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In Reply to: RE: Linear Power Supply or Battery on Mac Mini - pics posted by AbeCollins on December 21, 2014 at 18:27:01
Abe,
I would put a good low impedance cap across the battery. I use these types in my Crimson and they are a bit noisey. Then I would put a common mode choke then another cap right before the connector.
Really the big problem here is that the supply after it enters the computer is put into DCDC hell with probably 15 or so different power supplies. Core voltages down in the 0.9-1.1v range, then LV at 1.5-1.8, then IO at 3V3, then 5V for SATA drives (probably 4 of those), 5V for each USB, +12V for Firewire. Then a whole bunch more for display port, thunderbolt if you have it and other various peripherals.
Really we need an audiophile motherboard... oh I did do that ounce. way to expensive to make for DIY. People don't have any problem spending $1K on cables, but they would rather spend $70 on a motherboard. Oh well!
Thanks,
Gordon
J. Gordon Rankin
Follow Ups:
.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Not sure what you are referring to. Others are now making what, audiophile motherboards?
.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
I have just read a test of 4 motherboards Asus, MSI etc designed with isolated audio sections running the same Realtek onboard chip. There are measurements and SQ assessments.
The dynamic range varies by 10 dB and the output opamps range from 4580 to 1620s. All different.
Would you use motherboard onboard audio in your system?
.
s
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
The Sonre website looks a little light on details. I could be wrong but I didn't see anything to indicate that they have actually designed and manufacture their own 'audiophile computer motherboard' from scratch.
Light on details? Are you serious??? They provide more detail about the Rendu models than most manufacturers provide for 6 figure components.
"What makes the Rendu different from a computer music servers is that it's a purpose built audiophile device. The problem with computer music servers is that they all rely on mass produced mother boards designed for general purpose computing and are built to the lowest possible price point. The Rendu solves this problem by removing the consumer grade computer peripherals and switching mode power supply from the equation. The Rendu's main board has been specifically built for processing audio signals perfectly."
Of course there is no way they can fabricate their own motherboards in small quantities. You know this. However, just like companies who make very expensive speakers don't use off the shelf tweeters, they have them made to very high tolerances to their specific specifications, and are not available to others as a commercial product. Same applies here I bet.
So I'd like to see the insides of their purpose built audio device. Does it use a motherboard or not? Is it one of the standard PC form factors? Do you know? Does their website specifically say?
I talked to them via telephone.
It obviously is not common PC "form factor" as it has no video section, no PCI bus/slots, no USB bus, a custom linear PSU, no capacity to install an internal HD, or no input bus.
The pictures of the item shows all of this quite clearly.
Why do you have such a huge investment in asserting that these are all PCs, when their purpose is the anti-thesis of such: and they don't contain the actual functions of a multi-purpose PC? Are you trying to say that because they contain circuit boards, a processor chip, can access files via ethernet, and can run a limited type/amount of software, that they must somehow be (sound/behave) the same as what you can de-construct/modify a multi-purpose computer to be?
Should you not be calling your TV a computer? Should you not be calling the OPPO universal players PCs?
Why are you so angry and ferociously stubborn? You're like the climate change deniers, unreasonably rejecting plain & clear evidence.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Let's see this so called "evidence".
Experimental results required here. Analysis opinions only welcomed if data is presented along with it.
What you, Al Gore, the president, my state Governor and others seem to be missing is the fact that luckily all voters not stupid enough to blindly take a bunch of known liars for their words. All you have to do is convince the voters you aren't just making it all up. Easy huh? Show us the evidence. You're approach of calling any nonbelievers idiots without ever attempting to explain why will never work.
Evidence: Does it have a video port built into the mainboard? Yes or no?
Evidence: Does it have an USB bus? Yes or no?
Evidence: Does it have an ESATA or any HD bus? Yes or no?
Evidence: Can you load an OS on it? Yes or no?
Evidence: Can you browse the Internet? yes or no?
Evidence: There is less measured ice this year than their was 5 years ago at this same location? Yes or no?
""Experimental results required here. Analysis opinions only welcomed if data is presented along with it.""
