what I think you were also saying).

 

What I love to listen to is NEVER on SACD, posted on December 28, 2018 at 18:27:44
Jon L
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and I don't want to be one of those people who let the (claimed) sound quality dictate what Music they play...

 

No FPGA necessary... any decent PC/Mac will do...., posted on December 28, 2018 at 22:44:32
AbeCollins
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" Only certain types of FPGA configured DSD devices take lower resolution 16/44 level and CONVERT them to DSD. "

HQPlayer will convert 16/44 or any PCM to DSD, then output it to any DSD DAC. No special FPGA equipped DAC needed.

I've done it on my 6 year old Mac Mini, but I've never been overly impressed with DSD or SACD.




 

Exactly what I said. Except, posted on December 28, 2018 at 23:18:56
oldmkvi
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for the last bit...
I love the DSD thing, both playback and some of my own Recordings on Sony D 100.
My Z1 is my most satisfying Digital Component.
FWIW, the Developer of HQ thinks Software should do DSD Conversion, not the Dac.
The Z1 is more Integrated, but not FPGA.
HQ on Mac is quite good too, tho.

 

RE: "the quality of the original recording trumps everything else", posted on December 29, 2018 at 00:29:39
PAR
" But that's not incompatible with preferring hi-rez, all other things being equal (which is what I think you were also saying)."

I was hoping to say a little more than that and apologise for my failure.

What I was trying to say is that in most cases (not all) the difference between a hi-res version and the redbook version of a well produced, well reproduced, recording will not be clearly discernable as part of a normal listening session i.e. not sitting there carrying out a/b comparisons to spot tiny differences. That is if you spent an evening here just playing albums, some hi-res some not, and I asked you to guess which were which I doubt that it would produce a statistically significant result.

However I will admit to normally choosing the hi-res version "just in case". So I do have a preference in that sense.

 

I agree mostly, posted on December 29, 2018 at 06:10:34
Feanor
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At least I can say the really good Red Book sound is all I need, hi rez doesn't seem to add anything inherently. (Vindication of the Nyquist Theorem.)

The fact too rarely discussed by audiophiles is that 90+% of the sound quality depends on the engineering and mastering of the recording, not the distribution medium or resolution above 16/44.1.


I love the music of Dmitri Shostakovich ...

 

Yes, I saw that but someone missed it, posted on December 29, 2018 at 07:24:27
AbeCollins
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...so I said it again with more detail ;-)

My point is this. PCM to DSD conversion does not require an FPGA at all whether done in the audio hardware (DAC) or on a PC/Mac in software.

"FPGA" is just another popular bullet point for the manufacturer's glossy marketing slick. FPGA simply allows the manufacturer / user to "field program" the chip with updates which is nice for some folks but that doesn't mean only devices with FPGA can do DSD conversion.

I'm not envious of FPGA equipped DACs. Mine sounds just fine w/o field updates, thank you very much.


 

+1 I agree mostly, posted on December 29, 2018 at 07:51:52
AbeCollins
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"The fact too rarely discussed by audiophiles is that 90+% of the sound quality depends on the engineering and mastering of the recording, not the distribution medium or resolution above 16/44.1."

I have a handful of older hi-res albums that sound no better than my CD rips, and I have some CD rips that sound as good as my hi-res. As you say, it's mostly in the engineering and mastering of a good recording.

I might hear a very slight benefit in a quality recorded and mastered hi-res album over the same high quality 'redbook' if I stress over it and dissect the music rather than just sitting back and enjoying it. And I'm just talking hi-res PCM. I've played with SACD & DSD but was never a fan.


 

I'll bet my discernment between hi-rez and CD-rez would be very high. . . , posted on December 29, 2018 at 08:35:33
Chris from Lafayette
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. . . especially since most of my hi-rez downloads and discs tend to be MCh! ;-)

 

Hi Abe, which PS Audio Dac are you using? I know, posted on December 29, 2018 at 09:13:16
oldmkvi
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you posted before...

 

RE: I'll bet my discernment between hi-rez and CD-rez would be very high. . . , posted on December 29, 2018 at 09:27:55
PAR
Touché !!


