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In Reply to: RE: Have you listened to/compared original all analog LP's vs. the Mofi LP's made from digital copies? nt posted by Rick W on August 06, 2022 at 09:38:33
Mofi and other audiophile labels do a lot of things differently. You can't isolate the digital stage unless it is the ONLY variable. Mofi does their own transfers from the analog tape. Right there you have an audible difference from their records and any all analog versions. Mastering moves are never disclosed by Mofi or any of the other labels. So you have any number of variables there.And you have different cutting lathes with different cutting amps. That can make a substantial difference.
So yes, I have done numerous comparisons. And my preferences vary title to title.But I have also done comparsions that are far more relevant. I have done direct time synced comparisions between LPs that are all analog against hi res digital rips from the same feed. They are indistinguishable.
Edits: 08/06/22Follow Ups:
I already mentioned that I don't own any Mofi LP's so obviously I'm not commenting on how they sound. I was just curious if you'd done a comparison.
That wasn't meant to be some kind of an FU for the original post. It was meant to point out that there are too many other variables in comparing Mofis to other all analog masterings to use those comparions as a gauge for the effect (or non-effect) of the digital step in their mastering chain. I have multiple all analog masterings of many of my favorite recordings that all sound quite different fromone another. To gauge the effect or ineffect of that digital step or any digital step it has to be the only variable and it has to be done time synced, level matched and under blind conditions. I have done that and they are indistinguishable.
Now, how do the Mofis stack up against the other labels? They tend to hold their own overall. Some titles they are my favorite and some not so much. I have not found a label or a specific mastering engineer to beat all others.And we can't underestimate the impact of personal taste. My favorites might not be yours or someone else's.
By the way, I enjoyed the article and I am glad you posted it.
I do think Mofi fucked up by not accurately describing their reissues but that's not to say the sound quality isn't good. The only "audiophile" LP's I've bought were a few Classic Records albums when they were on sale at Tower decades ago. Being a geezer I own lots of originals and am not dissatisfied with the non-audiophile reissues I have.
In short, I have no dog in this whole episode.
I am the same way, the MOFI stuff I own was bought used, whey back when , before my self imposed vinyl space limitation, so I never even bothered to follow the controversy, as the new stuff didn't concern me. But I figured the hub Bub had died down, so I read the linked article to get some facts.It was worth the read because Mr. Fremer makes an ass out of himself twice in the same report. First when he attacked the record store owner , not just to contradict his facts, but also to say he is not credible , not an expert reporter in the field, and should be ignored, unlike himself, I suppose.
Then, later on in the article, he steps in it again, saying he should have been called in to talk with the recording engineers , instead of the guy who exposed the truth, because he was , my words, Michel Fremer , or however he spells his name . I long ago gave up on the guy, so am not exposed to his spelling. I figure he is just another old guy trying to make his way in the world, and if people want to exalt his opinions, fine with me.
I think he was way out of bounds to belittle the truth, and the messenger.
Edits: 08/06/22
"But I have also done comparsions that are far more relevant. I have done direct time synced comparisions between LPs that are all analog against hi res digital rips from the same feed. They are indistinguishable."
Were these comparisons conducted with reference quality recordings of unamplified instruments?
nt
What ever happened to relaxing on a comfortable chair and just trying to enjoy the MUSIC? This whole controversy is so crazy to me. Ok, so Mofi has lied, misrepresented, call it what you will. So what? Clearly, they realized years ago that revealing details of their mastering chain would cause an uproar. And they were right! Clearly, not being honest from the beginning was a bad decision. And they are justly suffering because of it. Haven't we had enough of outrage about this? Either buy or don't buy their products but let's not make this an issue of the century.
You asked.....so what? Well, you posted the answers. Not sure if you feel I should be castigated for posting the link, but ya know you can always ignore it as I do re: plenty of raps here. I was just kind of amused that the story even made it into WAPO.
Hey, I'm reading it so I'm just as shallow and interested in the inconsequential as everyone else here. However, it does become too much after a while. And you're right. If you're uninterested, just stop reading!
"What ever happened to relaxing on a comfortable chair and just trying to enjoy the MUSIC?"
Speaking for myself, that's mostly what I do. But better sound does take time, effort and funds. I am of the opinion that better versions of a given title makes for a substantial overall improvement and so it's worthy of exploration.
as for Mofi, I didn't care a bit about this "big scandal." I judge their records on the sound
I was kicking around YouTube and one guy mentioned an eight thousand dollar selling price for a MoFi Santana album, that now has to be re- evaluated because of the digital step. And the fact that the digital step means no more real limits on production . Contradicting two important elements, because of the manufacture's dishonesty, that drove the collector and retail price.
I suppose for normal collectors that would cause a bit of concern, but really , a person willing to pay thousands of dollars for a single record can probably take the hit.
If one was investing for speculative profit in a record business, he can probably write off a partial loss on his taxes.
Maybe MoFi will get smart and reissue the high demand albums so that more people can enjoy the quality, and to make hay while the sun shines on vinyl records.
I suppose they will stick as closely as possible to the established pricing structure, and keep the collectors happy be treating the records like baseball cards, instead of music , a cultural enrichment.
those same speculators drove the pirces to that point in the first place. I have no sympathy for someone who pays that much money for that record as an investment. The *value* of audiophile records *as promoted by the audiophile labels* is in the sound quality. The market is driven by supply and demand. The sound quality of that particular record reached legendary status and that is what drove the demand. The limit of the edition run was a matter of the licence and that is what dictated and still dictates the supply. A digital step does not change either. Mofi makes no representation that any of their one steps are not subject to potential second editions.
Speculators have no complaints on moral grounds here.
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