WTF!!!!!! Nothing in the definition of the word evidence requires experimentation. Do you really need to "experiment" and try to plug in a male 15 pin "D" connector to the back of a box that has no corresponding 15 pin "D" female connector?
Hello! Why would you associate me with Al Gore, & the POTUS? Are you calling me a liar? What makes you think that I am something called a "believer?" Especially since I'm advocating the application of scientific investigation, and deduction?
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Why do you have such a huge investment in asserting that these are all PCs,
I don't.
However, there are many such 'audiophool' products disguised as dedicated audio devices that DO in fact use standard off the shelf PC motherboards. We've uncovered and discussed many such products here in the Asylum.
First.....What characterizes an "audiophool" product?
How can it be worse than a piece of Shite MAC mini, with a junk & inconsistent USB bus, crappy power supply, noisy hard drive, noisey video section, and other items like USB input buses etc etc etc...
As far as a basis for good sound, an off the shelf PC or MAC can't be any worse for audio.
I agree that a product that like auriliti DOES have an off the shelf mainboard, - but it's one of the few. And there's still no capacity to add HID devices.
MOST IMPORTANTLY, - "we" "you" have not heard ANY of these devices, - so NOTHING has been exposed.
1. There's only one device that has an "off the shelf" mainboard.
2. Besides the mainboad, their are several other elements (functions), to a PC/MAC that have a great potential to be detrimental to good sound.
3. There's no logical and reasonable basis for calling a device "audiophool" because....
A). Almost all of them are cheaper than modifying a computer, and start out with better components beyond the mainboard.
B). You, or "those" who are asserting this wholly unreasonable position HAVE NOT HEARD ANY OF THEM, - to make the assessment of "inferior audiophool" devices.
C). Sim Audio, Bryston, are in no way considered, "scam" "audiophool" companies.Finally: A mainboard doesn't make a multifunction computer, - it also requires an HID, it requires an OS, it requires the ability to install run software. My TV, CD player, Universal video/SACD player, squeezebox, & refigerator all have "mainboards." Some of those mainboards are more "computer-like" than the Sonore. The Sonore can't go out and browse the internet and download apps.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Edits: 12/26/14 12/26/14
First, I never said any of these products were scams or inferior.
My point is that many 'audiophools' somehow think that these 'dedicated' audio devices are somehow special when in fact many of them DO use standard off the shelf motherboards.... the same motherboards that many here use in their PC audio setups. Fact.
So some folks enjoy tweaking their PCs for better sound. How is that different than a manufacturer who tweaks a PC motherboard and OS for you?
And lastly, no need to go crazy ballistic.
Is that your way of dismissing my points without addressing them? I am perfectly calm about it, what specifically have i written that leads you to call my post(s) ballistic? Quote?
1. A mainboard does not a computer make.
2. Very few people are buying these products, (yet), they're too new, and there's only about 5
3 With the exception of the Sonore: The "tweaks or changes made by both are not done to the board that contains the processor.
As we've seen with transports in the past, lots matters, (the quality of the parts, wire, power supplies, case, connectors, vibration damping, simplicity of signal path. Many of these important elements are not present in a complete consumer computer, and impossible to add/change.
Especially on modern PCs, the network card, USB bus, hard drive bus, video adapter, are ALL built right in the mainboard.
I contend that an "audiophool" is a closed minded person who makes assumptions about a particular product without listening to, and/or comparing it to other items and shells out more money than they normally would.
What specific people and products are you talking about here? You started making the claim of "audiophool" products, back it up with specific products and people.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
What have I said in my previous two posts to you that are NOT true?
I don't need to address every one of your points and answer them all as we've gone through this before.
well, just about everything you said is not truei have not gone ballistic
These are blatantly not off the shelf PC mainboards
None of these devices meet the definition of audiophool devices
what have i said that isn't true?
Yes, we've been over this and you're wrong. These are facts. You haven't addressed them. You can't just change the definition of something because you personally don't happen to like one of the things. It's like trying to say that a particular chair is not a chair because you happen to not like it: all the while, someone is sitting on it. Just because most new TVs have a NIC card, can browse the Internet, has an OS that runs apps, has a mainboard that is even closer to a PCs mainboard: doesn't mean that we call it a PC.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Edits: 12/28/14 12/28/14 12/28/14
Here's a summary of what I said. What here is not true?