However I did say " here" where the space is too confined to house anything greater than vanilla two channel.

What is a subtext to my remarks is a realisation that the whole high-resolution concept started in the late 1990s when the attainment of most commercial CD players was little more than adequate. SACD (for example) came as a reaction to that. However developments over the ensuing decades have meant that the margin in subjective performance between redbook and hi-res has narrowed considerably. Which is one reason why SACD was a commercial failure and why IMO there is really little public understanding or demand for hi-res. Just look how slow the turnover of threads in this forum is :-(

 

just so!, posted on December 29, 2018 at 11:44:33
Bruce from DC
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With my Sony XA-777ES player, the difference between SACD and RBCD is almost always obvious (that is, when the machine decides to play SACDs, which is infrequently).

But the thing is at least 15 years old. No doubt RBCD reproduction is much better, but I just have to take the plunge and get a decent DAC that doesn't cost a fortune.

I have a very small number of SACD-only discs; the rest are hybrids. There must be a way of ripping the SACD-only discs to a DSD file and then converting it to PCM. On the used (and some new) market, there are lots of reputable DACs that don't do DSD.


 

I presently have 7 DACs, posted on December 29, 2018 at 12:01:23
AbeCollins
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My favorite which I presently own is the PS Audio NuWave DSD DAC. It is no longer made. I put it right up there with my Ayre QB9-DSD DAC which I also owned. I ever so slightly prefer the PS Audio so I sold the Ayre. Both outstanding DACs.

Presently have:

- PS Audio NuWave DSD DAC
- Wyred4Sound DAC2-DSD
- Mytek Digital Stereo192-DSD
- Teac UD-501 USB DSD
- Wyred4Sound uDAC
- Apogee Groove USB DAC
- Allo BOSS DAC (on a Raspberry Pi)

I've probably had nearly a dozen others over the years including some costing upwards of $5000 and another that was supposed to be a $199 giant killer. It was junk.

Hmm, I guess it's time to sell off a few more DACs ;-)



 

"I need something for my SACD Player to do.", posted on December 29, 2018 at 14:38:02
Kal Rubinson
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I use it to rip SACDs. ;-)

 

RE: just so!, posted on December 29, 2018 at 16:10:37
PAR
" There must be a way of ripping the SACD-only discs to a DSD file ". Brief details on how to do this are in this very thread further down.

Incidentally there's no point IMO in ripping an SACD and converting it to PCM as most are made from PCM files converted to DSD! It's a major scam. Just rip the redbook layer ( which is usually native PCM) if you want PCM replay. It avoids all of the conversion and will sound better even given the resolution.

Depending upon the DAC, "upsampling" - (it isn't really it is just padding) to 24 bit can bear rewards mainly because most modern processors expect a 24 bit word and faced with a 16 bit one use some of their processing power to insert 8 digital zeros on the fly ( so I am given to understand).

 

RE: Smithers / upsampling, posted on December 29, 2018 at 22:50:06
digda_beat
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fortunatly Chris Smithers and Nick drake are on sacd, and even dsotm. tha's about it though

I am saving for an upsampling dac (based on Russian kit) which I think will solve my dogital issues

 

RE: just so!, posted on December 30, 2018 at 06:23:26
Dave_K
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Incidentally there's no point IMO in ripping an SACD and converting it to PCM as most are made from PCM files converted to DSD! It's a major scam. Just rip the redbook layer ( which is usually native PCM) if you want PCM replay. It avoids all of the conversion and will sound better even given the resolution.


That hasn't been my experience. I've ripped lots of SACDs over the last couple years. I keep the .dsf files and also convert them to 24/88.2k FLAC for playback on devices that can't handle DSD. My main system supports native DSD playback, and on that system I don't hear a big difference between playing DSD and playing the converted hi-res FLAC. I long ago ripped the CD layer of my hybrid SACDs, and the difference between the 16/44.1 rip and the 24/88.2 conversion from DSD is usually bigger than the difference between the 24/88.2 conversion and the DSD rip. This is true even for hybrid SACDs from labels like AP, Chesky, and Telarc where they tried hard to make the best CD layer.

