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In Reply to: RE: Time to get organized! posted by Bibo01 on December 13, 2011 at 22:59:47
One can wait for a ready to go recipe or decide this is interesting enough to try to learn something about it.
I have no technical skills other than what I have learned from following what others have discovered and looking further because of their inspiration.
As Mihaylov has said many times everyone's OS is different. There are many possible approaches. There will not be one best for everyone anyway.
I think that if one reads the posts it is not hard to come up with something that will work well for you.
No one here has promised a turnkey solution to getting the best out of cMP. I suspect that if someone does it will not work for everyone, anyway.
Who knows where this effort will end? It might come to a halt next week or it might go on for years. One can wait for the easy go or jump in and
you may contribute something to the process. Even if it is simply reporting what something does is worthwhile.
So, who is going to organize the various aspects? I do not think anyone has had just one area of interest. Does someone tell that person to just concentrate on one thing?
If one wants convenience you best leave the whole thing alone. Those of us in the pursuit of best possible sound quality have no interest in convenience. I know I don't. Like wanting a turntable that adjusts stylus tracking angle and azimuth for itself. Not going to happen.
One cannot have it all - compromises/consequences.
We know what files are needed to have a working cMP. We are still exploring ways to minimize registry interference. Hacking the files illegal? Are you serious? I would not think a program that has been downloaded thousands of times would put us in jeopardy. If that is the case there are plenty of other things that have been suggested that would probably be illegal, also. Another reason for people to proceed with this on their own taking cues from posts instead of waiting for the "kit".
As with all DIY audio there is the opportunity, when combined with some effort, to produce something that suits your needs. That is what is happening here. Not something made to appeal to as many as possible.
If you want the best possible sound quality it is not that hard to read through the posts and try what has been suggested. The problem for you will be that the Serge's, who have led the way, are not interested in convenience. Would you expect them to decide to change their mission to suit those looking for convenience? Somehow I do not think that is going to happen. It might, anything CAN happen, but I would doubt it.
The obvious solution to this, for those who are interested in what you are wanting from cMP, is to find like minded folk and start experimenting. To expect someone else to do it is ... well, I won't say.
In actuality, to get to a very good sounding minimal WINDOWS/cMP is pretty easy. Quicker than setting up full WINDOWS and doing the cMP optimizations. But if you want to retain convenience, which for everyone will be different, that is another thing entirely.
Follow Ups:
Maybe we were all spoiled by Cics who gave us a gem and a kit (i.e, website instructions). But these 'post cics' tweaks are just that...tweaks that somehow have become more than 'just tweaks'. I cannot believe that anyone would complain about the chaos here....imo its great. Out of the chaos comes the creativity. If its hard to follow and difficult to implement...well welcome to the asylum! Out of the chaos comes a wonderful sounding front end that if I bought commercially would cost way way more than $ I have sunk into CMP. And how many of you have paid $600-3000 a pop for post purchase upgrades for small performance pops while cmp just gets better and better weekly sometimes daily with significant breakthrough performance for FREE.
Yes I get frustrated. I need to go n_lite to fix my registry but so what. What else would I do. Maybe I have the time and many of you do not. You can always do what I did when I worked 12-14 hours a day...spend $5-10K (or more now a days)for a front end. Or you can slog through the chaos and just keep learning/doing and making wonderful acquaintances with the brave creatives that share their work here ....for free! Let me repeat...for free!
Where else can you (for free) use an idea for a computer program from a brilliant physics/IT expert Cics (location tbd), have it tweaked by the ever creative Serge brothers (Russia), made easier by Jolida (India), Rick (US) and hardware perfected by a manufacturing/electrical experts from Scotland (Ryelands), US (Gstew) and Hong Kong (Jackwong). I'm sure there are others I cant remember right now but I don't know about you but I'm delighted just to have the opportunity to listen to them share their ideas through this forum and maybe even sometimes have some dialogue with them. I dont want to to give any of them an assignment to make it easier for me. I don't want to scare them away.
Hi Theob,
perhaps my idea of cMP2 is different from yours. I think the original cics project is about sharing ideas on PC Audio reproduction, not tweaking away your personal toy.
As I said before, experimentation is as important as sharing knowledge among music lovers. So much so that lately I have been promoting the idea to go beyond forum borders and bring cMP2 to the people, among the people, by the people.
That is, I have been organizing cMP2 Days in Rome, next Jan 15 in Milan and possibly soon in Naples. It's a workshop explaining liquid music and cMP2 approach, where we listen to music, compare systems and share ideas in a proper setup audio room. In Rome we had over 100 people.
I'd like to point out that I am doing this for free, like my whole Italian forum activity (including reviews). I am not promoting any brand, personal or otherwise. I do not work in the audio business.
Hi Theob,
I get what you are saying and probably would feel that way too.
I certainly dont mind the effort and messing with things. Please look at my comments not as me saying "hey I am too lazy and I just want someone to do the work" That is not what I am saying and not what I think Bibo01 is saying.
I AM saying that things are so muttled and confused that I cant figure it out. If you could even tell me the overall steps then I could figure it out.