------------
So I'd like to see the insides of their purpose built audio device. Does it use a motherboard or not? Is it one of the standard PC form factors? Do you know? Does their website specifically say?
------------
Why do you have such a huge investment in asserting that these are all PCs
I don't.
However, there are many such 'audiophool' products disguised as dedicated audio devices that DO in fact use standard off the shelf PC motherboards. We've uncovered and discussed many such products here in the Asylum.
------------
First, I never said any of these products were scams or inferior.
My point is that many 'audiophools' somehow think that these 'dedicated' audio devices are somehow special when in fact many of them DO use standard off the shelf motherboards.... the same motherboards that many here use in their PC audio setups. Fact.
So some folks enjoy tweaking their PCs for better sound. How is that different than a manufacturer who tweaks a PC motherboard and OS for you?
And lastly, no need to go crazy ballistic.
-------------
""Does it use a motherboard or not?""
A motherboard does not necessarily a PC make.
& a motherboard is not the only component that makes a "dedicated" audiophile product. Would you like me to define that? But, - you can pretend to not know, but everyone here knows that you are yourself are building your own linear power supply, - taking some step(s) toward a dedicated audio product.
""Is it one of the standard PC form factors?""
Of course it isn't and you know it is. A rasberry Pi is not: nor is a squeezebox. The only one that it might be in this group of five is the Auriliti.
Again, if it can't function as a PC, is only used for one of the things that a PC is designed to do, (and vastly improves on that), then it can't be called a PC, - even if the mainboard was remotely similar in some limited aspects.
How does calling my responses to you qualify as going "ballistic." Because I am calling you out on being wrong, and you can't admit it, your are deflecting the subject away from the subject?
"We've uncovered and discussed many such products here in the Asylum."
That is simply not true. Cite 1.
""Does their website specifically say?""
You trust everything I write as being the absolute truth? right? (LOL)
Does Oppo's, Does Logitech's? Interesting how Oppo, Logitech, Sonos, and MSB are not called PCs either. I guess that everything with a mainboard & a NIC card is a PC? I think that I call it an amplifier: since we're being arbitrary... LOL.
""My point is that many 'audiophools' somehow think that these 'dedicated' audio devices are somehow special when in fact many of them DO use standard off the shelf motherboards.""
Who are you calling an audiophool? Please be specific. I don't know what you mean by "special," but even if they did use standard off the "shelf motherboards" the other components surrounding the motherboards make them vastly better than PCs, and are very important to SQ: especially when taken together. (Do you need me to list them, or are you forgetting about what you're doing to make your own MAC, - not a MAC: i have a feeling that I'll be waiting forever for an answer to that one).
Cherry pick time, oh: why don't you accuse me of being hysterical too, that will provide another cover to not addressing the issue at hand.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
I fundamentally made the comment that many of these so called dedicated audio products use standard off the shelf motherboards. Maybe not the products that you are so in love with, but many do. What's not true about that? I've seen many such products and we've discussed them here.
Also, if you are so vehemently anti "computer audio" why do you keep posting here? Perhaps the more generic "Digital" forum is a better place for your dedicated audio appliances?
P.S. Where do you get the idea that I'm building a linear power supply? I haven't built one for years.
""standard off the shelf motherboards"" ""What's not true about that?""They are not "off the shelf" You can't buy a rasberry Pi "off the shelf" You can't buy the modified Bryston board off the shelf, - it is custom. The Sim Audio mainboard is available off line. And, the Sonore & the Auralic Aries are mainboards custom built and not capable of being purchased by an end user.
...something that you can't seem to comprehend, a PC needs much more than a mainboard before it is considered a PC/computer.
""vehemently anti "computer audio" why do you keep posting here?""I am not vehemently anything.
Chris told us that this forum is to be used for ANY and ALL discussions on digital file playback. And, you are equally Anti-computer, as you're in the process of turning your computer into "not-a-computer."
