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More Dutton RCA and CBS/Sony quad remasters

77.111.245.14
Posted on February 21, 2021 at 01:16:54
Chris from Lafayette
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 Just sent an order in for the following, including some new reissues from January (last month):
  • Falla - 3-Cornered Hat, Dukas La Peri - Boulez
  • Beethoven - Eroica - Stokowski
  • Ravel - Daphnis et Chloe - Boulez
  • Mahler - Resurrection - Stokowski
  • Strauss - Also sprach Zarathustra, Saint-Saens - Organ Symphony - Ormandy
In general, I'm very enthusiastic about the discrete quad remasterings which Michael Dutton has done on the previous Dutton releases I've heard, so I'm pretty optimistic about this new group.

 

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RE: More Dutton RCA and CBS/Sony quad remasters, posted on February 21, 2021 at 18:04:35
Mali
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 I have several of those Dutton SACDs of mainly Columbia issues from the early 1960s and have been very disappointed with the sonics. Just not very good. And the RCA film music series, at least my 4th different set. They also came out recently as a box set, not SACD obviously. However, the Duttons weren't anything to write home about. Just as disappointing as the old Columbias.

 

Interesting - are you listening in 2Ch or quad?, posted on February 21, 2021 at 18:29:17
Chris from Lafayette
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 My comments were based on the quad versions.

Also, would you be willing to elaborate a bit? For instance, when you say that you were disappointed with the Dutton reissues, what is it that you find disappointing? And what titles were you referring to?

 

RE: Interesting - are you listening in 2Ch or quad?, posted on February 22, 2021 at 12:53:27
Mali
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 Two channel. Some of the Gerhardt film series, and I remember a couple of Philadelphia Orch. ones, one a Rheinberger organ concerto disc with E. Power Biggs. I can't get into describing the sonics, other than saying they weren't very good. I had the Rheinberger on Lp and though it sounded pretty good on the Lp. thought that was a long time ago.

 

I don't know that Rheinberger album at all, posted on February 22, 2021 at 13:37:47
Chris from Lafayette
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 Based on my experience with that Rubinstein/Ormandy concerto album I mentioned, I might agree with you that the Philadelphia-sourced reissues are not as good. I'll know better once my Ormandy ASZ and SS Organ Symphony arrive.

Can't agree with you about the Gerhardt film albums however - but that may be because I listen in quad.

 

Review: 1973 High Fidelity, posted on February 27, 2021 at 17:54:22
Mali
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This recording came out a few years later than I thought which is probably why Philadelphia and Ormandy aren't on it. They had moved to RCA by then, I believe.

 

Wow - is that an actual scan? [nt], posted on February 28, 2021 at 01:48:26
Chris from Lafayette
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RE: Wow - is that an actual scan? [nt], posted on February 28, 2021 at 03:22:45
frankwm
 Re-Live Your Yoof >>>

 

RE: I don't know that Rheinberger album at all, posted on February 23, 2021 at 09:58:12
Mali
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Was astonished to see I got this three years ago now. Jeeze, time flies.
This was a huge hit back in the 60s when it came out, that is as far as classical albums can be hits. I certainly enjoyed the Lp issue of 55 (?) years ago a lot more than I have this SACD reissue.

I see the orchestra is said to be the Columbia Symphony conducted by Peress, but that
looks like Ormandy on the cover, doesn't it, or is that Biggs?

 

RE: I don't know that Rheinberger album at all, posted on February 23, 2021 at 11:38:33
pbarach
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 The cover is E. Power Biggs

 

Ormandy box coming , posted on February 22, 2021 at 13:44:11
pbarach
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 There is a 120-CD box of Ormandy/Philly coming at the beginning of April, FYI.

 

I am hoping for two big boxes...., posted on February 22, 2021 at 18:41:44
srl1
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 One should be the Columbia releases and the other the RCA releases. Because I don't have much Ormandy now, I'd be a prime candidate for both.

