 
|
Audio Asylum Thread Printer Get a view of an entire thread on one page |
For Sale Ads |
|
|
Audio Asylum Thread Printer Get a view of an entire thread on one page |
For Sale Ads |
205.188.116.7
I have a pair of Wavelength PF Gemini amplifiers currently driving my Medallion III/Lowther DX-4 speakers. I want to purchase another stereo or mono block 45 SET amplifier. However, this time I do not want to spend an arm and a leg. I was going to purchase the Yamamoto 45 SET ,but, just found out that the distributor is out of them and that Yamamoto has dicontinued the $2250.00 model and will introduce a $2800.00 version in five months or so (all this from the distributor). It figures, get positive reviews about what a great amp the Yamamoto is, and at a reasonable price, then jack the price up! Well, I aint goin for it this time. Are the other amps like the, Wright, DRD, Korneff, Etc...., as good sounding as the Yamamoto WAS? Will any of these reasonably priced 45 based SET's compete sonically with the Wavelength PF Gemini's?Lance A.
Follow Ups:
As the North American importer for Yamamoto Sound Craft, I wish that I could have responded to this post sooner, but it was submitted the very day I left for a week-long family vacation. Go figure!At any rate, the original, well-reviewed version of the Yamamoto A-08 has indeed been discontinued, and the last new production unit was sold a couple of weeks back. But the new version - the A-08S - begins shipping next week, and NOT in another five months (you must have misheard me, Lance).
The new A-08S will retail for $2750 including shipping. Granted, this is $500 more than the original version, but Mr. Yamamoto has upgraded the A-08 in several ways, including (1) switching from AC to DC heating, (2) going from a 5U4G rectifier to an 80 rectifier, and (3) adding a high-quality current meter to allow for checking the status of the output tubes.
Cheers,
Brian
Hello,what is the output-impedance of the new Yamamoto (8 or 16 Ohm)?
Thanks
Armin
The outputs are 8 Ohms.
Lance,I have had a Korneff 45 amp and 76/6sn7 pre for three years with Auris 2 speakers. Sounds great. I'm near Ft. Myers and you can come have a listen. I have no idea how it compares to Wavelength. I think Jeff can build it with 12sn7's and save you a lot of money chasing NOS.
Les
Les,Thanks for the offer. It will be nice to have two great sounding 45 set's on hand ,but, I am beginning to feel that having a second amplifer of a different design and sound may simply be more fun.
Lance A.
Khorns with swapped midrange of Altec 1005B Horns/288-16K drivers. Klipsch Tupe "A" crossovers.
Cut-Throat
some 2404H tweets and you will be "done" lol, tony
Jean-Francois Lessard 2A3 PP amp
Marantz 7T Preamp
Klipschorns w/ALK xovers
Sony CX350&CX-230 cd changers
MSB link DACIII w24/96k
MSB digital director
Luxman PD-272 TT
Technics M85 Cassette
A Friend of mine has these with the Altecs and KHorn Base. I have heard them, and I'm not sure it's a upgrade.There is probably a difference, but it's very small.
Cut-Throat
My ducane looks just like your altec but its made of copper how much is the altec horn worth?
The Altecs go for around $500 a pair give or take $100. The drivers are also in the same price range.
Cut-Throat
Glad you found something you like...
I guess you are near the highest level of good sound possible. It's a very high level.I tend to communicate my message to people who may not know what is really going on here.
What is really going on is that the sound achievement can be of the highest artistic level. The sound possible through sets ranks right there with the experiences possible with the best in art in other areas. Go to the Museum of Modern Art or the Met, go to the finest jazz clubs and hear the finest musicians, or just have extraordinary experiences with people. The sound that is coming through is right there with all of this.
This is what is going on the home stereo that I know. A sound that is satisfying artistically: that reaches the emotions, that piques the imagination, that fires up life. That wakes up music in the home.
I remember hearing the best in show sound at the stereophile show a few years ago. It was startling, interesting, alot of fun, etc. etc.. But it was not at the emotional level possible. Maybe the most important factor was missing.
Let's clear out the electronics and go as simple as possible, because we know it is there. Let's go ac on all the filaments and let's go with set tubes. Let's get with the opt's that have that grab, that can go right to the inner core of us where art touches.
We have to branch away from the fine high-end sound and pave the set sound. Raw, primitive, primal, live sounding, gutsy, immediate. Let's get away from the intellectual and cognitive. Let's go with the real, emotive and experiental.
What interests me is the deepest possible experiences possible. I want to look at Rembrants.