We should also be posting here, and posts have been moved here from digital relating to Squeezeboxes, Oppo digital file playback, etc.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Edits: 12/29/14 12/29/14
They are not "off the shelf" You can't buy a rasberry Pi "off the shelf"
I bought mine off the shelf from Amazon. And I used a couple different OS's on it including OpenELEC .
You can't buy the modified Bryston board off the shelf, - it is custom. The Sim Audio mainboard is available off line. And, the Sonore & the Auralic Aries are mainboards custom built and not capable of being purchased by an end user.
So? Did I say they were? No, I said many such products DO use off the shelf motherboards. Is that incorrect?
...a PC needs much more than a mainboard before it is considered a PC/computer.
I'm not arguing that point. Where did I say anything contrary to that?
We may have different distinctions between off the shelf/and PC mainboards.We have already shown that the Rasberry PI is so difficult to use a PC, - that we might as well say that it can't.
The Razberry Pi is a speciality audio USB mainboard that a consumer can buy.If you call that audio board purchase "off the shelf" I'll be happy to concede that good point.
The other "off the shelf" mainboard which is a better example actually, -is the Auraliti: that has a video card, NIC, card, hard drive, runs Linux.
The Bryston, Sonore, Aries, Squeezebox, streamers (mainboards) can't be bought by the consumer.....
Cheers,
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Edits: 12/29/14 12/29/14
Is this an audiophile product?
Do you have any thought of your own? Are you willing to examine evidence that leads to reasonable deductions based on its veracity?
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
I asked you a simple question....
Either yes...? or no...? Do you have an answer?
You comment makes no sense at all.
I asked two questions.
Your question made no sense at all.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Then it shows your real intent. Have fun... smh Do not have time for bull shit... sorry.
for bullshit, - why did you post off topic?
Or is it just that you don't like having your own crap thrown back at you?
To start a new subject: create a new post by selecting the Post Message button.I don't have time, sorry....
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Edits: 01/07/15 01/07/15
Exactly on topic. Some keep talking about motherboards and their pedigree and how t relates to sound quality.... The board in the PogoPlug is being used in highly touted streamer.
Everything is not as simple as it seems. You can often put a pedestrian item in a pretty box, slap a big name on it and everyone goes nuts! Like ST who loves the Bryston stuff. I actually never heard a Bryston product that sounded that great IMO. And that goes back to the 70s. The amps were always dry and two dimensional to me. I still often get that feel from their stuff. YMMV...
This discussion was about 2 things: which I can't see how could possibly be muddled.1. Does the Sonore Rendu use a custom built mainboard from Switzerland that is designed only around playing back digital files?, (streaming from a NAS).
(The answer to that is an indisputable yes: for the reasons cited, & what the manufacturer told me: why would he lie when one can clearly see it)?Does it sound better because of it? I hope to know soon.
2. Gordon said that he thought about building an "audiophile" mainboard but he didn't think that he'd get enough interest. I speculated that because the Sonore was a custom built mainboard that only had 1 or 2 things in common with a PC: (no USB bus, no ESATA or HD bus, no I/O capabilities, no video, no PCI, etc), and the fact that the manufacturer told me about the other aspects/parts, (linear PSU, internal damping, connector quality, processor topology, proprietary SPDIF as the only output, etc) that this was more in line with what Gordon was talking about.
The Apple TV, and the Squeezebox, and the Sonore, all are streamers. They have more in common with each other, (and an Oppo), than they do with a typical MAC or PC computer.
I do not know if I would call the PogoPlug an audiophile device. I would probably say no, because its main purpose: it does not have many of the elements required to make it a high performance audio playback device.
I did not know that it had a board in it that was common to a streamer. I would call the SBT an audiophile device because it (playback) is improved considerably by using the digital out, using an aftermarket PSU, defeating the screen, & utilizing a NAS, instead of an USB HD.
IMO, - the Apple TV is not. But the Sonore has more in common with the Squeezebox than it does with a PC. That's one of the reasons why the manufacturer CALLS the device a streamer instead of a computer.
""You can often put a pedestrian item in a pretty box, slap a big name on it and everyone goes nuts!""
