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I had my hands on a KT120 years ago. Back then for "what ever reason" I did not care for it's sound. Of course that could have been the amp and I prefer not to get into a review argument.
How would a good KT120 compare to an equally good EL34 based amp.
Follow Ups:
I'm sure glad I don't have any of that dry, sterile, lifeless, etchy, unlistenable crap going on with mine!
More like rich, organic, sweet dessert. Delicious in triode. Mmm!
Scrumptious, actually. :)
Yes but imagine what your amp would sound like with good tubes :)
Imagine yours if it could do triode! ;)
The Rogues can do triode!
I use to run almost 100% of the time in triode with my old speakers, but my Acoustats need the extra juice that ultra linear brings to the party.
Cool!
But typically that's only 2 to 3 dB difference? Or do they really sound better on UL?
My PrimaLuna Dialogue Premium with KT-120s, in triode, sounds a lot like my Luxman MB3045s, converted to KT-88s, running triode.
It sure is nice to have both circuits available.
the KT120 based amp can sound better than teh EL34 based amp if done right .
i made both and both sound great . the KT120 need at least 90ma plus bias to sound good
LT
are you sure? correct bias depends on anode voltage too!
rogue audio recommends only 35 mA bias for KT88/90/120 tubes in their atlas magnum. i am thus running the 120`s at 40 mA maximum and they sound great with it. when i tried 45 or even 50 mA soundtage became narrow, boring, stressed...
N.
"Science just illustrates the current state of errors"
i'm sure.
i'm run my KT120 at around 95ma with 370v anode V .
...what confirms my statement. bias x voltage occures the dissipation loss the power tube can take. so my rogue gear at itīs higher anode voltage (> 500 V) allows only lower bias currents then. the exact bias for a KT120 can not be generalized is what i ment.
N.
"Science just illustrates the current state of errors"
The KT-120 and KT-150 have some nice qualities. Pure, smooth, very resolving, decent tone.
Beyond that I find both of them dry, sterile, lifeless. No sense of bloom, air, drive the reason I like tubes to begin with. Both these tubes sound like mediocre solid state. No thanks.
I, like you, do not care for the KT120 sound. Hard to believe that a tube could sound sterile but that's the word that kept coming to mind when listening to the KT120.
Agree. Dry, sterile, lacking in bloom.
The most "solid state" sounding output tube I have heard in my Rogue. Hard to believe these tubes are now standard in all Rogue amps.
This is the Tung Sol version I'm talking about. The Chinese Treasure KT120s sound much better but I couldn't get a quad that held stable bias in my amp. So their not much good either I guess.
that the tube is underbiased. Have you read the biasing requirements for the tube? Have you checked that the bias current is the same in your amp? The tube needs to be in it proper operating point to sound its best.
My Icon Audio MB30SE Mono Blocks use the Tung Sol KT120's, in fact I have just upgraded to the Tung Sol KT150's and at first didn't find them a great improvement over the Tung Sol KT120, but now the KT150's are coming on song (20 hr's) and sound better, but I never noticed the KT120's sounding dry, sterile "solid state" or lacking in bloom.
Regards,
Mike.
I am no expert, but the sound of any tube might depend on the implementation. I had an ARC Vsi75 with four KT120 tubes, and it absolutely sounded solid-state. I currently have a Primaluna Dialogue Premium, with four KT120s, and it is glorious. The ARC produced 75 w/ch, while the Primluna outputs about 40 w/ch in Ultralinear mode. So the ARC is working the tubes much harder.
I never could get my Primaluna Dialogue Premium to work well with KT-120's. Sounded dry and etchy. The bass and soundstaging was very nice however.
I found them a bit edgy, but having installed a pair of Brimar CV4034 tubes in the front two positions, they sound excellent. I use them with Spendor D7 speakers. These tubes added delicacy and a very lifelike reproduction of voices. Some female voices were almost unlistenable before them.
in spring i put PSVANE KT120 in my Rogue and the best sounding amp is the result! even better than my Penta Labs KT88 i was very keen on and far better than TungSol KT120.
unfortunately these two quads PSVANE KT120 which i purchased from a turkish source via epay was not working reliably. 3 of 8 tubes blew bias fuses after some dozends of hours in use. "chinese fire crackers" imo - what a shame...N.
"Science only illustrates the current state of errors"
Edits: 11/25/16
I've noticed a great deal of difficulty finding that "good" tube to work. And a lot of discussion even with that. Obviously with amp differences aside.
I've always found in audio that if something is that difficult in this hobby then it's not done well.
A good stereo should sound good under most ANY condition with few exceptions.
The KT120 is a beam power tetrode and will sound like 1 vs. a true 3 grid power pentode.
FWIW, I think your ears were right. The plate curves provided by the KT120 data sheet are distressingly non-linear. :> ( Those curves and some additional electrical characteristics are why I will not design for or use KT120s.
Eli D.
I recently spoke with a well known designer of tube gear who would second your comments and won't use either of the tubes citing very poor linearity.
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