Sound is an incredible thing. High-end sound is delightful, but what is possible is way beyond delightful.
The 45 and the 300b are two of the great set tubes. And the others too. We hear things, we hear potential and possiblities and we want to explore that route.
I think you are asking what is out there. What is beyond what you have if there is anything.
I really don't know what these other manufacturers besides what you have are striving for, what they have discovered if anything, what they have to offer in the unique set arena, what ground they have covered and what ground they want to cover. Fi and Bottlehead are apparently good stuff, Korneff was pioneering in the past especially because of the promotion of the 45, don't know about now. I believe DIY is hitting territory that is pioneering.
Let's see how the next couple of years go and what is going to happen. I think more definitive understandings will pop up.
Hi John, how is everything with you. Did you recieve the package I sent with the Speakerlab build manule? I got my amp back from John and it sounds great. I am now just waiting for my Edgarhorns and I'll be in business. Cheers.
That Detroit Institute of Art(?)(is that the name of the museum?) is pretty cool. I was there in the early 80's.How does the sound compare to the art there? :)
Detroit had some great jazz record stores back then. I would go in there and just tell them to pick some good stuff for me. They knew there stuff and I still have the records I got there including one of the best, John Lewis and Bill Perkins (with Jim Hall)"2 degrees east, 3 degrees west."
I went to one or two of the Newport(?) jazz festivals downtown there then. By the river there, it was nice.
Yes i got it thanks.I got a pair of wooden Edgarhorns that i have some altec drivers attached to. Sounds heavenly, so I expect that the Edgarhorns ought to sound quite good.
Did you upgrade to the TJ tubes or anything else yet?
I have all three girls in college this year....all in differnt colleges. So I will not be upgrading any time soon. I was able to pay for my edgarhorns before the college bills came, thank god. I did blow one of the 26 tubes and replaced both of them. Other than that, John did a great job of referbishing. Cheers.
...for a university education.
I ain't putting my kids through college unless I get a percentage of their income after that.
I will not ask for a percentage from them, but I will just show up from time to time and crash in their spare bedroom and eat their food and not tell them when I am coming home. That will show them. Cheers.
Hi,This answer a somewhat hidden note further down:
http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/set/messages/40023.html
I thought it worthwhile promoting the answer up a few levels on the tree....
> This excersize is really about acquirng a sonically comparable back
> up. I had some visitors from out of town(Asylum members) this past
> week and realized that I had no backup amplification for our day
> long listening and comparative evaluation sessions. Let's face it,
> shit does happen to even expensive electronics. All I have on hand
> for amplification ,other than the Gemini's, is a big Pioneer Elite
> home theater receiver.Just as a note, YOU MAY find that you get more milage from buying a DIFFERENT Output Valve equipped Amplifier. I do like the 45 a lot, I also like the 300B loads but a 10/10Y/205 is another thing still and CAN be gotten to give about as much power as a 45.
So why not try a 10Y amp as complement to the 45's if you can live with low power or add a 300B (even one of the 300B+ aka. Super-300B) Amplifier for Mahler and Mussorsky?
Variety is the spice of life!
Ciao T
Hello T,
Can you offer any links to 10 based amp schematics? If not, can you give a 'verbal recipe' of a proven design? Thanks
David
Hi,I'm not going to look much.
Instead I am going to upload all my 10/10Y/801A/205 Schematics at my audiophile discussion group, this means you do have to join Yahoo groups, but then you can download the lot:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Thunderstone_audiophile/files/10 - 801 - 205 Schematics/
Ciao T
The 10y tube does have some nice attributes. I can hear its potential.But I also find it a little harsh and fatiguing after a while. A little too much pain with the pleasure for me.
Perhaps it's just a matter of a better 10y tube coming out in the market.
I had two 10y/300b amps converted to 10y output amps. Perferred this more and it is an interesting tube. But something is still not quite right over the long haul.
I do use another 10y/300b for center channel in the home theater because of its clarity.
Globe 10 or 801 instead?I prefer these to the 10Y.
I don't know how hard you run them, either, but that could make a difference. As would a good [parafeed] OPT. :)
Later
D
"Perhaps it's just a matter of a better 10y tube coming out in the market."I wouldnt' hold my breath on that happening anytime soon... 10s are old-stock only AFAIK and for the forseeable future. Still there are tons of varieties, so many good ones to choose from.
-Ed
I kind of wonder why the 10 tube family isn't more-commonly utilized in amp design... Is the tube difficult to design an amp around?I have a Moore 10 Squared... The thoriated triode has a HF clarity and refinement that I think is unmatched by any other audio signal amplification device... Including the 45...