I believe that that may be true but not "often:" - as it gets found out quickly enough, and if it doesn't perform better, the item gets exposed and will quickly be gone: (it happens more often in the mid-end, and low-end were less attention is paid). In Bryston's case, - the mainboard certainly is "closer" to an off the shelf product: but it's still a custom board, and we know that things like the power supply, connector quality, wiring to the connectors count for a lot.
That being said, I share your opinion of Bryston as a company, and although I disagree a little, - (I've heard some very good sounding high-current, amps from them), - I am with you.Earlier in this thread, it was nice to get some corroboration from Gordon, that philosophically, a high performance digital playback device/transport is "better" when it has those same HARDWARE elements as other good high performance audio devices do: a very good PSU, very good connectors, removal of superfluous parts from the signal path, damping, etc. With a streamer, one still needs a processor, and therefore a mainboard: the more that you can move that board away from being multi-dimensional, the better that is going to sound. I wonder if someone will design, & somehow implement a processor without charge pumps. That will be one of the next big steps.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Edits: 01/07/15 01/07/15
"You can't buy a rasberry Pi "off the shelf"
I have. You can.
Tony Lauck
"Diversity is the law of nature; no two entities in this universe are uniform." - P.R. Sarkar
There may be differing definitions of "audiophool" in play in this thread. Hardcore objectivists have one definition, hard core subjectivists have another. There are also "fence straddlers" who use various definitions according to situation. If a fence straddler is promoting an idea or peddling a product, he will adjust his argumentation according to whether the "mark" is a subjectivist or an objectivist.
Tony Lauck
"Diversity is the law of nature; no two entities in this universe are uniform." - P.R. Sarkar
shot down pretty quickly around here, and in IRL. "Audiophool" companies get exposed quickly, and are eliminated rather quickly.
The fact that you are not capable of citing any specific examples, also lends credence to the above.
Traditionally, superior audio playback has been exclusively hardware driven. Computer engineers, and computer manufacturers and designers have been varied in their goal of building multifunction devices that integrate both hardware, and software in order perform many functions. For this, and other reasons, computers have always sucked at superior audio playback.
I am happy to see companies like Bryston & Sim Audio, APL, and Sonore turn their attention toward digital file playback client devices: bringing to the table much needed expertise in that area.
I think that it is very, very, foolish for someone to refer to Sim Audio as a company who makes "audiophool" products, and/or any of their products.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
I choose not to cite products and companies. Most of the information that I have is second hand and I'm not going to say bad things that hurt people without first hand knowledge. I have no problem badmouthing products based on public marketing information and I have done so on many occasions. Another reason not to be specific is that, in some cases, it would amount to personal attacks and that is not allowed according to forum rules. I am not going to be baited or entrapped into potential lawsuits, etc...
Tony Lauck
"Diversity is the law of nature; no two entities in this universe are uniform." - P.R. Sarkar
so on other words, I'm right and it doesn't happen...
Personal attacks and legal action aren't the conclusion of repeating examples of something that has already transpired, as you cannot be held liable for just repeating 'old news.'
And of course, none of the 5 products in question could possibly have anything remotely applicable.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
OK then, take the 'audiophool' word out of picture since it's not what is in question here.
Yes, this is the way I see it.
examined?
At least a couple of these 4 or 5 products have no USB bus.
Can you name one multipurpose computer's mainboard available today that has no USB bus?
The NIC card used to only be available as a separate bus card. I wonder if an old AT mainboard from 1995 might not make for a better transport.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
The classic example of an "audiophool" product is a repackage job with a new case, new brand name and new high price but the same old, same old innards. There have also been high priced cable "filters" that when torn down are shown to have encapsulated "blobs" which turn out to be nothing but some wires going straight through, etc... Then there is the high end marketing literature which makes pseudo-technical claims that can not possibly be true, e.g. they violate the laws of physics. In the past I have linked to some of this BS and have done a little deconstruction of the offending lies.
Depending on which circles one travels one may get a different perspective as to the fraction of salesmen, dealers, and high end manufacturers who are scam artists and those that are merely struggling small businessmen. There are crooks and scam artists in all lines of business, but they seem to concentrate most in areas where the consumers are well heeled and not technically knowledgeable and where product performance tends to be highly subjective. In other fields the customers are highly technical and value conscious and product performance may be highly objective, e.g. an airplane crashes and people die if the design is poor, making BS designs and literature less likely.
