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In Reply to: RE: Agreed posted by airtime on October 05, 2016 at 09:49:48
Nope, no sub for me...
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I am in the same boat as you.
If you want BASS you're gonna have to get the big woofer. There just isn't any stinking way around that!!!!
Why do people insist on thinking if they just keep looking at a 6.5" woofer long enough that it will all work out with bass.
Never asked for 20Hz bass. But I believe 27-30Hz range possible with standard floorstanding loudspeakers. Good enough for me.
Yeah, I also favor large floor standers, with as much quality bass as I can get from them. I'm currently researching speakers to upgrade my aging Legacy Audio Signature II, which have three 10" woofers on them. They are rated down to 22hz, but even my smallish Outlaw LFM-1 sub outclasses them, as to deep bass impact and extension. And I have a very powerful amp connected to the Signatures.
Now, I am evaluating a set of the new Legagy Signature II, and they are clearly a much more advanced and better speaker, but may not reach as deep as my old Signatures. Seeing that the Legacy Focus SE can be had for around $3K more than the Signatures, I am going to check out the Focus.
The Legacy Focus SE is a different animal, with its two 12" woofers. I recently heard a two-channel system with Focus SE, and the bass was wonderfully prodigious, deep, and tight. My suspicion is that if you really want effective bass response down to 27hz, you are going to have to go to something along the lines of the Focus SE, or other speaker with 12" woofers.
Go over to Madisound and pull up the data sheet on any 6.5" woofer. They start rolling off at around 90-100z. At 30hz you're at -18db SPL. Even the manufactures that boost up their specs and even LIE say it's maximum range is 45Hz. And at 45Hz that's STILL -10db with a signal generator. Bass ain't happening Friend!
The measurements of a raw driver don't tell the whole story because they don't take into account the effect of whatever enclosure you're using (how it uses the backwave). There's one thing you can't get around, though, and that's that you must trade cone diameter for excursion and speakers get less and less accurate the more you move the voice coil.
Small drivers can theoretically go very low and some do go quite low. The problem is they can't do lows at high levels and then you couple that to the way our ears work(see Fletcher/Munson). Our ears are way down at very low frequencies at normal loudness levels. So you need lots of air movement to hear low bass even when it's there meaning you need lots of area on the bass drivers.
The human does not work like a SPL math formula. It works by physically being pushed by sound waves. At those frequencies you need a lot of air push.
As for distortion what about the effect of coherence using multiple drivers. That isn't any better than a single larger cone.
Like most things a trade off. It's easier to get a lower free air resonance in a big driver since the cone is heavier. But multiple drivers being smaller are easier to get rigid for reduced breakup and lots of voice coils, even if smaller, may handle more power. Then again longer throw is simpler on a large driver.
By the way for what it's worth I use an 18" driver. Then again the designer of my woofer in his next design used 2 10" woofers.
Ok then, it' NO SUB FOR YOU TWO WEEKS!!!!
No seriously, at least check out some of the vintage style speakers with large woofers. I really DO understand what you are saying. Check out something like JBL 4311 or JBL century L100. It will get you the bass you want and they are good speakers. That Mac 6700 and those speakers would be a real killer combo. It's like Mac was made for them. People just use them on 6.5" woofer speakers because that's what being sold now. And I really feel a lot of people are just convincing themselves "it's good - really!"
There is no replacement for the large surface area of a single low frequency driver. You want to rock?
Edits: 10/06/16
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