Hi,> I kind of wonder why the 10 tube family isn't more-commonly
> utilized in amp design... Is the tube difficult to design an
> amp around?You need an output transformer with a 10K primary and you need ideally to be able to drive the grid a little positive, so difficult output transformer AND difficult driver stage. Too much for some.
Ciao T
The 10 family is a nice sounding bunch of tubes. I wished more amps were made using them.
Jack
...just not enough tube availability. No commercial manufacturer of any size (not counting Larry Moore, Josh, etc.) is going to make an amp for tubes that are only available as old-stock. Even the cheapest pair of NOS 10 variants (ST-shape 801As' probably) is going to run at least $100/pr or more, NOS. Good ones like globes, mesh plate, etc. - sky is the limit. $350/pr for good common globes like RCA, easily, up to $900+/pr for Perrymans when and if they ever show up again.Great tube though, I have 2 preamps that use it and may have more gear in the future too which uses it.
-Ed
They were pretty cheap when I had my 10 amps built. Most were less than $100/pair. I think I paid about $300/mp for NOS Cunningham 310s.
FWIW, I ended up prefering RCA 801As-they seemed to do everything better in my amps.
Jack
I use a 45, VT-52 or 183/483 :) All nice.
Ciao,A 10Y amp? Actually, something different is really not a bad idea. I prefer the 45 to the 300B and 2a3 and realy would feel like something was missing when I switched them out for my (old) Geminis.
However, I really enjoyed the hell out of my 845 set because it was so very different in sonic perspective. I never found myself comparing it to my 45 based amplifiers. Please, tell me more about great sounding alternatives to my exsisting 45 amps. That is really great advice. Instead of purchasing another 45 set as a back up to my Gemini's, why not have something on hand that offers a very different yet equally enjoyable perspective to my music. Now that I think about it, it is very likely that a 45 bacup amp would likely get very little playing time with the Gemini's in the room.
How and where would I find an amp such as you mentioned?Lance A.
You'll have to have someone build you a 10 amp-I don't think there are any comercially available. On the plus side, 10/10Y/801As are relatively cheap and plentifull, and rather different via brands/vintages so you can easily taylor the sound to your liking.
Jack
Hi,I am aware of several Japanese Kit's that are available assembled (Sun Audio and Sun Valley I can readily remember as currently available, SanEi used to have an 801A Kit, Softone has a more or less universal SE amp which takes the royal kissing cousin of the 10, the WE 205D).
And the new version of the DIYHiFisupply "Lady Day Plus" (which is available assembled and tailored to any Valve you care to specify) has got the ability to operate 10/10y's (among others), if with slightly lacking primary inductance on the output transformer, but not really any worse than some other Japanese kits/semi-kits on that count.
If you add a little NFB as per the San Ei circuit (6SL7 SRPP to 801A plus some loop feedback) the Lady Day Plus Kit would definitly be a good choice for a 10Y, in zero NFB you would need to go for one of the "hot & low" operating points, that is 350V/30mA instead of 425V/18mA.
Finally, I fancy it would not be TOO much of a stretch to modify a Decware Zen to use 10Y's....
Ciao T
The Sun kit was inexpensive, but took some changes. Gridchokes and changing coupling value helped alot. Still not in the same league as 10 driving 10 IT coupled.
Rob
Hi,> The Sun kit was inexpensive, but took some changes.
> Gridchokes and changing coupling value helped alot.
> Still not in the same league as 10 driving 10 IT coupledI would not think it would able to match that. There are some Issues I take with the Sun VT-25 Amplifier. With an HT of barely 350V or so it really needs more +B (around 460V are needed) or current must be increased, which would be beneficial IMHO as the Output transformer in that Amp could use both more inductance and impedance.
The Driverstage could also use some tyding up....
Still, gridchokes are good for the 10Y as it actually remains fairly high input impedance for Class A2, but still grid current rectification will throw the anode current off and with that already being low there is just not enough power.
If you would like to tinker a bit further and see how far that VT25 lark can go drop a line outside thf forum (maybe on DJ's Yahoo Group?).
Ciao T
.
I find my vt25 a perfect compliment to my 45. Seems more powerful than it really is. Why try to get the same thing you already have for less?
Rob
Rob,I agree. Ofcourse, I know less about 45 alternatives than I do 45 sets. But, I think that this is good common sense advice that I will likely follow. Maybe someone can build me an alternative?
Lance A.