I do think it's wasteful to take a hi-res PCM master, convert to DSD for distribution, and convert back to hi-res PCM for playback. But those conversions seem less harmful than downsampling the hi-res master to 16/44.1.

 

RE: Smithers / upsampling, posted on December 30, 2018 at 14:55:22
PAR
" I am saving for an upsampling dac (based on Russian kit) which I think will solve my digital issues"

Why do you think that? Upsampling adds no additional information ( genuine hi-res does). It does allow for digital filters with more "gentle" characteristics to be used but those filters have to be at your disposal. What choices does this Russian kit give you?

I have 18 or so years of owning upsampling equipment from the company that effectively invented the whole idea. However aside from an initial few years* I have since never used it. I have found it has some subtle unsettling characteristics (even using the latest revised algorithms). I would rather play straightforward redbook albeit with the asymmetrical filter ( no pre-ringing) that I can access.

I am not saying that what you are saving for may not provide what you seek but that the paper specification promises nothing in the real audible world. You need to hear before you buy.

* one interesting point is that although I was more or less happy with it for those years all of my musician friends hated it from the get go.

 

IMO, the main advantage of SACD is multi-channel, posted on December 30, 2018 at 17:07:53
Feanor
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But I listen to multi-channel music, (on my HT system), only very, very rarely.

I have quite few SACDs but listen mainly to rips of their CD tracks.


I love the music of Dmitri Shostakovich ...

 

RE: just so!, posted on December 31, 2018 at 07:27:17
Aaron 01
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Dave K I agree with you! I too have ripped my SACD's and found the PCM 24/88.2 hi rez taken from the DSD file to sound better than the 16/44 redbook from the same disc.

 

I don't know what gear you have/had , or what your musician friends heard,, posted on December 31, 2018 at 08:09:54
oldmkvi
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But I only listen to DSD 128, and am about to get a DSD 256 Dac.
With my gear and ears ( and i am a musician too ), I love upsampling everything to DSD 128.
I use HQ, and the developer recommends doing what I and most HQ users do, Upsample everything to DSD.
I don't dislike Hi Res PCM, but I love the DSD Sound.
I use the Sony Hap Z1, McIntosh D 150 mainly, also have Mytek 192/DSD , Lampizator Euforia, and Korg Audiogate/and Dac for editing my live DSD Recordings.
A number of Companies offer Dacs or Disc Players that exclusively Upsample to High Rate Dsd.
I have to admit iIdon't why many others don't like upsampling, I do and have since the first time I heard it.


 

RE: I don't know what gear you have/had , or what your musician friends heard,, posted on December 31, 2018 at 08:46:16
PAR
OK, here you are as a musician that likes upsampling. Fair enough and more power to your elbow ( or lungs and lips :-)).

What gear? In order: dCS Elgar/Purcell, dCS Paganini 4 box stack, dCS Vivadli 2 with matching upsampler ( which I tried but had the familiar misgivings so didn't buy the upsampler box). Maybe your gear does it better but, as I this is from the company that really "invented" upsampling and, BTW, was one of the developers during the implementation of DSD for SACD (they were responsible for the data packing) and was also a prime developer of DoP. So I take it on trust that they know what they are doing.

Now I like DSD. Just not PCM upsampled to DSD. I don't really like PCM upsampled to other sample rates even when they are integers of 44.1 KS/s. However I will admit that 16/44.1 upsampled to 24/176.4 is a reasonable compromise i.e. the negative aspects that I hear are not as prevalent as with DSD conversion.

It is difficult to put in words why I dislike it (dCS don't understand me either!) as I am currently unsure that I have the appropriate vocabulary. I can only say that when I switch it off it is comparable to having worn a pair of shoes that pinch and the relief upon taking them off. I really have been suffering mild stress.

I suppose one day I could try the DSP facilities in JRiver and try it there but , as I said recently, I try not to get too involved in excess playing around with technology. I do too much already and it eats into listening to music.

 

Ah yes, there are few serious multichannel guys here...., posted on December 31, 2018 at 14:46:32
AbeCollins
Audiophile

Posts: 35700
Location: USA
Joined: June 22, 2001
Contributor
  Since:
February 2, 2002

...but I bet 99.9% of us are 2-channel listeners when it comes to music.