 

RE: I am hoping for two big boxes...., posted on February 22, 2021 at 18:53:20
pbarach
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 The big Ormandy box, like many of the Sony boxes, will include recordings originally on Columbia as well others originally on RCA. Sony owns both catalogs now.

 

RE: I am hoping for two big boxes...., posted on February 23, 2021 at 19:00:39
srl1
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 I know, but I was hoping they would keep them separate. I read that this Ormandy box will be all mono.

 

Not really that much of a fan of Ormandy - I'll try to catch some of it on Qobuz [nt], posted on February 22, 2021 at 13:57:39
Chris from Lafayette
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Dutton's remasters of the RCA Classic Film Scores are excellent., posted on February 21, 2021 at 10:09:39
jeffreybehr
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 I have all half-dozen plus Raksin's 'Laura'-and-more album.. The CFS recordings by Wilkinson are VERY natural and attractive; the Raksin (by Wade and Haskell) uses MANY-more mics and sounds not nearly as natural, but all the music is excellent.. I've heard the Stokowski/Beethoven 3 once and it was at least OK; haven't yet heard the Wagner/Bach.

Buy some; then he'll do more. :-)

BTW my goodbuddy LOVES the old R&R SACDs.

 

Yup - I agree, posted on February 21, 2021 at 11:07:47
Chris from Lafayette
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 I have the Dutton issues of the "Captain Blood" and "Citizen Kane" CFS albums and they're excellent!

And that Stokowski Bach/Wagner album which you mention (strange combination of composers!) is great too.

In addition, I tried Michael Dutton's remaster of Rachmaninoff's own performances of his Symphony No. 3 and Isle of the Dead, and Dutton did an outstanding job here too, avoiding that all-too-typical shellac "break up" distortion in the louder passages. I was very happy with this one.



About the only Dutton remaster I was less than impressed with is the Rubinstein/Ormandy Rachmaninoff Second Concerto, but I'm not sure that very much can be done with a master like that one anyway. (I had a similar reaction to the HDTT remaster of this performance.)

 

Sadly, that one is NOT on QOBUZ..., posted on February 21, 2021 at 12:40:22
Ivan303
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 at least that I could find.


First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

I'm disappointed no downloads. The MTT Orff and some Ormandy interests me greatly. My recent downloads: , posted on February 21, 2021 at 07:48:20
jdaniel@jps.net
 Bruch Scottish Fantasy/VC Grumiaux/Philharmonia/Philips -- my fav Scottish. Clean, light, soaring and very good Philips recording. I prefer it to the Oistrakh and Chung, their performances considered the "classics." (Do give the overshadowed Grumiaux a stream on Qobuz.)

Ligeti. Just some old fav's: his Atmospheres and Lontano performed by Abaddo and the VPO on DGG. Luxury, right? : ) Ligeti is one of the...well, the only late 20th C to whom I've returned over the years. I also downloaded his Lux Aeterna. Some gorgeous passing harmonies, purposeful or not. Cappella Amsterdam/Reuss.

I finally sat down and listened through Mozart's Magic Flute, the Klemperer. Singing very pleasing, and pacing not distractingly slow, but I'm not a Magic Flute connoisseur so take with a grain of salt! I noticed that most of the "hits" are located in the 2nd Act, the highlight for me being Pamina's "lament." By the end, yes, I felt as if I'd been taking on an interesting journey. Visuals and perhaps some text would have likely enhanced my experience, though I usually don't feel short-changed when listening at home to operas.

Puccini's Tosca, the Karajan VPO with Price, in gorgeous and light voice, and Di Stefano, his voice strained and hard to the point of distraction.

In the can for future listening:

Mendelssohn's String Quartets w/ Escher, (on sale today at eclassical). I don't know them at all.

Rachmaninoff Symphony #2 w/Rattle, LSO. I just downloaded Gergiev's LSO Live a month ago. It's very good but IMHO doesn't quite plumb the depths during the second half of the 3rd mov't. Gergiev pushes through the final climax a bit too hard, IMHO.