Maybe Brian didn't provide you with the full picture, or perhaps you're just paranoid . . .If I heard him right, and unless something has changed, the new version will sport a Type 80 rectifier tube - a darn sight more rare than the 5U4, DC filament supply and a (gorgeous) Yamamoto meter (meters?), which retail for around $200 apiece as a part (including trim ring.)
Despite being the U.S. Audio Note importer, I own a Yamamoto A08 and make no secret of the fact that I think it is a terrific amplifier (particularly when driving Hi Eff AN speakers!) If the original version had been $4,000, I still would have been impressed. I'm quite sure the new version will be well worth $2,800, and I'm equally certain that neither Mr Yamamoto nor Brian are getting rich on it.
Keep your ears and your mind open.
Thanks, Dave!I'm pretty sure that I gave Lance the full picture during our phone conversation a couple of weeks back. On the other hand, he didn't strike me as being partciularly paranoid, so I'm not sure what gives here.
At any rate, the differences between the old A-08 and the new A-08S are indeed significant, as you have suggested. And no, neither Mr. Yamamoto nor I are about to get rich on this amp - and I can assure you that nobody's profit margin has shifted with the introduction of the new version!
Cheers,
Brian
Gang,First Lance did not pay retail for these amplifiers. He received a great deal on a couple of year old demo pair of amplifiers from ST. Celia Sound Galleries in Clearwater, FL. These are coming up on their 5th anniversary come April.
Teflon as used in the Yamamoto sockets does not deform with age. The only real issue with these is if you use tubes with differing pin sizes the sockets pins tend to expand. The present ceramic base units tubes such as used on TJ, EML, KR and others for some reason has a much larger pin size than the standard IEC UX4 type. Putting these in the Yamamoto's and then a NOS type tube will sometimes cause a problem because the ceramic based units have spred the sockets out so they do not have good contact. It is very easy and recomemended to use a small flat head screw driver between the teflon and the pin and bend them in a little to assure good contact with the NOS tube before starting up the amp again.
On a positive side the Teflon over the ceramic does reduce the microphoics of a tube. The Ceramic being too stiff tends to couple noise and vibration from the chassis to the tube. Whereas Teflon seems to insulate those.
AC heater question with 2A3/45... These tubes where designed with 2.5V filaments because it is very easy to get very low hum without using DC. I have built some 72 different 45 amplifiers over the years and have tried DC heaters, they never sound as good. I have found with 300B amplifiers that use DC heaters that I had to spend much more time with the design to get them too sound as good as 45 amplifiers.
In general something that was taught to me in college is very true and something that has saved me in design time immensly is this: "Try and determine what the engineer who designed the tube was trying to accomplish. Then use that tube in the same regard for best results."
So in the case of 45/2A3's I use ac heaters. In the case of Pentodes, I never strap them as triodes. Sure 300B's where meant to be used with AC heaters... but again they where developed in amplifiers for Voice of the Theaters and they expected you to be 50-100 feet away. Still to this day I remember seeing Gold Finger and after the show they pulled up the screen to my avail a VOT and on the table next to it a WE91 series amplifier. The smell of the slightly moldy smoke fill seats, the emotion of that moment is one I can remember to this day.
as for the 45/300b debate... man don't ask me... I finished some Ultimate 300B, then I made a Signature 45... if I had it my way and I could afford them both that would be my answer.
Well just back from NAMM have 80 emails to answer and need to get some product out.
Thanks
Gordon
J. Gordon Rankin
"Gang,
First Lance did not pay retail for these amplifiers. He received a great deal on a couple of year old demo pair of amplifiers from ST. Celia Sound Galleries in Clearwater, FL. These are coming up on their 5th anniversary come April."First, I have no idea why this information has relevance. I posted the retail purchase price of $6,000 for my PF Wavelength Gemini amplifiers to protect the no-discount pricing integrity of the manufacturer. Now the manufacturer wants to make an issue of what I actually paid. Alright (not that anybody really gives a rats arse). The dealer mentioned above brought several amplifiers to my home for auditioning. I decided to purchase the Gemini's because they dramatically outperformed the two 845 based set amplifiers. Brian offered me a deal on these amplifiers as a professional coutesy. I had been a hi end audio dealer in the Tampa area for a number of years. I then checked Mr, Rankin's site and realized that my units did not have hum pots on the back as the current models did. I contacted The dealer who ,only then, varified there demo status. I called Mr. Rankin who informed me that they were indeed models that he put together in 2001 but that he would offer his full manufacturers warranty. So, I decided to keep them, and had been enjoying them for just around a year. They were actually 3 year old demos when I purchased them as new.