Tony Lauck
"Diversity is the law of nature; no two entities in this universe are uniform." - P.R. Sarkar
1 or 2 DACs, (Lexicon), and a couple of cables.
This just doesn't happen in the high end, and the perpetrators are quickly exposed.
It does happen more with "bigger" low fi, & mid-end corporations.
And, the electronics industry, especially the high end, is so much better than other industries. Jewelry, hand bags, RVs. It exists everywhere and is much worse, (in everything and everywhere, that the consumer, and reviewers, don't research very well).
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
arguing with these phools.
,
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
It would be interesting to see one of these stripped down and evaluated for design, component and build quality. It would also be interesting to see various noise measurements. Without some of this information there's no way to know if this is more than marketing smoke.
Tony Lauck
"Diversity is the law of nature; no two entities in this universe are uniform." - P.R. Sarkar
As it goes, - it is incredibly better, rich with detail, and good technical information compared to just about any other industry.
When comparisons are done, - the high end stands out as exemplary...
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Let's not get hysterical. Sonore is basically a two man operation. They place no space ads, they have had no reviews done that I know of outside of Computer Audiophile, and I can tell you first hand the build quality is phenomenal, and it is one of the two best digital front ends I have ever heard, the other being the Bryston BDP-2.There margin absolutely fair considering what they put into the design. The Rendu is $1400, and the Signature Rendu is $2900.
Edits: 12/24/14
Pity they don't do 230V 50Hz.
Many PC inmates have tried to improve MB and SPDIF performance here. I know I have. Conviction computer audio audio practitioners don't like it.
Some MAC inmates started with software player suites costing $1500 to improve sound. For sevral years some of these have pooh-poohed hardware improvements. They are still going on about usb power issues and Thunderbolt connections for audio files.
One poster wants to see pictures and another wants someone else to strip down a Sonore.
Sad but Merry Xmas.
"....Conviction computer audio audio practitioners don't like it."
lol. I'm not sure if I got the exact meaning on that, but maybe you're some kind of under appreciated computer audio revolutionary before his time.
you don't know what I am saying, and you should if you'd understood my exchanges with others, then why are you commenting? Hot air?!
Conviction audio is the phrase for those who have decided what governs sound quality and will query as potentially wrong any other factors that may be proposed on the basis of sound technical reasoning or extended listening experience with really high quality systems.
I would classify you as one of them.
Yes, the lengths some will go to and the money some will spend to try to mold a POS consumer computer Into a high grade file playback system is amazing.Power supplies, software, tranquility bases, power conditioners, the list go s on.
You may want to drop a note to Sonore and see if they do 230. I was told they have shipped units to Europe.
P.S. I see 220V is an option.
Edits: 12/24/14
propagated in order to overly praise the personal computer, while at the same time running down "high end audio" manufacturing. It's fascinating that these same (unreasonable) criticisms are not levied upon amplifiers, speakers, turntables, & (especially) CD players.
Especially when DIY destructions of commercial computers are SOOOOO expensive and fraught with many challenges & issues with complex interactions, & difficulties in identifying priority of what should be modified.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
It is because as I have stated before..there is no destination for the PC/MAC crowd. Their pain is their pleasure. The wack a mole approach is beautiful agony.
Why "settle" for a purpose built for audio device, which solves many of the problems of the computer audio chain, for as you say, far fewer dollars in the end, and have spare time to cultivate, manage, and listen to your digital music collection when you can obsess over power supplies, USB ports, McSoftware, and other distractions?
Easy answer on why the same venom is not hurled at speakers, CD players, and amps. You CAN buy an off the shelf computer, run iTunes, and connect the thin to a USB DAC and get passable sound.
To "roll your own" with speakers requires quite a bit of skill, and decent layout on parts. With amps and disc players, good capacitors and resistors, cases, and transports are not cheap by any standard and the skill to the make all these parts work together is not to be underestimated.
.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
The Tranquility Base and power conditioner would benefit the Sonore as well. I'm not in either camp as both computers and dedicated servers get the job done. But a dedicated server well done has some advantages.
