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tuneful Bass? What frequencies are covered? In order to achieve that tunefulness what exactly is done to the speaker?
The curves show a gentle slope of frequencies. I dont see any manipulation there to make it tuneful. So where do we see the special characteristic reflected in the tests? Perhaps higher frequencies are involved to add fragrance to the bass?
Does this post sound out of tune? Is this the right forum to post this I wonder.
I think tuneful bass is when the low frequency driver is fast and accurate and is blended well with the midrange driver. The effect is that the bass is fast, tight, articulate and seemless - and sounds like an instrument playing.
Once you hear it you certainly know when it's not there.
The bass guitar can come out of a soundstage just like any other instrument, and the bottom end should be neither lean nor boomy.
A good way to destroy tuneful bass is to have a room with a big suckout or "one note bass" phenomenon, or a room with bad resonances in wall panels or hvac ducts.
Just my two cents.
Tight or accurate I understand but fast makes no sense at all as the speed of sound is the same regardless of frequency.
Consequently bass cannot be 'fast' or 'slow' as the speed never changes, at least not within the same room/altitude.
slow bass. :o)
If you look at transient response of sealed, ported, isobaric and bandpass boxes you see increasingly worse transient response / group
Maybe that's why sealed box guys think of their bass as articulate and "fast". Fastest settling time for a given driver?
It's not a new term in audiophile speak and no worse than PRAT!! ;)
No term is worse than PRaT, that is complete BS.
Well, I don't get personally bent out shape about the term PRAT because I know exactly what they are talking about.
Sure, if you play a track on ten CDPs they will all take the same amount of time to play... philes are not suggesting otherwise.
But I've heard the difference between laid back systems that seem to slow down the music and more dynamic and articulate ones that seem to make the music... come to life. It's engaging and makes you tap your toes and want to listen to more and more music.
If that's PRAT, then I get it.
I prefer to use terms like articulate, engaging and dynamic.
Presto, some people's two cents is worth a lot more. Thanks.
The common musical scale and instruments all produce fundamentals down to 250Hz or below. (See link) Most of us in the audio reproduction world would call those frequency BASS frequencies. While many of us - and loudspeaker designers use woofer's to offer that range and higher. Some - would define the bass-midrange transition as low as 125Hz. Psycho-Acoustically, it might make sense to make the transition as high as 500Hz - where the critical bandwidth of human perception switches from constant bandwidths to constant percentage bandwidths. The wavelength - in normal sized playback environments - of these frequency are pretty long, however - the range affected by driver configuration and location - and speaker location with-in the room. Some designers believe satellite loudspeakers should ideally crossover as as high a 125-200Hz. Letting the woofer- subwoofer handle frequencies as high a 250Hz. I have had decent success with sidewall located subwoofers transitioning to mini-monitors or line sources based on 2 inch drivers at 150-200Hz. Then it is easier to tune the room so you get "tuneful base"
Three most important things in Audio reproduction: Keep the noise levels low, the power high and the room diffuse.
"Some designers believe satellite loudspeakers should ideally crossover as as high a 125-200Hz. Letting the woofer- subwoofer handle frequencies as high a 250Hz."
Talk about misconceptions, what's your source ("some designers")?
"I have had decent success with sidewall located subwoofers transitioning to mini-monitors or line sources based on 2 inch drivers at 150-200Hz."
While this supports your previous claim, I disagree with the notion of any speaker performing optimally near a room's boundary.
"Then it is easier to tune the room so you get "tuneful base"
Misconceptions makes it more difficult.
Tuneful is something someone came up with to describe a loudspeaker behavior
Accurate,and well damped bass is probably more proper in description
Some audiophiles tend to come up with adjectives to describe what they
Pretty much BS actually is what Tuneful is to describe the behavior
of a loudspeaker
You should be able to follow the bass melody played, for instance, on the pedal board of an organ. The notes should not sound muddy, or have a lot of overhang and ringing.
Contrast with a typical cheap subwoofer, which just goes "thump" with little or no pitch definition. That's fine for the HT knuckledraggers that just want to hear explosions go "boom," but really detracts from the appreciation of music with melodic bass content.
To get tuneful bass, it requires a careful balance of bass and volume. Lots of bass with not enough volume is no good, conversely, lots of volume and not enough bass is a possible problem too. I set the bass rich, then turn the volume down to the point when it all comes together. Very subjective but most of what we do in our hobby is subjective, unless you have a pocket protector and tape-loaded eyeglasses.
Freedom is the right to discipline yourself.
If I told you and you've never experienced it for yourself, it could be an exercise of futility. It might even be an aquired taste for the uninitiated.
"In order to achieve that tunefulness what exactly is done to the speaker?"
A practical way to grasp low frequency tunefulness is to play around with different sub woofers in various conditions (level settings, rooms, locations within the rooms, and various equalizations methods).
"Does this post sound out of tune?"
Can you hear me?
it's when you can easily follow the bass lines (bass melodies) rather than just "feeling" the bass notes
"Man is the only animal that blushes - or needs to" Mark Twain
that might be a characteristic of the tune rather than the system.
The West Coast "JBL" sound had a frequency bump in the bass guitar and vocal/lead guitar zones of the spectrum. This could be tuneful.
My Rogers LS3/5A had a bump at the bass, the famous(?) BBC manipulation. I didnt find that very tuneful. I thought the West Coast JBLs had loud bass but not very tuneful. An old Tannoy Westminster with one 12 inch driver had a mesmerising low end tune. I cant imagine a bookshelf speaker with a 50Hz low end having tuneful bass, not even a designer Pioneer.
The frequency manipulation the BBC used and was famous for was the so called 'BBC dip' at around 3kHz.
A slight dip in that region makes almost everything sound 'nice' as at elevated volumes that is where human hearing on average is the most sensitive.
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