As an audio dealer for eight years, I was never once confronted with a manufacturer who questioned honoring warranties on (not previously sold) demo units. If that were the case, then no dealer would ever open a single box for floor demonstrations. I am however convinved that Brian from Sound Gallery felt that I was aware of the Gemini's demo status. He is a very reputable dealer and a good guy from whom I have purchased many products since the purcase of my Wavelength Gemini's.Sorry about the temporary divergence. Back to the subject at hand.
Lance A.
test
Have you tried connecting Yamamoto directly? You can buy a kit, save some money, and experience the most interesting English in the world.
I went this route, and I'm VERY pleased by the results. I use the A8 with AER-MD3 fullrange speaker.
Buy a used unit on eBay (with decent iron), and have Don Allen (in Phoenix) modify it. I did this with a JE Labs SET amp (which was initially a 300B SET amp), and it gives my Larry Moore Ten Squared amp a run for its money.
Hi Lance,Where are you locate? If locate in US, I can ship you a J.C. Verdier 45 SET amp to audition. This 45 SET amp has switchable DC and AC heating. It is a stereo 45 SET.
Ming
Ming,"Where are you locate? If locate in US, I can ship you a J.C. Verdier 45 SET amp to audition. This 45 SET amp has switchable DC and AC heating. It is a stereo 45 SET.
Ming"
That is a very interesting offer. I live in the ,Tampa Florida, area.
I would be interested in discussing a possible home audition of the "J.C. Verdier 45 set amp" through email.To all thread participants: My purpose for seeking a second 45 based set amplifier is to make certian that I always have a functioning amplifier on hand. I recently had the fortune to entertain guests (forum members) for a long and very rewarding day. We listened to and compared several different high efficieny speakers, cables and other equipment. I realized that if something were to fail in one of my Wavelength amplifiers, then the party is over, because I have NO suitable backup amplifier.
I can't imagine what I would do without the generous help and advice from this forum and it's members. Thanks guys.
Lance A.
Sounds like very good advice ,but, I really have no idea what to look for.Lance A
Look for an amp with 5*4 tube rectification and brand-name transformers, such as Tango or Electraprint. A choke power supply is a plus as well. And classic octal or 9-pin driver tubes. Don will likely change out the rectifier section to run on a 6BY5 (which sounds better than any 5*4 rectifier) and the drivers to 6BQ7s. As long as it's a standard design, he'll convert it to magic. The amp can be either stereo or monoblocks.
I had Don Allen build me a simple 45. I liked it better than the upgraded version of my Wavelength Duetto. I eventually sold it but it was really really good and not much money. Lakerfan had this amp and he liked it quite a bit.
Hi,I know Gordon is again going to feel I'm busting his chops and is going to jump on this, but at least conceptually the closest alternatives to Gemini are Bottleheads 45 special Paraglow (output iron from the same maker and likely similar in spec, plus similar 2-stage circuit which you could even convert to a 417A in the driverposition) and the Welborne Labs DRD (again 2-Stage Circuit, but series feed, again a 417A could be "rolled into" the design with minimal effort).
Or youd go DIY. Gordon has posted quite extensively here (look for a post whose title begins with "brilliant SET Designers"), get your MQ Parallel Feed Iron from Bottlehead and you should be able to come to something that is not miles off sonically from what you have...
Ciao T
Thanks Ciao. I have decided that I am in need of a back up 45 SET amp for my Gemini's. I really want something that has the potential to sound as good. I am not certain if that is going to be possible with the kit amps that are available for under $2,000? Then on the other hand, I'm not sure what makes my PF Gemini's at $6,000 better sounding than say ,the DRD 45?
nt
Hi,> I really want something that has the potential to sound as good.
> I am not certain if that is going to be possible with the kit
> amps that are available for under $2,000?Well, if you look at the distribution and manufatcuring models, witrh Kit's you supply the labour and no dealer takes his cut, often not even on the Kit.
With commercial gear especially of the boutique sort you need to pay the guy who builds it (I don't work for 30 Bucks the hour and I doubt Gordon does) and then the final product is marked up by the dealer chain.
If a $ 2,000 Kit was sold as a commercial product using the normal distribution and sales arrangements and slightly improved cismetics it can easily turn into a $ 6,000 sale.
> Then on the other hand, I'm not sure what makes my PF Gemini's
> at $6,000 better sounding than say ,the DRD 45?I'm afraid you will have to listen. There is always the chance that to your ears the DRD may be the better choice.