Vanska's Mahler 10th. (My reference is Sanderling's)

Mozart's Don Giovani w/Giulini EMI.

 

I have a couple of those titles you've identified for your future listening, posted on February 21, 2021 at 10:32:08
Chris from Lafayette
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 Mendelssohn String Quartets with the Escher Quartet - an excellent recording which is a nice alternative to the Mandelring Quartet performances on Audite. (You should do what I did and get both!)

Rachmaninoff Symphony No. 2 with Sir Simon and the LSO - my interest in Sir Simon these days is pretty low, but I used to have his recording of this symphony with the LAPO - remember that one? Not interesting as an interpretation, but it was one of the few commercial issues recorded in the Dorothy Chandler Pavilion. (Decca/London had been recording in UCLA's Royce Hall, while DG had used the ghastly Shrine Auditorium near USC.) I didn't keep it for very long - but not because of where it was recorded! ;-)

Mahler Symphony No. 10 with Vanska - I'm far from an expert in this symphony. (My only other recording of it is the Barshai recording on Brilliant, where he plays his own version, rather than one of the more standard Cooke versions.) I thought it was good, with Vanska's typically pppp insistence in the softer sections! ;-) (Which I know some listeners don't like!)

 

RE: I have a couple of those titles you've identified for your future listening, posted on February 22, 2021 at 13:00:34
Mali
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I several other versions of the completed 10th but still think this is the best. First recording of the reconstruction. Had it on Lp when it was first issued and now this CD, very nice. You might like it.

 

Rattle's Rach is a bit of a wallow. Soft-edged performance captured in soft-edged recording, posted on February 21, 2021 at 11:23:23
jdaniel@jps.net
 Winds and brass to the fore and slightly diffuse strings seeming to come from rear left and right. Maybe the Barbican recording team has added a little reverb?

Rattle's "in the moment" conducting isn't as extreme as OA Hughes (BIS) so anyone new to the piece should be able to follow Rattle's performance without feeling short-changed, but hopefully will check out more "fiery" performances.

I'm comparing directly with Gergiev/LSO at the moment and between he and Rattle, I prefer Gergiev's pacing, (for the most part), his energy, and the LSO's more decisive, swaggering brass, esp. lower brass. The climax of the 1st mov't is quite momentous. Interesting how the mind is tricked though. Rattle and Gergiev's timings are very similar in mov'ts 2,3,and 4. Gergiev 1st mov't seems to go faster, even with the Expo repeat!

It will be interesting to see what Gramophone says. They didn't like Rattle's re-make.

 

So I turned the volume up quite a bit...much more visceral experience, posted on February 22, 2021 at 16:57:19
jdaniel@jps.net
 FWIW, I want to revise my opinion, just a little:

If you're a fan of every subsidiary, tertiary and um.... Anyway, if you don't mind every last note lovingly-sculpted by the conductor, consequential or not, (and I'm talking about the notes) then this is probably as good as it gets. A shot (or two) of Vodka was my prep.

If you like a conductor who keeps his eye on the distant tonic, you'll likely prefer the Gerviev.

 

Volume level - yes, that can certainly make a BIG difference! [nt] ;-), posted on February 22, 2021 at 19:18:53
Chris from Lafayette
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As you have pointed out a couple of times yourself! : ) nt, posted on February 23, 2021 at 07:13:59
jdaniel@jps.net
 m

 

RE: More Dutton RCA and CBS/Sony quad remasters, posted on February 21, 2021 at 04:21:00
Dave Billinge
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 Yes - have bought all but the Beethoven. Falla particularly good. Managed to avoid listening to the Mahler so far - too many other new Mahler recordings in the "new" pile! Surround is utterly unrealistic but decidedly fun, just as, one suspects, the producers intended. Musically all good stuff, great performances from an era of great performances.

Dave

 

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