I have been busy submitting my next review on the Atmosphere. A very unique product that will drive the Hydrogen Audio crowd nuts.
Merry Christmas to all of my friends here at AA.
it has no capacity to store and deliver files, and there's no way that it can modified to do so.
It is a digital file transport/player.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
.
There are different types of "servers". To be a "file server" one needs to store and retrieve files. There are "name servers" that perform name to address translation. There are "DHCP servers" that manage LAN addresses. Way back when there used to be "terminal servers" that interfaced character terminals to local area networks, etc...
A server is a running instance of an application (software) capable of accepting requests from the client and giving responses accordingly. Servers can run on any computer including dedicated computers, which individually are also often referred to as "the server". In many cases, a computer can provide several services and have several servers running. The advantage of running servers on a dedicated computer is security. For this reason most of the servers are daemon processes and designed in that they can be run on specific computer(s).
Servers operate within a client-server architecture. Servers are computer programs running to serve the requests of other programs, the clients. Thus, the server performs some tasks on behalf of clients. It facilitates the clients to share data, information or any hardware and software resources.
Tony Lauck
"Diversity is the law of nature; no two entities in this universe are uniform." - P.R. Sarkar
Thanks Tony. Some of our friends here are, well.....
Of course none of these five transports under discussion are servers.
Not sure why Tony is bothering, or you're piling on.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
"Not sure why Tony is bothering, or you're piling on.""There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio,
Than are dreamt of in your philosophy."
Tony Lauck
"Diversity is the law of nature; no two entities in this universe are uniform." - P.R. Sarkar
Edits: 12/29/14
.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Merc, I always appreciate your even handedness.
Ah, the Atmosphere...heheh..Peter Brueniger has done a video on his website with it and that has caused quite a stir....good luck!!
I have been saying this for a couple of years.
In the abscence of an audio MB, one can choose to silence as many voltage rails as possible within the computer. This is difficult with a laptop or a mini of any kind.
Believe it or not, powering a music data ssd independently with low impedance decoupling can change SQ significantly. John Swenson has also posted similar remarks elsewhere.
I have already said that a battery should never be used without decoupling. In his case I would stick 10 000 uF in parallel with lower impedance bypasses on and look for changes in both transient responses and SQ.
Yes we all know that Fred has already tried everything at least a couple years before anyone else has thought of it. You da Man!
Gordon,Are you talking about a pi network filter? Might be fun to try.
With the very low voltages and extremely high currents from onboard DC-DC converters (that intelligently vary voltage on demand), they would be nearly impossible to replace with linear equivalents on an off-the-shelf motherboard.
What I am not able to do very easily, is probe at the output of the filter module that was installed in the computer in place of the SMPS.
Edits: 12/22/14
One would not need such stuff.
The load would be, after turn on, pretty constant so no need for that kind of current delivery. I am assuming a board only for audio - no internet connection, printers, simple graphics, nothing but what is needed for playback.
The A123 18650 batteries can supply great wallops of current if required and faster than any Dc-Dc converter if these were utilized instead of any regulator. Instead using a regulator "before" the battery as a charger that only charges to the voltage needed.
One of these days someone will offer such a thing and it will be expensive but there is no doubt what we pay for mass market motherboards is a rather extraordinary bargain BUT you get what you pay for.
If one could get a reliable schematic, not a block diagram, of a motherboard with parts identified one could probably come up with something good. As it is one would probably destroy a few figuring out what does what.
The A123 18650 batteries can supply great wallops of current if required and faster than any Dc-Dc converter if these were utilized instead of any regulator. Instead using a regulator "before" the battery as a charger that only charges to the voltage needed.
Do you have any evidence to support your claim above? I'm sure they provide 'great wollops of current' but can you point to any measurements showing transient response of these batteries under computer load, vs the best linear power supplies or switching power supplies?
Do a bit of research. You can start a car with them.
Edits: 12/24/14
So if a battery starts a car, that makes it especially well suited for a computer music server?
Yes this is correct. The ability to start a car is directly related to sound quality.
Merry Christmas...
The battery in this thing must be even better as it not only starts it up, it actually propels the vehicle.
Merry Christmas
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