Ciao T
Ciao,Good straight forward advice as always. I like the design of the DRD45. Ofcourse, this is predicated on my limited understanding of circuits. It appears that this design lessens the sonic influence from the power supply? Maybe allowing the use of one less tube without the usual ,solid state, power rectification nasties. See, I'm already in over my head.
Lance A.
Hi,> It appears that this design lessens the sonic influence from
> the power supply?Yes, this it does to a similar degree as Parallel Feed.
> Maybe allowing the use of one less tube without the usual ,
> solid state, power rectification nasties. See, I'm already
> in over my head.Difficult call. My experience with similar circuits suggest that valve rectification is still the best choice.
Ciao T
Ciao,Man this can get confusing. I think that my plan is to stick with tube rectification. I have had very limited experience with non tube rectified power supplies in tubed amps. As you verified, DRD and PF amplifier's are less sonically affected by the type of rectification, but, maybe affected none the less. I have been very pleased with the performance of my (old) PF Gemini's and am hopeing to add another amplifier to my set up that won't be embarrased by comparison. Thanks Ciao. Good to hear from you as always.
Lance A.
"I'm not sure what makes my PF Gemini's at $6,000 better sounding than say ,the DRD 45?"You are starting with he assumption that it does, you may find thats not the case. I heard what could well have been the best amp I have ever heard a few months ago, and it was a little 45 job. One of the things it had that went towards the sound was silver wound amorphous core transformers. $2000 may not stretch to a amp with those sorts of parts in but $3000 certainly would. Don't assume that people build their own to save money, in many cases its to get much more for the same money.
"I'm not sure what makes my PF Gemini's at $6,000 better sounding than say ,the DRD 45?"
"{You are starting with he assumption that it does, you may find thats not the case. I heard what could well have been the best amp I have ever heard a few months ago, and it was a little 45 job. One of the things it had that went towards the sound was silver wound amorphous core transformers. $2000 may not stretch to a amp with those sorts of parts in but $3000 certainly would. Don't assume that people build their own to save money, in many cases its to get much more for the same money.}"I agree 100%, not considering readily available finances as a construction variable. Plus, if I were to attempt such a project, my goal would be for the unit to WORK and not catch the house on fire. It would take years for me to gain the knowlege required to build a better machine, not just a functioning one.
Lance A.
I have Fi 2A3 mono amps. You can use 45s in these amps by swapping rectifier tubes. I also have Wavelength Cardinal X-1s, and these amps are equally as musical in a different way: the Cardinals are cap-coupled, have a bigger soundstage, and have better bottom end. The Fi amps are direct coupled, sound more intimate, and more natural. I'm not sure if this has to do with the 300B vs 2A3 vs 45. I wish I knew how the Cardinals compare with the Geminis. Read the 6Moons review.
Having owned both the Gemini's and the Cardinal X2's, the current Cardinals are every bit as good as the Gemini's and, in my personal opinion, better them. Absolutely no stereotypical 300B sound from the current Cardinals. Real gems.
Jeffm, How would you characterize the Cardinals? What's your preamp?BTW, I looked up your posts thinking you may have made comments about them elsewhere. Didn't find that but I did find a post by you to me about the WA Brick DAC. I don't think I ever saw it before today! Gordon is coming up with a headphone amp/USB DAC that I plan on purchasing. It will also have a preamp out and a S/PDIF digital in as well.
Thanks!
Budrew -I knew this was going to come from someone . . . I probably should put together a review of some sort. But they are not easy to write. Anyway, to answer your questions:
1. Characterize the Cardinals - To keep it short, the new Cardinals are like the Gemini's but on steroids. They have the immediacy and neutrality of a 45 except with a fuller, richer sound spectrum (no, not romantic or bloated at all.) I really didn't think that a 300b could sound like this until I heard them. BTW, the tube complement is: TJ 274 rectifier, Electro Harmonix 6C45PI driver/input, and new WE 300B's. I can't comment on earlier versions of the Cardinal since I have never heard them.
2. Preamp - Wavelength Sine.
There is something to be said of course for synergy between components and I am probably benefiting from having both amps and preamp made by the same manufacturer. I have run across this before with other manufacturers and, as you well know, Audio Note also makes a strong case for this as well. Hope your AN system is working out well . . .
BTW, this goes back to some old posts, Gordon's Cosine DAC does change character quite a bit depending on what tube you have in it. He sent me a small assortment of tubes and the sound went anywhere from back of the hall and veiled to front of the hall with a ton of immediacy.
