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In Reply to: RE: Interesting. Some detail on the Matilda's actual use is a good thing. posted by Timbo in Oz on February 08, 2017 at 20:12:39
I read an interview with a British tanker after the war. He was asked if the two pounder would actually destroy a panzer. He said he didn't know, they never got close enough to one to find out.
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Big speakers and little amps blew my mind!
Follow Ups:
Up until end 1941 the 2pdr was the most powerful small a/tk gun or tank gun - in service - for piercing armour.Even until early 1942.
Better than any of the 37mm's (I'm thinking German and Czech,) and of course far better than the French 25mm, some of which were issued to Australian Infantry in 1941 in Libya.
The 2pdr stayed in service past the time the PzKW IIIs were up-gunned from 37mm to a short 5cm and then some to the L/60 5cm gun. While the PzKw IVs still had the short 75mm.
This happened due to the huge equipment losses in 1940 in France. The 2pdr was in production and the approved and tested 6pdr wasn't, yet. So they went with quantity for a year and a half.
In Nth Africa until end 1942, the only place this mattered, that anti-tank defence now fell quite heavily on the 25pdr Mk1 (18/25pdr) and IIs. Because they could fire a 20lb shot at a reasonably high velocity and their HE shells were quite effective against the early IIIs and IVs. It was a blessing that both 25pdr carriages came with a circular firing platform for firing at moving targets. No other WWII field gun had this rapid traverse feature. IIRC no WWII purpose-built A/Tk guns did either.
(Though 8.8Cm AAA guns, when so used did. But all AA guns of the period had all round traverse.)
Noting that 2pdr equipped tanks destroyed quite a lot of tanks. The decision not to proceed with production of the designed, tested and approved HE round also held the weapon back, when tanks were dealing with enemy A/tk guns.
The consequence was a considerable distortion of the 8th Army's tactical posture and led to the battle-group idea, and the breaking up of most of the Divisions, except ours and NZ's.
Monty stamped on all that, but he could because the 6pdr was available in numbers, and all UK weapons and munitions production was at full speed. And, he soon got 200 Shermans.
6Pdr A/tk-guns and in tanks started to arrive in mid-late 1942. Your 57mm was an exact copy but with the full length barrel. Once UK factories had long enough machines UK guns got the longer barrel, and higher MV.
Back to the Matilda's use in the Pacific war? The 2pdr and 3" Howitzer Matildas remained very effective. Their armour was very good, too. Thicker than a Sherman's.
If you click on Fenderlover's link you can read each page by clicking on it. Recommended.
Warmest
Tim Bailey
Skeptical Measurer & Audio Scrounger
Edits: 02/09/17
Is the Czech made Skoda 47mm AT gun was about the only thing that could successfully penetrate many of the heavy French armored tanks. During the Invasion of France, 1940.The German 37mm gained the rep of being the "door knocker." Rounds just bounced off the same armored tanks.
The Skoda 47mm was hurriedly lashed-up to half-tracks and open top mobile AT tanks. Served through early stages of Barbarossa. Until the long 75mm AT could be implemented.
Edits: 02/09/17
Because it was quite capable against the mass of French tanks, there weren't many Char B1 Bis, and not many Somuas either.The 3.7cm was replaced by the 5cm PAK38 a/tk gun during 1941, which could cope with a T34 under 500Ms with solid shot, but not a KV1 until about 200ms.
Yes, the 7.5cm PAk40 did eventually came along in late 1941, a scaled up 5cm mostly. The Armies in Russia were still not well equipped with them until late 1942, Panzer divisions and the Waffen SS getting them first. PAK38 remained in service throughout WWII.
Warmest
Tim Bailey
Skeptical Measurer & Audio Scrounger
Edits: 02/11/17
I had forgotten that one. They looked weird, a long muzzle braked gun on a carriage with cart wheels, and 180 deg. traverse.They were never used in North Africa, which is germane - ;-) - to the issues around the 2pdr. And, they were never fitted to German tanks.
Tank guns (and A/tk guns used in them) is where we are at.
JBTWay in reading one of the pages the book you have found claims that the Aussie Matilda IIs with 2pdrs did fire explosive shell. But, most of the authorities on this state that the HE shell was never mfd in quantity.
Japanese bunker systems were hard to deal with until tanks were available. And I'd have preferred a Matilda to a Sherman for that job.
A 2pdr firing solid shot would be very good at firing into bunker slits, HV round flat trajectory ...., likely better at that than the 3" howitzer.
Once the slit was opened up though?! Ouch!!! 'Pick and shovel' was what the technique was called by tank crews throughout SEA and the Pacific. Shermans or Matildas. You use mortars / artillery firing HE with super-quick fuses to clear the foliage etc from the bunker, so you can see the slit/s. Then use shot to open up the slit, and then just one HE round. Medium arty usually has too much dispersion to pin-point a heavy round on to a bunker, waste of ammo trying.
IME your own Bn's mortars are good enough IF you have the right fuses.
I would not be surprised if these Aussie SPac. tank units had a higher proportion of Matilda IIs with the 3" howitzer, than the Matilda units in the Middle East, or in France in 1940.
Bunker busting takes a while, until it becomes a known drill, but saves on infantry, which I support ;-)!, and attacks don't get bogged down.
Part of the drill is to map the mutual support aspect of a given bunker system. And, reduce those bunkers that are links - before knocking out the remaining and isolated bunkers. This applies no matter what weapon systems you have / don't have.
A perfect bunker system is theoretically possible and Asians tend to be good at them.
:-)
Warmest
Tim Bailey
Skeptical Measurer & Audio Scrounger
Edits: 02/09/17 02/09/17 02/11/17
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