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Planar Speaker Asylum

GRS Planar Drivers on Parts-Express

23.242.178.78

It looks like Parts-Express has new BG Neo (3, 8 and 10) clones in inventory. Information is sparse. I wonder how good they are.
Introductory prices are considerably cheaper.

https://www.parts-express.com/Search.aspx?keyword=GRS%20plan (Open in New Window)

Edits: 09/23/20

Follow Ups:

RE: GRS PT 6825-8 - emailtim 20:38:11 09/26/20 (0)
Some folks on AudioCircle are testing the GRS NEO8 and NEO10 clones.

I put a couple of the GRS NEO8 clones on order and will be testing them.

They should arrive on Wednesday.
GRS Planar--Hope they sound good - Jon L 21:08:42 09/21/20 (3)
We now need some volunteers to try them, preferably against Neo's, and report back :)
- RE: GRS Planar--Hope they sound good - emailtim 18:39:08 09/22/20 (2)
  There are 2 trying them on the AudioCircle.
  
  One is trying the Neo3 clone and one is trying the Neo10 clone.
  
  Need someone to test the NEO8S clones.
  - https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=172523.0 (Open in New Window)
  - Neo10 clone - Jon L 15:50:18 09/23/20 (1)
    I saw the Neo3 clone thread, but where is the Neo10 clone thread?
    - RE: Neo10 clone - emailtim 16:40:46 09/23/20 (0)
      HAL bought the NEO10 clone samples but hasn't posted any results yet.
RE: GRS Planar Drivers on Parts-Express - BDP24 21:21:17 09/20/20 (14)
Danny Richie at GR Research has been involved with the NEO drivers since they were introduced, using them in some of his designs. When the company making them was bought, and the drivers discontinued, Danny designed his own version of the NEO3, and started having it manufactured for him. He has written extensively about all three models (and the long line source drivers) on his Audio Circle Forum.
- RE: GRS Planar Drivers on Parts-Express - emailtim 22:08:59 09/20/20 (13)
  Unfortunately Danny doesn't have the NEO8 or NEO8S which are what appears to be used with Maggies. Maggies already have a true ribbon leaving little use for the NEO3.
  - RE: GRS Planar Drivers on Parts-Express - BDP24 02:58:26 09/21/20 (12)
    Exactly Tim. The Tympani mod uses the NEO8 (no reason or need to replace the ribbon tweeter), which Danny used in some of his designs as well. I don't know why he has redone the NEO3 but not the 8 or 10. By the way, he provides black yarn with each NEO3 he sells, to be threaded through the two outer rows of holes in the driver's faceplate, to narrow it's operating width and thereby improve it's radiation pattern.
    - RE: GRS Planar Drivers on Parts-Express - josh358 18:23:41 10/13/20 (0)
      You can do the same thing with Neo 8's. I used two strips of felt on the outer holes and measured improved dispersion. Asked Danny how they compare to his yarn mod and he said the felt and yarn measure the same.
      
      I gather that the reason he supplies the yarn is to avoid a patent issue!
    - RE: GRS Planar Drivers on Parts-Express - emailtim 08:02:13 09/21/20 (10)
      Danny is supposedly working on NEO10 clones and reported recently turned down a batch do to dampening issues.
      
      He doesn't think much of the NEO8(S) for his designs where it does appear to fit a niche for Magnepan midranges.
      
      The yarn mod was to avoid a patent issue. If he made them with the felt installed, he would have been in patent violation, but the user adding yarn after the fact did not violate the patent.
      
      The GRS drivers appear to have felt on the back side of the drivers on the outside chases. If you look at the Parts-Express front and back pictures and zoom in, you can plainly see it. They also appear to be screwed together where the real BG's are rivoted.
      - felt or yarn? THE DEBATE BEGINS - farfetched 15:39:23 09/21/20 (9)
        
        In Reply to: RE: GRS Planar Drivers on Parts-Express posted by emailtim on September 21, 2020 at 08:02:13
        
        I've heard about that felt issue. I used to own a pair of Snell Type D's, which had a 1/2 inch felt baffle around the tweeter and midrange (top-third of the cabinet).
        
        It made a pretty big diff if you removed them. The soundstage collapsed. And yes, I actually just said that. I don't say things like that. But I swear it was true!
        
        Who has the patent? Isn't it Dunlavy or some such?
        
        / optimally proportioned triangles are our friends
        
        RE: felt or yarn? THE DEBATE BEGINS - BDP24 16:57:19 09/21/20 (8)
        
        In Reply to: RE: felt or yarn? THE DEBATE BEGINS posted by farfetched on September 21, 2020 at 15:39:23
        
        John Bau put a thick felt blanket on the baffle of his Spica loudspeakers, first time I saw that.
        
