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In Reply to: RE: "I think based on my brief listening that the diffusion also improves the ambiance of the room" posted by E-Stat on July 13, 2017 at 15:29:01
I wonder how much of a difference a 2 x 4 arrangement actually makes. It's what you usually see but how much does that have to do with acoustics, given that well depth and diffuser width also matter? And how much is just accommodating listeners at varying heights?
Have you tried comparing the skylines to QRD's? I'd think the skylines would be more effective.
Follow Ups:
Not tried the QRD flavor.
Mike Lavigne uses a "triple stack". :)
Mike's room is definitely making me feel ambitious. :-)
I wonder why he has them mounted in the center, rather than at the first reflection points? Also why he uses skylines in front and what look like horizontal + vertical QRD's at the sides?
I'm curious about pyramidal diffusers right now, because of that window -- I could make them easily with plexiglass. From what I've seen they're more deflectors than diffusers, in that they create specular reflections off to the sides. But that would allow me to create an RFZ, which I think would be ideal. I may model them with styrofoam to see how the effect compares to that of the QRD's.
I'm thinking that if you bent the sheets a bit, you'd get both reflection and a bit of diffusion . . . and if you sealed them and put some foam at the top and bottom you'd also get some bass trapping.
That is what I have read years ago in my acoustics research reading: Absorption for the first reflection points and diffusion at the centre. What an amazing room, and when Rives goes in there and builds the room you know it is done right. Notice also the curved front wall on which the QRD is ousted which scatters the waves as well.
Was there a link to the room?
Anyway, I think the requirements for dipoles are somewhat different since they radiate little to the first reflection points at the sides, and a lot to the first reflection point at the rear and also the second reflection point around the corners. So basically the treatment ends up behind.
I'm uncertain about absorption. The best way to build a room is with a(n early) reflection-free zone, no question about that. In a studio, you do that by angling the walls so the early reflections are directed away from the mixing desk. Then you put diffusion on the back wall of the studio to provide a pleasing sense of ambiance.
But we don't usually have the option of angled walls, and rear wall has to be a minimum of 8' and preferable 12.5 feet (20 msec round trip) behind the listener to use diffusion there. So usually what the acoustics guys suggest for a small listening room is absorption at the first reflection points, and also behind the listener.
The thing is, I'm concerned that a room like that will end up sounding dead and studio-like, which is to say clinical. Two channel needs some room ambiance. Right now, my room is too live and zingy so I do need some broadband absorption in there but I'm afraid that absorption at all the first reflection points will be too much.
Another issue is that I can't put absorption over the window without blocking the window. There is some transparent micropore absorption stuff but I don't think it's as effective as fiberglass.
At some point, I'll probably get some 703 and experiment with absorption on the front and rear walls to see how it compares to the diffusion . . .
I think your sliding panels are an excellent idea. Have a sliding absorber. When things need to get critical slide it over the window, if you are like me your eyes are closed anyway. Or maybe one that flips up to the ceiling like a Murphy bed. Hey, I am giving myself ideas!
I thought about making shutters that would flip over the window from the sides . . .
Here's some commentary.
"...the room is purpose designed as a 2 channel listening room by Chris Huston of Rives Audio. the below picture does show 2 elements added since the room was built in 2004. the RPG Skyline diffusers (3 stacked) between the speakers, and the Auralex T-Fusors on the side walls next to the speakers.
I guess we'd have to ask Rives. Presumably, they know a lot more about it than I do! But the last thing I want to do is bring an acoustician in and actually make my room sound good. :-)
Edits: 07/15/17
the Rives Audio website has been gone for a while...
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