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In Reply to: RE: Resistance posted by Duster on June 28, 2017 at 20:15:27
I would say there's a decent gray area between "cable advocates" and "cable naysayers."
I'm actually not sure what a "cable naysayer" is. :) Any objectivist worth his salt would not disagree that cables could have audible effects based on source impedance, load impedance, cable LCR and parasitic characteristics, etc, etc. However, any "cable advocate" that thinks there's some type of magic at work here is deluded.
The most irritating thing involved in the cable topic is the condescending attitude directed at "cable naysayers" by "cable advocates." :) "Open-minded" and "closed-minded" are polarizing labels that most audiophiles don't deserve to have applied to them.
Should fuses be considered wire or components?
Is wire not a component?
Oh YEAH !! seems everyone ignores the fact that inside your speaker is about 60-100 feet of guess what - 22-28 gauge commercial grade copper wire. So you have a $1000 speaker wire terminating on about ten bucks of copper - hum?
There's a difference between carrier components and working components. The speaker cable is a necessary evil. It shouldn't contribute anything to the task at hand and must simply do as little damage as possible as we move the speaker away from the amplifier.
The wire in a driver forms an electrical component and it does work. We don't expect to find an unscathed signal at the other end of it; we expect to find ground (usually). As such, it is chosen for completely different properties and it's already factored into the potential performance of the speaker.
What you can complain about is the few feet of hook-up wire in the speaker, though.
If so, so what?
Manufacturers of high quality loudspeaker drivers care very much about the characteristics of the wire they use to wind their voice coils, e.g. the electrical parameters of the wire and its insulation, the geometry of the wire, how it's wound on the former, etc.
The purpose of the voice coil wire is to produce a magnetic field. The wire going from the amp to the loudspeaker terminals serves a different purpose, so there's no basis for comparing their performance.
... "The wire going from the amp to the loudspeaker terminals serves a different purpose, so there's no basis for comparing their performance."
Actually, there is basis for performance comparisonss The purpose of the "wires" in both examples you cite is to conduct an electrical current. Physical configurations of conductors may be arranged to take advantage of the consequences of a "flowing" electrical current. In the case of a voice coil, low loss and low mass are also usually considered important. In the case of audiophile grade speaker cables, visual impressiveness is typically as important as electrical properties if not more so. ;-)
To confuse the issue with facts for this segment of the audience. :)
And what about the cheap stuff going from your $3K PL filter to the box? And that noisy awful stuff going from the box to the pole?
Where does it end?
One hypothesis is that the further you get away from the component's power supply, the less it matters. Which kind of makes sense considering that home electrical wiring is a poor conductor of RF. And it's not like there are "dirty" electrons traveling all the way from the power plant to your system. AC electrical circuits are not pipes.
My favorite is someone using a $500 power cord and extolling the sound signatures, when 8 feet above their head is a crappy splice box making that house line connection with a three cent partially oxidized wire nut.
Or better yet the outlets power line is connected simply by an old style 1/8th inch wide spring clip. But that magic rope IS working!
I believe cables/interconnects can and do have an effect. But like the true back bone of audio it's been hoisted up to a mystical almost religious level. Marketing level!!!
There are cheap cables and high quality cables. But there is a point ($$) where some of us start to think this is starting to sound like bull dinky. So count me in on not being as much a naysayer but skeptical snake oil purchaser.
Cables/interconnects are part of the whole system. Not the magical money rope that sits between boxes. If using a $1000 speaker wire is the deal breaker on your stereo, then you've got bigger issues with your setup than wire.
I'm actually not sure what a "cable naysayer" is. :)
Here are conclusions by the High Priest himself , Roger Russell:
"We have been told by advertising that the exotic speaker wires offer fabulous advantages over ordinary lamp cord. It would seem reasonable that using this same wire for lamps would also enhance their performance. In the same vein as wire literature, you can have your lamp reproduce light with the full spectrum color fidelity of natural daylight, finally allowing you see light the way it should be seen and bring out the natural performance of your lamp. It could offer greater warmth, detail, brilliance, definition and speed by providing wider bandwidth and reduced skin effect. It can provide a distortion free illumination that reduces eye strain, resulting in clearer vision and optimal color perception. "
It's a ridiculous analogy, since it makes no sense. Equivocation of a light bulb vs. a high-performance audio system is more than absurd; it's pathetic if claimed to be insightful.
He was being sarcastic not literal.
most folks don't preference their sarcastic comments with the word "actually".
You clearly don't recognize a complete tongue-in-cheek comment. Hook, line, and sinker! :)
As trolls go, you're a pretty funny one.
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