Thanks. I have not used the WA Cosine in a while. Over the next few weeks I plan to try it with the new AN CDT2 II transport. But I'm more excited about the USB DAC notion. Very convenient! Even my wife is into it. She's discovered iTunes and any album on demand and thinks CDs are too much of a hassle now.Your description of the Cardinal sounds very intriguing.
If only my wife were computer literate . . . the idea of another computer in the house, or even running a network line from our office to the family room/listening room, is really too much for her. She is more of the artistic type and, while she very much appreciates the 'ol stereo system, she does draw the line at her idea of too much technology. It is a shame since I have iTunes installed at work and at home and will be getting a Shuffle this week.The Cardinal X2's are a real suprise and are incredibly good. I wouldn't have believed it unless I heard it. Not your father's 300b! They are worth a serious audition.
How is your system working out so far?
Jeff
The Audio Note system is very good. I'm only missing one AN cable and in its place I'm using something dirt cheap. It seems to take an enormously long time to get components and parts out of England, and I'm still waiting to have the Meishu repaired, which arrived with a buzzing transformer.Before the Meishu I was using a deHavilland amp from another system. The deHavilland is more dynamic with very, very good PRAT. A lot of fun to listen too. The Meishu sounds very slightly more natural, but lacks the dynamics and pace and timing. The deHavilland ebbs and flows with the music, keeping up with the natural pace of the musician, while the Meishu just flows, seemingly glossing over the pacing. For whatever reason these differences make the deHavilland more engaging and interesting. It has more life and presence to it.
Besides the Meishu the AN speakers, cable, and digital, especially the transport, are excellent. The Meishu's not bad at all, I think I'm just looking for something different that it isn't designed to provide.
Anyway, because of the time issues with AN and because I feel there is something missing in the amp I'm interested in hearing other 300Bs, which is a tube I like. I've dealt with Gordon in the past and his products get very high regard, and he's responsive to customers. I'm keen on his designs that combine the digital (and USB DAC) into the amplifier. His new headphone amp with the DAC will have a pre-out too. I still love the deHavilland (they are very responsive too!), but the tubes are big and run very hot and with little ones in the picture someday I'm concerned about it. Plus, I want to explore the 300B more.
So... in a nutshell it's doing great, but I don't think my journey is over yet : )
Thanks for the update on your system and I hope you find what you are looking for. I was curious as to how the Audio Note gear was working out since it has always had very good reviews. If my local AN dealer had ever been able to get his act together (which he never did), I might have gone down that path for a while myself.Gordon's Ultimate line certainly has my attention as well (if you can afford it). I don't know how well the Cardinal X2 sound translates into the Ultimate series but I have to believe that it is at least as good. I just haven't heard anything from the Ultimate series yet. I think that you really do need to give one of Gordon's 300B's a try since my experience with the X2 puts the new WE 300B's in a completely different light. And in a very good way.
I may try putting together a longer description/post on the X2 since I think it really stands out as something different and very, very good.
Jeff
I'll look forward to your X2 commentary. There is in fact a local WA dealer so hopefully I can get some exposure soon, though it sounds like he focuses on the lower power amps. My AN dealer has been great, fantastic in fact. He does what he can to nudge them and has provided a lot of help in working the system to its potential.
Shakey, thanks. I will check out the FI's.Lance A
Hi--I've owned 3 Korneff amplifiers (monoblock and stereo 45s) and they are excellent!
Unfortuantely, they don't come close to the Yamamoto A-08 Sig. 45 amplifier.
In fact, there's such a difference that I sold my last Korneff to buy the Yamamoto!!!
The Yamamoto's design and components such as custom hand wound Yamamura transformers, DC heating, Teflon sockets, etc. are tough to beat at any price.
"Hi--
I've owned 3 Korneff amplifiers (monoblock and stereo 45s) and they are excellent!Unfortuantely, they don't come close to the Yamamoto A-08 Sig. 45 amplifier.
In fact, there's such a difference that I sold my last Korneff to buy the Yamamoto!!!
The Yamamoto's design and components such as custom hand wound Yamamura transformers, DC heating, Teflon sockets, etc. are tough to beat at any price.'
I thought that the Yamamoto (the one that is now supposedly defunct) was AC heated. According to the distributor ,From Lansing Michigan, the new upgraded version of Yamamoto's 45 SET will be DC heated and have a few other upgrades that will raise it's cost to at least $2,800.
I was planning to order the Yamamoto yesterday ,but, was told that it is no longer available and the replacement will not be out for months.
The distributor also said 'with enthusiasm' that it had been suggested to him that he should sell the Yamamotos for more than $5,000!
