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In Reply to: RE: The problem with.... posted by AbeCollins on May 14, 2017 at 07:24:29
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"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong" H. L. Mencken
Follow Ups:
The key phrase to focus on in my post was "for the most part", which could also mean "in general".
Yes, you can cherry pick a couple American models that handle well but if you lined up most cars from GM, Ford, FCI against say, most cars from Porsche, BMW, Audi, or even VW, you'll get my point.
I don't think so anymore,certainly not with VW. The first 3 are very expensive and the repairs are costly and they do break. The point I was making,if GM and Ford and FCI are capable of building cars to run with exotics at a fraction of the price,they are very capable of building cars to handle as well or similar to some of those. It wasn't too long ago that car and driver wouldn't review an American car. Now it's an everyday thing. I just believe in keeping my money in the US as opposed to sending it to countries where I don't live.
"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong" H. L. Mencken
And yet Detroit's (current) best is - well bested by a Porsche. Remember the Car & Driver link I provided putting the Vette in fourth place to an equivalently priced model?
I would enjoy driving a GT40. Remember too that, like the Cobra, it also used a European designed chassis - in this case Lola. You can keep the plastic Chevy. :)
The GT40 is almost a half a Mil.The plastic Chevy you can take to Hennessey and turn it into a machine. Now as far as handing,the Vette I posted yesterday beat the Porsche at the track by 3/4 of a second and that's a lifetime at those speeds.Handling and grip is why..They are going to carbon fiber in the Vette along with mid engine.That will pretty much complete its transformation. They will still build the current series along side it for the faithful but I think once people drive the mid engine,the old will phase out even tho its far less money.
"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong" H. L. Mencken
Now as far as handing,the Vette I posted yesterday beat the Porsche at the track by 3/4 of a second and that's a lifetime at those speeds.Handling and grip is why.
And yet, the car magazines still prefer the refinement you find with Porsche in real world daily driving.
If track days are all that's important, why not buy a Cobra kit car and stuff some blowers on it?
I would love a Cobra kit car.I would put an Ecoboost V6 in it like the GT40.
I will be honest with you.I teach auto-electronics and it covers everything in the car these days.They are making these cars to where the driver input matters less and less and that takes the skill out of driving.
The new automatics shift faster than anyone at a manual gear shift but where is the fun anymore? The most mechanical part of the car I teach is the transmission.The gas pedal is electronic even.
"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong" H. L. Mencken
The new automatics shift faster than anyone at a manual gear shift but where is the fun anymore?
With mindless-as-it-is straight line acceleration, that's truly the case. Big whoop.
OTOH, the PDK in my Porsche allows for active paddle shifting (with multiple degrees of aggressiveness) to thoroughly enjoy slicing the corners.
Ever watch an F1 driver in his office? "Sport Plus" enables launch control, too. :)
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"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong" H. L. Mencken
I don't share your love for crate motor swapped vehicles.
Personally I think they are perversions.
for guys like Richard Rawlings at Gas Monkey Garage. Last season, the Bearded Wonder did one of those V-8 motor swaps in a 911.
Guess which one won when it was raced vs. Richard's stock Turbo?
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Which one do you think would win a hill climb? :-)
"American cars suck, Harleys break down frequently, all horn speakers honk, change your car's oil every 3,000 miles" etc. etc. We all have them, and swear by them.
Thanks for the video. That was fun.
"Suddenly, I'm not half the man I used to be. 'Cause now I'm an amputee" J. Lennon
Willie G banished that well-deserved-for-a-long-time reality some years ago. The new Milwaukee Eight motor begins to bring them into the twenty first century with four valve cylinder heads and water cooling. And yet, the H-D cognoscenti want nothing of engine refinement. They're all about the inherent imbalance of a 45 degree V-twin.
It's the only motor community in my awareness that thrives on high levels of NVH. Give us more! Great for the doo rag wearing dentists as they get to replace fillings more often.
As for me, I prefer being able to clearly see the images in the mirrors. :)
Simply because it's no longer true doesn't stop it from being endlessly repeated.
I've related this story here before, but my group of friends includes a guy who used to ride what I believe you do, an ST-1300. Another guy let him take his 1953 Panhead for a ride. Mr. 1300 came back with a big, shit eating grin on his face. It's a very visceral experience, and either you enjoy it, or you don't. He happened to. Not enough to buy one, but he "got it".
You're right that Harley has to work within the constraints of what sells. They'd be foolish not to. If McIntosh suddenly started looking like Onkyo they'd lose their market too, even if the Onkyo sounded better.
"Suddenly, I'm not half the man I used to be. 'Cause now I'm an amputee" J. Lennon
It's a very visceral experience
I prefer my "visceral" experience to be in effortless acceleration and deep cornering. I'd probably kill myself with low ground clearance and floorboards.
Not enough to buy one, but he "got it".
Long ago, I really thought I wanted a big V-twin just like everyone else - until I actually rode one. Yeah, they shake and make lots of uneven noise
if that's what you seek! I could achieve that by fouling one of the plugs and removing the sound inserts on the Two Brothers exhaust.
To each his own. :)
That would have been nice.
"Suddenly, I'm not half the man I used to be. 'Cause now I'm an amputee" J. Lennon
It's true I can be brutally honest.
The experience of riding a V-twin reminded me of first hearing McIntosh gear, Bozak and Altec A-7 speakers. I was totally prepared to embrace all of them.
Then the letdown occurred when fantasy met reality. Are you kidding me? I must be missing something.
I guess I'm just not into objects of perceived *image* and performance harkening back to days of yore. I have no interest in listening to or riding anachronisms.
I hear you. European cars still break more than any other car and repairs are very costly.
"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong" H. L. Mencken
My friend told me the cost of Audi's maintenance for slightly over 200k miles was $38.500 in repairs. This has certainly cooled my interest in owning a German car in US. My other friend bought new VW Jetta and the car spent more time in inept american service than on the road. I will buy a Chevy(and another turntable)
European cars still break more than any other car...
Except of course for Porsche which is #2 in JD Power's most recent study behind Lexus.
Ralf
Much of that reliability is in the first few years and this is the funny part about reliability today.
THe difference today between the 1st place car and 30th place car today is like 1 problem per 100 cars.When Ford first came out with the my Ford touch system,so many people had no clue as to how it worked because Ford assumed everyone was tech savvy and they weren't.They would go in and say my car's AC doesn't work or my electric seats don't work or my heated mirrors don't work.The dealer would show them how to use it and there was nothing wrong with the car other than human error.Even tho there was nothing wrong,it still counts as a service complaint so Ford got wise and simplified it.
There aren't too many unreliable cars anymore..They all use the same designers and parts suppliers and trade back and forth.
"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong" H. L. Mencken
There aren't too many unreliable cars anymore.
Your previous point (" European cars still break more than any other car" ) is irrelevant. Not to mention incorrect.
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