 

Consider DSD files instead, posted on January 1, 2019 at 17:42:14
E-Stat
Audiophile

Posts: 29370
Joined: May 12, 2000
Contributor
  Since:
April 5, 2002
using any number of streamers.

Except your Bluenote.

 

RE: just so!, posted on January 1, 2019 at 19:01:31
Bruce from DC
Bored Member

Posts: 19008
Location: U.S. Capital
Joined: October 13, 1999
Contributor
  Since:
March 1, 1999
That's what I would have suspected. The relevance of tbe question to me is that there are some very good DACs that don't do DSD. So, if i migrate away from a disc spinner (as I am inclined to do), it might be handy to have all PCM files in mass storage. Some of my SACDs are SACD only, so there would be no way for me to get that music without ripping it to a DSD file and then converting that file to PCM.

And, as you all suggest even hybrid discs might benefit from ripping and converting the SACD layer rather than just ripping the RB layer.


 

More Classical music is on SACD than genres, posted on January 2, 2019 at 08:52:55
Feanor
Audiophile

Posts: 6805
Location: London, Ontario
Joined: June 17, 2003
Contributor
  Since:
March 12, 2004
But I suspect a higher portion of Classical is sold on CDs as well as SACDs versus other media, than is the case for other genres


I love the music of Dmitri Shostakovich ...

 

The subject is DACs, HQPlayer is source based, posted on January 2, 2019 at 09:51:28
Sordidman
Audiophile

Posts: 13658
Location: San Francisco
Joined: May 14, 2001
running DSD at the source with HQ player has issues that run the process DAC does not, - or may not. HQPlayer is a solution that can be effective for some, - but not right for others......






"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"

 

RE: Yes, I saw that but someone missed it, posted on January 2, 2019 at 09:56:42
Sordidman
Audiophile

Posts: 13658
Location: San Francisco
Joined: May 14, 2001
"""FPGA" is just another popular bullet point for the manufacturer's glossy marketing slick. ""

I am sure that every Directstream DAC owner will disagree with you.

And of course, - as an Audiophile, - purchaser of high end audio "marketing slick," - your hypocrisy here is notable


"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"

 

An FPGA based DAC that converts everything to DSD, posted on January 2, 2019 at 10:11:27
Sordidman
Audiophile

Posts: 13658
Location: San Francisco
Joined: May 14, 2001
IS optimizing redbook level playback...

Your post is trolling as the subject is hi-rez DACs, and this is a hi-rez FORUM.

This isn't the place to make pronouncements about whether or not Hi-Rez works.

People DO enjoy the SACD format. People also have Universal players that play DVD, DVD-A, SACD, and redbook discs. These folks get to compare directly the recording quality, - sometimes with the exact same music between CD and SACD discs. Most agree that the SACD discs of the same recordings do sound substantially better at the higher resolution of SACD.


The same/or similar holds true with digital file playback.

Many folks who have purchased the DirectStream DAC or the APL DSD DACs where an FPGA chip processes all input to the DSD before converting to Analog report a much improved SQ.




"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"

 

You should get together with oldmkvi! [nt] ;-), posted on January 2, 2019 at 15:23:06
Chris from Lafayette
Bored Member

Posts: 17092
Location: SF Bay Area
Joined: February 17, 2004
Contributor
  Since:
February 6, 2012

 

You are 5 DACs short...., posted on January 2, 2019 at 15:45:36
Ivan303
Audiophile

Posts: 40478
Location: Cadiere d'azur FRANCE - Santa Fe, NM
Joined: February 26, 2001
of being a certified member of the 'DAC of the Month' club.

Best get busy! :-)



 

The subject is DSD and your incorrect statement...., posted on January 3, 2019 at 18:02:34
AbeCollins
Audiophile

Posts: 35700
Location: USA
Joined: June 22, 2001
Contributor
  Since:
February 2, 2002

....that FPGA based DACs are necessary for DSD conversion.