Bring a product to the market at a price point so much lower than it's perceived value, get glowing reviews about how underpriced the units are for their sonic value, generate inflated demand, change the product slightly, raise the price, sell many of the more expensive and more profitabe units from the ferver derived from the much better valued earlier product. Not only that ,but, make the product unavailable for the right amount of time to drive up the supply demand ,now I gotta have it, mentality of people like me.
Ofcourse, this is just my theory. But if the shoe fits?
Anyway, I see where Mr. George Wright (One of the coolest gentelman I have talked to) uses Sowter transformers that are also hand made. I understand that Electroprint transformers are designed and made specifically for audio as well. So, what makes the Yamamura transformer much better sounding than either of these examples. Other than that, many manufacturer's can and do utilize Yamamoto Teflon Tube Sockets, and at least equal quaality active and passive parts. So, what could make the Yamamoto 45 based SET sound better than Wavelength, Wright, Korneff, DRD, Etc..... amplifiers? Could it be partially hype that it comes from Mr. Yamamoto in Japan, and or that it just looks better than most of the other low priced contenders and costs way less than the Wavelength equivalents?
I mean, there was hardlry anything to the (now discontinued) Yamomoto 45 SET amplifier. So, what makes it better sounding ,or, is it alot of hype? Is the circuit a new breakthrough design that transends the other 45 SET's on the market? Is it as simple as the Yamamura transformers are somehow that much better sounding than everything else?For that matter, why the hell did my Wavelength PF Gemini amplifiers' cost $6,000!?
Lance A.
Hi Lance,I can recall our phone conversation from a couple of weeks back - it was quite cordial, although I do remember that you were a bit disappointed that the last of the original Yamamoto A-08 amplifiers had just been sold.
But I simply cannot understand the misinformation and animosity contained in the above post. To be specific:
1) "I was planning to order the Yamamoto yesterday, but, was told that it is no longer available and that the replacement will not be out for months."
Actually, the replacement (the A-08S) begins shipping next week. I have known for quite a while that the new A-08S would become available in early August, and have never said otherwise.
2) "The distributor also said 'with enthusiasm' that it had been suggested to him that he should sell the Yamamotos for more than $5,000!"
Lance, you asked me over and over again if I thought that the A-08 was REALLY worth $2250, and I eventually wound up sharing an anecdote about a fellow importer who told me that this amp could easily sell in the U.S. if it cost TWICE as much, given its sonics and built quality. But I ALSO told you that I would never consider such a move - my goal is to sell Mr. Yamamoto's products in the U.S. for as close to their Japanese factory-direct pricing as possible, even though this means a rather slim profit margin for myself.
3) "Bring a product to the market at a price point so much lower than it's perceived value, get glowing reviews about how underpriced the units are for their sonic value, generate inflated demand, change the product slightly, raise the price, sell many of the more expensive and more profitabe units from the ferver derived from the much better valued earlier product. Not only that ,but, make the product unavailable for the right amount of time to drive up the supply demand ,now I gotta have it, mentality of people like me."
Lance, do you truly believe this, or is this simply a case of sour grapes?
Cheers,
Brian
I would give Jeff a call. His amps are custom built. If you want to use more expensive components you have to pay for it. I'm sure the time and materials that go into Wavelength amps are worth it too. If you want it all for less than $2000 you have to DIY. That's alot of time and experience to invest first.
Rob
The 45 amps made by Jeff Korneff are very special and have had rave reviews here. Check out the reviews in the Review section. Jeff can be reached at trypower@msn.com or check his website at http://groups.msn.com/korneffvacuumtube/_whatsnew.msnwHe also makes a great 6SN7/76 preamp that is quite excellent.
Rick, Thanks for the Korneff suggestion. Is there a product web site other than the Yahoo group page?Lance A.
Jeff Korneff is not really a manufacturer, but rather an enthusiast who makes very high quality amps and preamps on a custom order basis. I have had both a 45SE amp and a 6SN7/76 preamp made by Jeff. The craftsmanship is of the highest quality and the look rather industrial, but clearly overbuilt to last a long time. Check out the picture gallery on his website to see what they look like. Jeff has more or less standard formulas for his designs, but he changes some aspects from time to time and is willing to build you a piece with variations that you might want. The best thing to do is to read the reviews and search AA for various people’s comments, then get in touch with Jeff to discuss the details of a design. Since I don’t have much knowledge of amp design, I just went with his standard design, which sounded great.
This post is made possible by the generous support of people like you and our sponsors:
Top of Page ]
[ Contact Us ]
[ Support/Wish List ]
[ Copyright © 2025, Audio Asylum, all rights reserved ]