Something like:
1. Do steppes steps 1-20
2. Nlite
3. Registry tweaks
Honestly I dont know if you guys are using nlite to do registry things or to accomplish steppes steps or something else. Or if the batch files should be used and when, etc.
And if I went back and started at step 3 where are the pitfalls? I recall seeing some revisions and some dead ends. I dont really want to go down that path if I can avoid it.
I would settle for a thread that just gives a general overview and links to the posts that tell you what to do.
Anyhow I read posts about missing things and going back to the original cmp2 build and finding things that were missing and it is easy to think we are chasing our tails. I am guessing that things are better now and that the improvements are worthwhile these days??
No one here remembers the bending of our minds
I have been through all of this from the beginning. Some points left me confused, and some ended in dead ends that required a complete rebuild. Along the way I learned a lot and a this point could build one very fast. I can offer a couple of pointers that might make this easy.
1. take the time to set your hdd with partitions. I have 3 key partitions.
C: is the fully optimized CMP2 player
D: is a full function XP with network with network
E: is where I store data. 3 key folders - music, all install files & image backups. There will be a lot of these.
2. set up the system to dual boot. later when cmp becomes nothing more than a transport, you can just reboot to windows and tweek it some more, or simply reload an image backup over C: and keep going
3. start cmp with nLite. Do the cmp optimizations and take your base image backup.
4. you can apply all the recommended file deletions pretty much in any order. I like to use a base system that is more or less nLite with steppe deletions up to 12, the Jolida tweeks and in my case full Bold Fortune. I added the lost registry tweeks and watchdog stuff. This is a very sweet sounding base that remains fully functional.
5. from there, registry cleanup and compression is really worthwhile.
6. I found it quesitonable if I liked the sound with the deletions up to step16. It was clearer but maybe not as real. But if you take frequent image backups (takes about 1 minute from the full function xp, you can easily go back to any combination and savor the flavor. take win_SXS stuff out, put it back in until the sound is what you like.
7. If you want to go for broke, delete the rest of the files and from xp, do the hacks on shell32, and perhaps all the remaining dlls. At this point my system came into a beautiful state. The clarity, sound quality, sound stage are all precise and top quality. Most important, the texture came back in spades. There is separation and air around everything that just does not exist at base cmp, step 3 or 4 or 12.
So, you can do a little or a lot. Until you master multiple partitions and frequent image backups, you will be frustrated by the threat of BSOD and a rebuild.
Hope that helps a bit. enjoy.
Wlowes' is a very helpful post. Now let's build on it.
Wlowes has illustrated 7 points.
What needed is a clear organized explanations of points 3-7.
Can someone provide links for each point or, even better, detailed info from each tweak author (you can email me privately if you like)? I will then organize it and repost on my site in a user's friendly manner (well...as much as possible).
concept of the development I see, with the way I understand how and why the tweaks work, how I see the possible future development and so on. I only warn that it's not "scientific" enough. Just the concept where logical thinking is mixed with dreams, like Bertone cars from the 70-s.
Serge.
Shoot away!
Registry tweaks, boot.ini...
For deletions, I think Jolida is providing batch files and, hopefully soon, Bitch Batch.
Let's assume that deletions are carried out to the last stage and resources kept as required (i.e. network and USB), it would be interesting to know how to, for example, upgrade a sound card driver and, in general terms, how to reimplement a resource without restarting all over again.
THANKS!!!!!
That does help a bunch!
Funny you mention image back ups. In the beginning I made the and found that they were kind of a pain and then I think once I tried to use one and it didnt work for some reason. Anyhow since them I have just chanced it.
Looks like it is now time to get going with them.
Thanks.
D
No one here remembers the bending of our minds
Well here is what I learned going from a full CMP^2 to Steppes 1-22. It locks you out of making registry compacting and makes it difficult to do registry tweaks. You can still do tweaks but either by reloading files into system32 or by using a host computer to tweak loaded registry hives (which also is risky...was for me anyway). If you do an nlite install much of the registry is already compacted. So you start out cleaner but then you have redo cmp^2 and all its settings per the CMP site (not easy or at least time consuming). So after you reload cmp^2 probably an easy way to do the file deletions (not the registry tweaks though) is to start with the files you need and eliminate all others. But do the registry tweaks 1st. Then with a 30-40mb windows you can do resource hacker (through a host computer and a docking station or network). Then you are done until something new comes up and you have to retrace anyway.
Hey I'm a victim too because I havent done the registry compacting. So what I'm going to do is buy another 8 gb ssd nlite it and slowly do it the right way. Why do I want to do this? I just read that the registry is loaded somewhere in memory so I have 10 mb excess baggage in mine till I compact it.
I also think we all have to organize our own work because our needs/skills/knowledge base is at different levels. I'm not against a site for this like as been suggested. But it takes people willing to do this.
I agree that we should't try to assign creativity, and i think we can learn a lot going through all the posts, it's just great!
Bibo01 just offered to put the batches & mermaids on his site, in a sticky topic, which is a wonderful offer!
Now we have both: creative chaos and an abstract of the most important CMP-knowledge on his site!!
Douwe
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