        Edits: 09/21/20
        
        RE: felt or yarn? THE DEBATE BEGINS - Utley1 20:16:06 09/21/20 (7)
        
        In Reply to: RE: felt or yarn? THE DEBATE BEGINS posted by BDP24 on September 21, 2020 at 16:57:19
        
        Owned COSMOSTATICS : AN ELECTROSTATIC OMNI-DIRECTIONAL HYBRID. The multiple woofers were suffused with lambs wool which helped the transition to the stat portion. Each speaker weighed 175 lbs- have the hernia to prove it. Soft materials are an important part of speaker design or should be so your question is pertinent but absent in most discussion. It matters
        
        RE: felt or yarn? THE DEBATE BEGINS - BDP24 03:01:40 09/22/20 (6)
        
        In Reply to: RE: felt or yarn? THE DEBATE BEGINS posted by Utley1 on September 21, 2020 at 20:16:06
        
        The QUAD ESL (aka "57") has a layer of felt on the backside of the center tweeter strip, the rest of the rear grille a scratchy sort of rough material. Peter Walker did not intend the ESL to be a dipole!
        
        RE: felt or yarn? THE DEBATE BEGINS - triamp 02:54:16 09/23/20 (5)
        
        In Reply to: RE: felt or yarn? THE DEBATE BEGINS posted by BDP24 on September 22, 2020 at 03:01:40
        
        Using felt around tweeters has been done for quite a while. I've often seen a saw-like pattern cut into the inner edge of the surrounding felt, this exposes greater linear area of felt to the radiation from the tweeter and also varies the distance between the felt and the tweeter- to vary the wavelength fractional distance between the tweeter and the felt.
        Bottlehead uses a pattern of felt around their J�ger speaker said to be computed using some variation of fractal math to help deal with diffraction. ( see https://bottlehead.com/product/jager-speaker-kit/ )
        The idea is to prevent the expanding wavefront from the tweeter encountering a cabinet edge or other disturbing boundary. When an expanding sound wave hits a boundary, reflections off that boundary act like sound sources, like sonic mirror images of the tweeter... at lower amplitude, or course, but still you end up with what is essentially the acoustic equivalent of a whole bunch of tweeters, all at different fractions of wavelengths from the original tweeter, minor additive and subtractive artifacts appear in the amplitude response....
        This is also why tweeters are flush-mounted in speaker baffles and speaker cabinet edges rounded- these are attempts to eliminate this effect.
        Compare the measured response of a surface-mounted done tweeter to one that is flush mounted- you'll typically see little ripples in the treble response of the one that's just stuck to the baffle compared to the flush mounted one,and it also creates some disturbance in the 3D distribution - both of these can impair stereo imaging in "point source" (i.e., dome, cone or single ribbon) high frequency speakers. Felting is a further measure beyond flush mounting and rounded corners to avoid these diffraction effects.
        Planar and line sources don't have quite the same vulnerability, though there are other things to watch out for when designing planar or line array systems.
        ___
        Science doesn't care what you believe.
        
        Edits: 09/23/20
        
        RE: felt or yarn? THE DEBATE BEGINS - josh358 18:26:41 10/13/20 (1)
        
        In Reply to: RE: felt or yarn? THE DEBATE BEGINS posted by triamp on September 23, 2020 at 02:54:16
        
        Felt is used to minimize diffraction.
        
        Curiously, Roger's Tympani IVA's have felt on the baffle, while my later IVA's don't.
        
        RE: felt or yarn? THE DEBATE BEGINS - Roger Gustavsson 23:06:49 10/14/20 (0)
        
        In Reply to: RE: felt or yarn? THE DEBATE BEGINS posted by josh358 on October 13, 2020 at 18:26:41
        
        I have seen a comment by Jim Winey about some problems in early production causing diffraction around the ribbon tweeter. The response from front and back of the tweeter is different, maybe even more so in the later models with its cavity around the tweeter and the double cloth in front of it.
        
        RE: felt or yarn? THE DEBATE BEGINS - triamp 03:44:06 09/25/20 (0)
        
        In Reply to: RE: felt or yarn? THE DEBATE BEGINS posted by triamp on September 23, 2020 at 02:54:16
        
        Where did the rest of my post go??? Only 1/3 of it is there!
        Science doesn't care what you believe.
        
        RE: felt or yarn? THE DEBATE BEGINS - BDP24 03:59:44 09/23/20 (1)
        
        In Reply to: RE: felt or yarn? THE DEBATE BEGINS posted by triamp on September 23, 2020 at 02:54:16
        
        Vandersteen has been using felt on his "baffles" for ever.
        
        AudioXPress - Felt Rolling - emailtim 07:51:00 09/23/20 (0)
        
        In Reply to: RE: felt or yarn? THE DEBATE BEGINS posted by BDP24 on September 23, 2020 at 03:59:44
        
        Here is an article on AudioEPress.
        
        "... This is, of course, the naturally derived felt taken from sheep. It has many uses that I won't go into, but it is used in combination with various synthetic materials to produce the numerous types available.
        The acoustic quality of these compositions varies, primarily as a function of the percentage of real wool in the felt and its density.
        
        Synthetic felt just doesn't work. It is more reflective than it is absorptive. Don't even consider using anything that is purely or even largely synthetic. ..."
        
        Just need to narrow down the region, type, color, age and gender of sheep next and we should be good to go !!! =)
        https://audioxpress.com/article/Diffraction-Doesn-t-Have-to- (Open in New Window)

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