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In Reply to: RE: Is there anyone here who can muster a hypothesis for why the ground loop on speaker wires works? posted by tomservo on January 09, 2013 at 16:40:53
I use the LP filter (Detail Magnifier) at my speaker terminals and also have no radio station near me (about 20 miles and low power, over 70 miles to a 50KW station or TV station) and adding the ground loops a few weeks ago made improvement.
ET
Amps: CJ MF2500A, MF2100
Follow Ups:
Awe-d-o-file, you commented :-
> > > "I use the LP filter (Detail Magnifier) at my speaker terminals and also have no radio station near me (about 20 miles and low power, over 70 miles to a 50KW station or TV station) and adding the ground loops a few weeks ago made improvement." < < <
To which unclestu replied :-
> > > "RFI can also come from cell phones and wi fi devices, too, you know....." < < <
One has to ask the questions :-
HOW did applying the ground loops give an improvement to the sound - i.e to the musical orchestral score of (say) Dvorak's New World, radio station nearby or not nearby ?
If not RFI from a radio station, HOW did the ground loops 'deal with' such as the (suggested by unclestu) RFI from cell phones and wi fi devices to give an improvement to the sound i.e to the musical orchestral score of (say) Dvorak's New World ?
Before the ground loops were fitted WHY were those improvements to the sound i.e to the musical orchestral score of (say) Dvorak's New World not experienced ?
WHAT is the supposed RFI from cell phones and wi fi devices doing to the musical orchestral score of (say) Dvorak's New World, prior to fitting the ground loops, for the improvements in the sound not to have been heard before ?
I do not dispute that there can be an 'influence' from cell phones and wi fi devices and from many other RF, electromagnetic, chemical sources which can affect the 'sound', I am just interested as to WHERE unclestu (and others) think that 'influence' is having it's effect on the 'sound' i.e. on the musical orchestral score of (say) Dvorak's New World.
Would the people who describe hearing an improvement in their sound after fitting such as the ground loops describe the improvement as "resolving more of the musical information" ?
Regards,
May Belt,
Manufacturer.
The last sentence you wrote in your post "covers" what many might say word for word or in other ways regarding the implementation of that particular tweak or other tweaks that make an improvement.
I do like to understand why and how things work. I've been a bench tech and I repair and restore old tube radios and a lot of (but not all) my audio and ham gear. I still can't really conceive of a reason for the loop tweaks working and that's OK. I feel like understanding why would be the booby prize compared to the items benefit in my system which to me is the true prize.
So are we back to the old subjectivist v objectivist argument? No I don't think so nor have I ever really felt that this is as much of an issue as the difference in those that can really hear and those that cannot hear well at all or as well. That's my experience after giving many sound demos and summing up the listeners reactions over four decades.
ET
> > > "I've been a bench tech and I repair and restore old tube radios and a lot of (but not all) my audio and ham gear." < < <
Oh, Awe-d-o-file, that brings back distant memories for me.
I have worked alongside Peter for the past 60 years. He started his working life as a radio engineer repairing valve radios just after the second world war. I was by his side when he built his first Mullard 510 valve amplifier. I was by his side when we opened our first retail audio equipment/radio spares shop in the 1950s and my Saturday job was testing valves for customers on a Mullard valve tester. We were in the audio industry in and from the early days when everything was valves (before transistors) and everything was mono (before stereo) !!!!
> > > "So are we back to the old subjectivist v objectivist argument? No I don't think so" < < <
I don't think so either. I think there are sufficient people who have experienced such pleasure from the music they enjoy listening to being much better resolved to have some meaningful discussions. They KNOW what they heard !!
Regards,
May Belt,
Manufacturer.
You and your other half sound like the perfect team.
Edits: 02/21/13
> > > "You and your other half sound like the perfect team." < < <
Yes, we are. And I have learned a tremendous amount over these past 60 years.
Regards,
May Belt,
Manufacturer.
Cheers and thanks for the reply. I don't choose to receive email notifications of threads anymore and on occasion forget to recheck a thread. My apologies and best wishes.
ET
RFI can also come from cell phones and wi fi devices, too, you know.....
Stu
Sure, I keep those unplugged and cells which don't work here at my property are also off. I recently added a Squeezebox and it requires a PC be "on" which is about 60 feet away and the router is probably 20 feet away and I honestly hear no difference when it's on. Perhaps that has to do with my having already added LP filters? Who knows.....................
ET
are your neighbors?
Stu
Probably a quarter mile or more. I can't receive their wi-fi - already tried that as a test. My guess is their cordless phones wouldn't work here either if they have them. There are 5 acre lots in this development and there are lots in between the next houses to me. Probably 6 houses in the square mile in which my house resides.
ET
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