 

RE: Ah yes, there are few serious multichannel guys here...., posted on January 9, 2019 at 04:19:08
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 13407
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
Absolutely! Abe-
2 channel here. You own an interesting collection of DAC(s).
And the Accuphase cd player.

 

(Troll alert) I never wrote what you claim, posted on January 9, 2019 at 09:39:17
Sordidman
Audiophile

Posts: 13658
Location: San Francisco
Joined: May 14, 2001
I never wrote that FPGA designed gear is necessary for DSD conversion.




"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"

 

I've read only dozens of the hundreds (?) of replies here., posted on January 11, 2019 at 00:05:54
jeffreybehr
Audiophile

Posts: 5426
Location: Phoenix, Arizona
Joined: December 10, 2004
Contributor
  Since:
December 13, 2004
I LOVE the sounds of my SACDs and all the players I've had, NONE of which has ever failed.

Are you selling your SACDs? I don't know your musical tastes; any big-orchestra Classical in your collection?
----------
Tin-eared audiofool, lover of large-scale Classical and film music and movies, and amateur fotografer.
William Bruce Cameron: "...not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted."

 

Agrred, posted on January 11, 2019 at 04:58:51
Jack G
Audiophile

Posts: 9310
Joined: September 24, 1999
I'm still buying about half a dozen ever few weeks. They seem to be the bulk of my music purchases now.
Jack

 

My Marantz DV-9600 plays all of the silver disks except Blue Ray..., posted on January 11, 2019 at 08:38:36
Ivan303
Audiophile

Posts: 40478
Location: Cadiere d'azur FRANCE - Santa Fe, NM
Joined: February 26, 2001
I bought it used several years ago for a mere $300 or so. Plays CD and SACDs great, and great for Movies/DVDs as well.

No hiccups.





 

nah, posted on January 11, 2019 at 09:11:48
nah, I have about 30 SACDs, most are hybrids so not for sale.

I have a low end Onkyo player which still plays them. But not about to drop $6,000 on an Esoteric player which I really want but can't have.

 

I don't have, posted on January 15, 2019 at 14:08:21
oldmkvi
Audiophile

Posts: 8918
Joined: April 12, 2002
an Oppo, Playstation or Windows Computer.
Other than that. I'm ready to go!

 

RE: Giving up on SACD, posted on March 17, 2019 at 09:36:25
Felixer
Industry Professional

Posts: 34
Joined: August 2, 2010
Do you have list of your SACDs for sale? I'd be interested in buying them. Thanks.

 

RE: Giving up on SACD, posted on April 13, 2019 at 19:22:57
DewDude
Audiophile

Posts: 157
Joined: February 13, 2002
I "gave up" on SACD discs as well..

I pop them in my PS3...get an image...play that image back in Foobar2k to my DSD capable DAC. The quality of the DAC is on par with some of the best SACD players I've heard.

 

RE: SACD allong with most hi rez is a fools errend, posted on June 7, 2019 at 09:58:31
hiredfox
Audiophile

Posts: 62
Joined: March 25, 2016
This of course is absolute tosh!

 

RE: SACD allong with most hi rez is a fools errend, posted on November 12, 2019 at 15:23:47
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 13407
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
The SACD players are still relevant moving into 2020. Back in the Spring, I purchased a sweet AYRE DX-5 universal spinner.

 

RE: Giving up on SACD, posted on February 1, 2020 at 04:03:37
JMCIII
Reviewer

Posts: 1519
Location: Vermont
Joined: April 3, 2000
Might want to take a close look at this. I own one, and I sounds GREAT on SACD/DVD-A/CD (just doesn't do Blu-ray). And I came from an Esoteric.

Just my (adjusted for inflation) $2

John Crossett

___

It sounds like English, but I can't understand a word you're saying.

 

Might want to take a close look at what? (NT), posted on February 1, 2020 at 06:37:53
Kal Rubinson
Reviewer

Posts: 11625
Location: New York
Joined: June 5, 2002


 

RE: Giving up on SACD, posted on March 11, 2020 at 13:26:09
fantja
Audiophile

Posts: 13407
Location: Alabama
Joined: September 11, 2010
Which spinner- John?

 

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