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In Reply to: RE: Knight Speaker woofers ID posted by DavidLD on February 02, 2012 at 16:14:28
see the ebay photos. The green driver was the original. The other diver looks to me like a Utah 10 incher from a slightly later date. Allied sold Utah drivers as replacement speakers then.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Pair-KNIGHT-ALLIED-KN-3005-Speakers-3-Way-Cat-No-20-9537U-/250899399177
Follow Ups:
285 = ROLA. 335 = 1973 (or 1963) 35th week.
and a ROLA replacemnt which is the silver. I wonder if they would sound better with a matched pair of alnico woofers...only one way to find out.. also interesting that the newer looking black nec cap is original the cap on the replaced speaker is white...oh well, I'll go with daytons for both.
"When the demon is at your door, in the mornin' it won't be there no more"
Steely Dan
Didn't even scroll down to second speaker, Yes, this is a Utah (328) made 1964 or '74, 39th week. My guess... both are OEM. Very close in manufacturer date & similar design alnico speakers.Whomever made this for Knight prolly had several manufacturer sources for parts. Bet that both speakers sound pretty similar.
Edits: 02/02/12
both woofers were likely installed at the same time, by a consumer, as a kit, instead of one being a replacement later?
that would make sense as these old alnico woofers don't fail too often that I have seen, seems odd though that he/she couldn't find 2 identical.
I wish these old pieces could talk!
"When the demon is at your door, in the mornin' it won't be there no more"
Steely Dan
Either the same time as a kit, or by Knight (Or the commercial maker who built it for Knight) -- if it weren't a kit. A lot of speaker companies made similar spec'ed alnico speakers in those days (esp the 1960's). Low to mid-end products often had several different suppliers of components (pots, trannies, speakers, tubes, etc) to meet the needs of their end-products.
Kinda like ripping open a couple same make/model/vintage flat screens and seeing two or three different makers of IC-chips.
I just replaced the battery in my meter and the rola measures 3.4, while the utah is 7.1 across the taps...probably accounts for the bass response difference.
"When the demon is at your door, in the mornin' it won't be there no more"
Steely Dan
Some of what you guys are saying doesn't hold water. Utah manufactured the cabinets for Allied and supplied the drivers. If there is a 4 ohm Rola in one it is there as a replacement for the correct Utah woofer. The Rola may be a speaker the owner picked up used with the same diameter after one of the Utah woofers was damaged.These would not have been manufactured with a 4-ohm driver and an 8-ohm driver. They knew better than that in 1964.
I like the Utah date of '64. That would mean these were sold 64-65, about my guess. I know the 3005 number is earlier than my 69 Allied catalog.
The cabinet design screams Utah. Its very similar to my Utah MK 17 units tho the finish is lighter. Mine date from 1970. The grille cloth dates these to well before 1970, like 1964 or 65.
Utah paired a large 8 inch mid with the 12 inch woofer, but generally used 6 inch mids like those you see with a 10 inch woofer. THe tweeter too is classic Utah.
Allied merged with Radio Shak in 1970, and they did not sell Allied-Branded items after about 1972, so these definitely were not made in 1974.
Agree that the Rola is a replacement driver. If the speaker with the rola driver is the louder of the 2, adding some series resistance (bringing the total to about 8 ohms) might help. The Maggie amp probably has output transformers with 4 ohm secondaries, a possible advantage for the Rola.
The KN3005 was not listed in the Allied 1963 catalog. It was listed in the Allied 1966 catalog at 29.95. All 3 drivers were specified as having alnico magnets. By 1969 it had morphed into the KN3005A, which had ceramic magnet drivers. Same driver diameters, enclosure size, crossover frequencies (800 & 5000HZ), weight and price.
The enclosure volume and tuning are unlikely to be optimal for the Allegro drivers. The voicing will not be the same either. The Utah 10 had a paper surround and relatively light cone. The Allegro was a T/S based design, with a heavier cone and high compliance cloth surround. The 10 inch was run wide open (full range). The 'woofer cap' was actually the 1st order high pass network for the midrange. There should have been a cap for the tweeter as well. Series resistors were used for attenuation.
I think there is a good chance of finding a replacement Utah driver on eBay or at a local hamfest.
Regards,
Bob
What you say makes sense David, now that I measured the speakers. That was an important clue, for sure. Anyway, I just dropped in a 10" 8 ohm alnico woofer from a zenith allegro and it matches for volume fine with the Utah...problem solved.
next I'll replace the caps...couldn't hurt.
"When the demon is at your door, in the mornin' it won't be there no more"
Steely Dan
Depending on manufacturing date, there were two 10-inch Allegro woofers. The earlier one is by Carboneau, the later by Rola. The Rola one may have the 285 number on the magnet, These are 8-ohm not 4 ohn woofers. I hve a pair here.
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